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Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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Old 11-14-2011, 02:10 PM   #91
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

I think the notion that Mike isn't involved at all in the offense is flawed. He is very involved, but it's Kyle's offense to run. And it will run just fine with a competent and consistent QB. Beck is neither, Grossman is just one of the two.

Selecting a QB (at least one) is of utmost importance. Doesn't necessarily mean a first rounder. They could go the Bengals 2011 draft route.
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Old 11-14-2011, 02:10 PM   #92
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

Quote:
Originally Posted by sportscurmudgeon View Post
Let's review the bidding here:

Jake Plummer improved under Shanahan's tutelage AND THEN he retired from football completely saying that playing QB for Shanahan was a nightmare because Shanahan demanded perfection. Rather than take millions of dollars to finish out his contract, Plummer retired because Shanahan drove him nuts.


The question is this:
Did he win "with" those QBs or did he win "because he had" those QBs?
I thought Jake retired because he was traded to TB since Gruden can never have enough QBs. I remember Plummer being good but he was one of those guys that would throw a bunch of interceptions every now and then. Once Cutler got drafted Plummer's time in Devner was over, as Mike was keeping Cutler on the sidelines until he was ready.

I will say with regards to your question, i agree with you in that he won with those QBs. But the situation here is entirely different and not just because we dont have a decent QB; this isnt Mikes offense, its Kyles. So if we win it will be with Mike but because of Kyle and whoever the QB is, just like we are losing now with Mike because of Kyle and Grossman and Beck. Although the longer Mike stands on the sidelines and doesnt intervene our losing is becoming "because of Mike".
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Old 11-14-2011, 02:15 PM   #93
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

More smack needs to go to MS and KS. Do either of these clowns know how to have the team run a hurry up offense? I just don't get it. Really starting to lose all faith in MS.
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Old 11-14-2011, 02:19 PM   #94
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

Quote:
Originally Posted by sportscurmudgeon View Post
Let's review the bidding here:

Joe Montana had been a QB in the NFL of no small accomplishment for a decade before he met Mike Shanahan.

Steve Young had been in the USFL and the NFL for more than 5 years before he met Mike Shanahan.

John Elway had been in the NFL for more than a decade - - and had gone to the Super Bowl with only average talent around him - - before he met Mike Shanahan.

Jake Plummer improved under Shanahan's tutelage AND THEN he retired from football completely saying that playing QB for Shanahan was a nightmare because Shanahan demanded perfection. Rather than take millions of dollars to finish out his contract, Plummer retired because Shanahan drove him nuts.

Jay Cutler played just well enough in Denver under Shanahan to miss the playoffs a few years and get Shahanan fired.



The question is this:
Did he win "with" those QBs or did he win "because he had" those QBs?
That was the past. What's the guy done the last 5-6 years?
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Old 11-14-2011, 02:20 PM   #95
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

Quote:
Originally Posted by sportscurmudgeon View Post
Let's review the bidding here:

Joe Montana had been a QB in the NFL of no small accomplishment for a decade before he met Mike Shanahan.

Steve Young had been in the USFL and the NFL for more than 5 years before he met Mike Shanahan.

John Elway had been in the NFL for more than a decade - - and had gone to the Super Bowl with only average talent around him - - before he met Mike Shanahan.

Jake Plummer improved under Shanahan's tutelage AND THEN he retired from football completely saying that playing QB for Shanahan was a nightmare because Shanahan demanded perfection. Rather than take millions of dollars to finish out his contract, Plummer retired because Shanahan drove him nuts.

Jay Cutler played just well enough in Denver under Shanahan to miss the playoffs a few years and get Shahanan fired.



The question is this:
Did he win "with" those QBs or did he win "because he had" those QBs?
As mentioned you're mistaken about Plummer's retirement...and you're also wrong about Elway
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Old 11-14-2011, 02:20 PM   #96
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

Quote:
Originally Posted by skinsfan69 View Post
More smack needs to go to MS and KS. Do either of these clowns know how to have the team run a hurry up offense? I just don't get it. Really starting to lose all faith in MS.
A hurry up offense? You want us to go 3 and out quicker and provide even less of a breather for the D?

There isn't a coach alive today you'd have faith in with the time so far allowed to rebuild this team.
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Old 11-14-2011, 02:20 PM   #97
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
I think the notion that Mike isn't involved at all in the offense is flawed. He is very involved, but it's Kyle's offense to run. And it will run just fine with a competent and consistent QB. Beck is neither, Grossman is just one of the two.

