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Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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Old 11-15-2011, 07:53 AM   #196
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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I don't know what to say....

It's blatently obvious DS won't be able to please all fans at all times. But I was pretty sure most fans after the Zorn failure pretty much wanted a proven HC (and MS is) and wanted "consistancy". Simply throwing everything away yet again after 2yrs (this offseason) or after 3yrs is not, I would guess to be, "consistancy." We need to keep a coaching staff longer then 2-3 yrs, allow them to get the types of players for their system on the team, and keep a QB in the same scheme longer then 2 yrs. Why is P.Manning, E.Manning, Breese, Brady, etc. etc. so succesfull? because they stayed in the same system for more then 2 yrs.
Brady won the Super Bowl in his first year as a starter, and Brees was awesome in his first year in New Orleans. Those guys are so successful, because they're really good.

But the Giants were smart for sticking with Coughlin through some tough years (he can thank the Skins for that). It paid off with a Super Bowl. We should ride it out and let this staff play out their contract.
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Old 11-15-2011, 08:15 AM   #197
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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This is a textbook exercise in excuse making.

When the Lions were 2-10 last year, I don't think a whole lot of people thought that the Lions weren't on the right track. I think Schwartz was starting to get some heat for short term results, but people knew the team was better and they knew that even with the QB out, the Lions were still making positive strides week to week.

I don't know if the Lions are going to make the playoffs in year three, but they already have results. Mike Shanahan has accomplished nothing here in a year and a half. And the idea that Detroit was in better shape three years ago than the Redskins were two years ago is just not accurate.

I think most NFL coaches would be doing a better job here. When you consider just how far the Redskins have fallen short of expectations, I think that's pretty difficult to argue against.
And you cannot deny that Schwartz has had more to work with in the form of a top-five, elite WR who was in place before he got there -- Shanahan didn't. Schwartz has more drafts and more high draft picks -- Shanahan hasn't. Schwartz has had three years to re-build his team -- Shanahan has had one and a half years. It's a complete fallacy to say that Shanahan has had the same tools and the same time that Jim Schwartz has had to rebuild their respective teams.

It is not difficult in the least to make the case that Detroit was on the right track with an emphasis on the draft, a competent general manager who manuevered to get high selections in the drafts to give Jim Schwartz a chance. Shanahan inherited a team that was built with aging, expensive free agents or outright castoffs that other teams had set out on the street corner.

You call it excuse-making, I call it laying out the facts.
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Old 11-15-2011, 08:52 AM   #198
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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I've gathered from this crowdsourcing exercise that the prevailing opinion on Shanahan is that two years of failure isn't enough evidence to overturn the decision to bring him on as head coach + personnel guy.

I haven't heard anyone defend the Redskins as being on the right track.

So basically this is the coaching equivalent of the minutes during a challenge in the NFL where everyone is pretty certain the call on the field wasn't right, but we have to determine whether or not the visual evidence is indisputable. I propose that indisputable evidence is not necessary to make the best possible decision for the game going forward. I also realize I am the minority opinion on that one.
Tripp, I think that your analogy to a challenge is a good one.

But I can't go to your dark side. Although I opposed the MS hire, I think we patiently have to let its process run its course. I can't say that your argument against this strategy is wrong. But it might be and I think we already bought a ticket to see it through to even an ugly end.

If you are right, we need to start a new coach search now, and this also scares me. I don't know that I trust Snyder to hire the right guy. So please tell me: who would Snyder hire as a coach to replace MS and turn things around?

Please notice that the question is not which coach you want. The question is which coach would Snyder realistically hire.
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Old 11-15-2011, 09:09 AM   #199
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

The major mistake that Shanny & Allen made was the McNabb trade. I can't help but think that move was made in part to show the owner that they were trying to win asap (not saying Snyder was "meddling" by any means).

Aside from that move, I give high marks to the personel moves of this regime. We can all point out the many names that came to camp, e.g. W. Parker, L. Johnson, D. Stallworth, but before you criticize those moves, realize they were low cost, low risk. I wanted a QB in last year's draft, but this year's class is looking good & I respect that Shanny didn't like any of the prospects from last draft.

That 3-1 start at the least showed that the team could win when healthy, albeit v. lesser teams for the most part. It raised expectations, but injuries reveal depth or lack thereof. This team is so far away from having quality depth. I don't think you can criticize them too much for that. It will take time, but we've already seen a commitment to the draft, something lacking for years here.
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Old 11-15-2011, 09:10 AM   #200
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

What would you call GTripp with a billion dollars?





A Dan Snyder clone.
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Old 11-15-2011, 09:34 AM   #201
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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Originally Posted by freddyg12 View Post
The major mistake that Shanny & Allen made was the McNabb trade. I can't help but think that move was made in part to show the owner that they were trying to win asap (not saying Snyder was "meddling" by any means).

Aside from that move, I give high marks to the personel moves of this regime. We can all point out the many names that came to camp, e.g. W. Parker, L. Johnson, D. Stallworth, but before you criticize those moves, realize they were low cost, low risk. I wanted a QB in last year's draft, but this year's class is looking good & I respect that Shanny didn't like any of the prospects from last draft.

That 3-1 start at the least showed that the team could win when healthy, albeit v. lesser teams for the most part. It raised expectations, but injuries reveal depth or lack thereof. This team is so far away from having quality depth. I don't think you can criticize them too much for that. It will take time, but we've already seen a commitment to the draft, something lacking for years here.
The mistake, in my opinion, was not the McNabb trade. It was deciding that Rex and Beck were the alternatives should it not work out. Even if McNabb did work out, how long did they realistically expect to have him for? Only team in the NFL last year without at least one QB under 28 years old, if I recall correctly.
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Old 11-15-2011, 09:35 AM   #202
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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Originally Posted by freddyg12 View Post
The major mistake that Shanny & Allen made was the McNabb trade. I can't help but think that move was made in part to show the owner that they were trying to win asap (not saying Snyder was "meddling" by any means).

Aside from that move, I give high marks to the personel moves of this regime. We can all point out the many names that came to camp, e.g. W. Parker, L. Johnson, D. Stallworth, but before you criticize those moves, realize they were low cost, low risk. I wanted a QB in last year's draft, but this year's class is looking good & I respect that Shanny didn't like any of the prospects from last draft.

That 3-1 start at the least showed that the team could win when healthy, albeit v. lesser teams for the most part. It raised expectations, but injuries reveal depth or lack thereof. This team is so far away from having quality depth. I don't think you can criticize them too much for that. It will take time, but we've already seen a commitment to the draft, something lacking for years here.
Agreed. The McNabb trade was a mistake. It's hindsight though. At the time, alot of "experts" thought it was a good trade.

I don't understand all of the criticizing though. It's been a year and a half. I think we had a good draft but unfortunately we've had some big injuries and our depth sucks. That's not MS's fault. He only has so many draft picks.

The Skins were a crappy run franchise for 10+ years that never focused on the future. It's caught up to us. Time to build this right and have some patience.
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Old 11-15-2011, 09:39 AM   #203
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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Originally Posted by freddyg12 View Post
The major mistake that Shanny & Allen made was the McNabb trade. I can't help but think that move was made in part to show the owner that they were trying to win asap (not saying Snyder was "meddling" by any means).

Aside from that move, I give high marks to the personel moves of this regime. We can all point out the many names that came to camp, e.g. W. Parker, L. Johnson, D. Stallworth, but before you criticize those moves, realize they were low cost, low risk. I wanted a QB in last year's draft, but this year's class is looking good & I respect that Shanny didn't like any of the prospects from last draft.