Selecting a QB (at least one) is of utmost importance. Doesn't necessarily mean a first rounder. They could go the Bengals 2011 draft route.

But thats true with any offense.

I know youre a big Kyle Shanahan fan, but how would you rank his play calling and game planning? I guess i dont really know what you see in him.
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Old 11-14-2011, 02:26 PM   #98
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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Originally Posted by mlmpetert View Post
But thats true with any offense.

I know youre a big Kyle Shanahan fan, but how would you rank his play calling and game planning? I guess i dont really know what you see in him.
Papa John's should affectionately rename their Monday special "The Kyle" - a plain cheese pizza since they almost never have to throw in free toppings on account of our no-show offense.
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Old 11-14-2011, 02:27 PM   #99
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

It's Monday, and I'm looking to stir the pot a little bit. Does anyone want to present the argument for, "the Skins are moving in the right direction?" What is this being based on?
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Old 11-14-2011, 02:29 PM   #100
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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A hurry up offense? You want us to go 3 and out quicker and provide even less of a breather for the D?

There isn't a coach alive today you'd have faith in with the time so far allowed to rebuild this team.
Jim Schwartz.
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Old 11-14-2011, 02:29 PM   #101
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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Originally Posted by mlmpetert View Post
But thats true with any offense.

I know youre a big Kyle Shanahan fan, but how would you rank his play calling and game planning? I guess i dont really know what you see in him.
Well that's why QB is so important. Someone has to be able to execute the game plan and we don't have that person. Put Aaron Rodgers here and put John Beck in Green Bay and they're not 9-0 and we're not 3-6.

I think KS is inconsistent and I think it's in large part to a) not having a QB he's comfortable with and b) not settling on a secure rotation (though some of those decisions may not be entirely his own).

But I see an offense that gets guys open. That has the potential to move down the field with relative ease, yet there's no conductor for this symphony.

I don't think he has to what it takes, not yet at least, to be a head coach so I wouldn't hope he become our next head coach. But I think he has what it takes to coordinate an offense.
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Old 11-14-2011, 02:34 PM   #102
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SouperMeister View Post
Papa John's should affectionately rename their Monday special "The Kyle" - a plain cheese pizza since they almost never have to throw in free toppings on account of our no-show offense.
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Old 11-14-2011, 02:36 PM   #103
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
Well that's why QB is so important. Someone has to be able to execute the game plan and we don't have that person. Put Aaron Rodgers here and put John Beck in Green Bay and they're not 9-0 and we're not 3-6.

I think KS is inconsistent and I think it's in large part to a) not having a QB he's comfortable with and b) not settling on a secure rotation (though some of those decisions may not be entirely his own).

But I see an offense that gets guys open. That has the potential to move down the field with relative ease, yet there's no conductor for this symphony.

I don't think he has to what it takes, not yet at least, to be a head coach so I wouldn't hope he become our next head coach. But I think he has what it takes to coordinate an offense.
I see that he gets guys open, too. But someone who designs nice pass plays is a "play designer," not "offensive coordinator." To be the latter also requires play calling and scheming which is suitable to your talent.

I am not on the "fire Kyle" bandwagon. But to me, this year he has been a great play designer but poor offensive coordinator.
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Old 11-14-2011, 03:04 PM   #104
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Fair point
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Old 11-14-2011, 03:15 PM   #105
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Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

I think Shanahan knew what he was getting into when starting the season with Grossman and Beck. The McNabb experiment bombed miserably, and he did not want to do that again with another veteran QB. He said the right things in the media to prop up the hopes that one of these guys would emerge as the man who would keep the seat warm until he could draft a QB he wants to run his system. It's completely blown up in his face, and going back to Grossman this week is the sure fire way of telling us he's throwing in the towel and evaluating talent...at least that's the way I see it. That being said, he's gets the smackdown for telling us last week that Beck was the guy and then starting Grossman.

Fred Davis. I imagine the talks of Cooley getting traded will slowly fade away. Davis is not ready for prime time. Not sure if it's laziness or what, but he never seems to complete routes and the drops are absolutely killing momentum. He's got the talent, but it seems his head is getting the way.

Not starting Helu. One of the bright spots of last week's awful loss was Helu's work out of the backfield, to only get benched a week later to a guy who managed 2 yards per carry against a so-so run defense. I think Helu earned the starting job and should be the starter unless he gets hurt.

As far as Gano is concerned, yes he missed 2 FGs, but the Dan Carpenter missed from a comparable distance on the same end of the field...not an excuse, and Gano's lucky those 2 misses didn't amount to a hill of beans since this offense cannot generate TDs.
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