That 3-1 start at the least showed that the team could win when healthy, albeit v. lesser teams for the most part. It raised expectations, but injuries reveal depth or lack thereof. This team is so far away from having quality depth. I don't think you can criticize them too much for that. It will take time, but we've already seen a commitment to the draft, something lacking for years here.
I think Shanahan has a big enough ego that he doesn't suck up to anybody. But the same big ego deluded him into thinking he's some miracle worker. I believe he sincerely thought he could make things happen with Haynesworth and Mcnabb. It was just a gross miscalculation on his part. No more, no less. I think coaches in general just want to win as much as possible as soon as possible, and Shanahan is no different. That's why he went for McNabb.
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Old 11-15-2011, 09:48 AM   #204
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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The mistake, in my opinion, was not the McNabb trade. It was deciding that Rex and Beck were the alternatives should it not work out. Even if McNabb did work out, how long did they realistically expect to have him for? Only team in the NFL last year without at least one QB under 28 years old, if I recall correctly.

He had to have one QB on the roster that had prior experience on the system. I think his biggest mistake so far was the McNabb trade, but it is what it is.
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Old 11-15-2011, 09:51 AM   #205
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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He had to have one QB on the roster that had prior experience on the system. I think his biggest mistake so far was the McNabb trade, but it is what it is.
So that would be Rex...so it goes back to Beck. the biggest mistake is still Beck...with apologies to Slingin Sammy
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Old 11-15-2011, 09:55 AM   #206
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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So that would be Rex...so it goes back to Beck. the biggest mistake is still Beck...with apologies to Slingin Sammy
Considering he got Beck for free, wasn't really a big gamble. Now if he doesn't draft a QB this year......pitchforks and torches!!
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Old 11-15-2011, 09:56 AM   #207
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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So that would be Rex...so it goes back to Beck. the biggest mistake is still Beck...with apologies to Slingin Sammy
how can beck be the biggest mistake? i would say biggest dissapointment or let down, since i think everyone on this board was hoping he would be who shanny sold us on, but we really gave up nothing for him if i remember correctly. i think dmac was way worse because of what we gave up to have him for 12.5 games. either way shanny's track record has taken some serious hits since becoming a redskin
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Old 11-15-2011, 09:59 AM   #208
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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So that would be Rex...so it goes back to Beck. the biggest mistake is still Beck...with apologies to Slingin Sammy
It's tough to scout a player's brain; it's easy to scout their physical tools. Shanahan certainly liked Beck's physical skillset. But when Shanahan was evaluating his mental game, maybe Beck's tape at BYU didn't have him doing all of these panic checkdowns and double clutching. Shanahan might have thought all Beck needed was just needed time to settle into the scheme.
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Old 11-15-2011, 10:08 AM   #209
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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I know "both" QB's suck, it's hard to believe Rex is better then Beck. But as bad as Rex is I have to mention that again I don't think the INT's were all Rex's fault. The first one Hankerson fell down on his route, the second one I watched #10 WR run a slant route right into the LB. Why? I don't know. But instead of taking his route to the inside of the LB he stopped and started running behind the LB/post route looking for an open section of field.

I totally agree Rex should have seen the LB atleast from my perspective but perhaps not from Rex's. Again I don't want it to sound like I'm dismissing Rex's short comings but I couldn't help but think the WR failed to run the right route.
You're far too kind with Rex. He totally stared down Gaffney and as usual, didn't see the coverage underneath.

It's ok to say it, Rex blows.
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Old 11-15-2011, 10:11 AM   #210
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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how can beck be the biggest mistake? i would say biggest dissapointment or let down, since i think everyone on this board was hoping he would be who shanny sold us on, but we really gave up nothing for him if i remember correctly. i think dmac was way worse because of what we gave up to have him for 12.5 games. either way shanny's track record has taken some serious hits since becoming a redskin
I feel like writing some sort of SCP type response...but I was kinda joking about Beck being the biggest mistake. But I would reiterate that I don't think adding McNabb was as big a problem as adding McNabb AND thinking Beck was the potential heir apparent.
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