What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins

Paintrain · 01-18-2012, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redskin29633

By "spread package" I assume you mean something that involves using the shotgun formation. I'm just not sure the Shanahans modify the offense for anyone, not even RGIII. I can forsee the use of more rollouts and bootlegs, maybe even using the shotgun in slected down and distance situations, but not a wholesale change to that kind of system. Also Flynn is unrestricted FA and his acquisition will not involve the transfer of draft picks to Green Bay, so you get your wish on that one.

This is a pretty big myth, Shanahan has modified his offense plenty through the years.. Elway was mobile, Griese was a pocket passer, Plummer was a scrambler, Cutler more pocket, McNabb pocket (because he couldn't throw on the run anymore), Grossman pocket.. He adapts to the talent playing the position.

irish · 01-18-2012, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redskin29633

You make an excellent point. To me this just shows why Redskins should NOT put all their eggs in the QB basket! Redskins would be better served following the 49ers post-Smith plan, versus implementing the draft an "exceptional QB" plan. Ironically, the acquisition of Flynn may allow them to do just that by not giving up much needed draft picks to get the "could be but not sure" great QB in the 2012 draft.

That's pretty much what Lorenzo Alexander said last night on Ch 4. He liked the idea of getting Flynn and holding onto the picks instead of dumping a bunch of picks into drafting a QB.

redskin29633 · 01-18-2012, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paintrain

This is a pretty big myth, Shanahan has modified his offense plenty through the years.. Elway was mobile, Griese was a pocket passer, Plummer was a scrambler, Cutler more pocket, McNabb pocket (because he couldn't throw on the run anymore), Grossman pocket.. He adapts to the talent playing the position.

All good points, but there needs to be a codicil. In all of those situations, Shanahan was simply not forcing guys into some system that they could not handle. He may indeed decide to draft RGIII, but I just don't believe you will see modifications to the offense beyond those I itemized (more rollouts and bootlegs with some limited situational shotgun plays).

skinsfaninok · 01-18-2012, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SBXVII

Here is a nice write up.

2012 NFL Free Agent Profile: Matt Flynn - Hogs Haven

Good read

#Hail to the Redskins

REDSKINS4ever · 01-19-2012, 08:09 AM

This is my take on Matt Flynn. The guy is overrated. He has played admiringly great in the two games that he's replaced Aaron Rogers to run the first team offense. But against the Patriots last year and the Lions this year, that's only two games. The guy has not been a legitimate starter and you can't properly evaluate a back up quarterback based on what he did in just two lousy games.

Secondly, as a lot of people would agree, a free agent signing of a QB is not how you win in the NFL. In the last seven Super Bowls, a first round draft choice has played quarterback. If anything, that alone should be the standard for drafting your own QB. A free agent QB will always be hit or miss while a quarterback drafted in the first round is almost always a hit. In today's NFL, only a first round selection at quarterback guarantees success at that position.

CultBrennan59 · 01-19-2012, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by REDSKINS4ever

This is my take on Matt Flynn. The guy is overrated. He has played admiringly great in the two games that he's replaced Aaron Rogers to run the first team offense. But against the Patriots last year and the Lions this year, that's only two games. The guy has not been a legitimate starter and you can't properly evaluate a back up quarterback based on what he did in just two lousy games.

Secondly, as a lot of people would agree, a free agent signing of a QB is not how you win in the NFL. In the last seven Super Bowls, a first round draft choice has played quarterback. If anything, that alone should be the standard for drafting your own QB. A free agent QB will always be hit or miss while a quarterback drafted in the first round is almost always a hit. In today's NFL, only a first round selection at quarterback guarantees success at that position.

Drew Brees won it, he was a free agent signing, and Kurt Warner went there as a FA to Arizona

Mattyk · 01-19-2012, 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by REDSKINS4ever

This is my take on Matt Flynn. The guy is overrated. He has played admiringly great in the two games that he's replaced Aaron Rogers to run the first team offense. But against the Patriots last year and the Lions this year, that's only two games. The guy has not been a legitimate starter and you can't properly evaluate a back up quarterback based on what he did in just two lousy games.

Secondly, as a lot of people would agree, a free agent signing of a QB is not how you win in the NFL. In the last seven Super Bowls, a first round draft choice has played quarterback. If anything, that alone should be the standard for drafting your own QB. A free agent QB will always be hit or miss while a quarterback drafted in the first round is almost always a hit. In today's NFL, only a first round selection at quarterback guarantees success at that position.

Sorry but you're wrong on both counts.

As CB59 has already mentioned Brees was a free agent in NO, and was orginally a 2nd round pick.

We've had our share of first rounders come through here, that alone should show you that a first round QB is far from any sort of guarantee for success.

artmonkforhallofamein07 · 01-19-2012, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by REDSKINS4ever

This is my take on Matt Flynn. The guy is overrated. He has played admiringly great in the two games that he's replaced Aaron Rogers to run the first team offense. But against the Patriots last year and the Lions this year, that's only two games. The guy has not been a legitimate starter and you can't properly evaluate a back up quarterback based on what he did in just two lousy games.

Secondly, as a lot of people would agree, a free agent signing of a QB is not how you win in the NFL. In the last seven Super Bowls, a first round draft choice has played quarterback. If anything, that alone should be the standard for drafting your own QB. A free agent QB will always be hit or miss while a quarterback drafted in the first round is almost always a hit. In today's NFL, only a first round selection at quarterback guarantees success at that position.

It is still more like 50/50. Look just at last years draft for comparison. It is not that easy to get a QB.

SmootSmack · 01-19-2012, 09:47 AM

In his defense, I think he just said a first round pick has played in the Super Bowl, not necessarily won. As have 2nd round picks, 6th round picks and FAs of course.

GTripp0012 · 01-19-2012, 10:52 AM

You can win the super bowl with a free agent pickup at QB, you just can't win it with a third or fourth rate FA signing at quarterback.

NC_Skins · 01-19-2012, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

You can win the super bowl with a free agent pickup at QB, you just can't win it with a third or fourth rate FA signing at quarterback.

Trent Dilfer disagrees. :cheeky-sm

REDSKINS4ever · 01-19-2012, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CultBrennan59

Drew Brees won it, he was a free agent signing, and Kurt Warner went there as a FA to Arizona

As I said, hit or miss. But how often does that happen? Very rarely. Warner won the Super Bowl in 1999 and lost it on 2008. Brees won it in 2009. Warner was not a free agent pick up coming from another team. He signed from off of the street without any NFL experience. As far as Brees goes, the Chargers did get a draft pick later from New Orleans as compensation. Brees was released due to the Chargers having spent a #1 draft pick on Phillip Rivers and Brees was coming off a career threatening shoulder injury.

From 2004 until 2010, a first round draft choice played quarterback in the Super Bowl. Anyway you put it, three first round draft choice QBs remain active in the playoffs which means one of them or two of them will be in the Super Bowl again for the 8th straight year.

REDSKINS4ever · 01-19-2012, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mattyk

Sorry but you're wrong on both counts.

As CB59 has already mentioned Brees was a free agent in NO, and was orginally a 2nd round pick.

We've had our share of first rounders come through here, that alone should show you that a first round QB is far from any sort of guarantee for success.

You and several others completely misquoted me. I didn't say that Drew Brees, who was a 2nd round selection, and Kurt Warner, who was a free agent, didn't play in the Super Bowl. Anything other than a frachise QB either hit or miss as a said in my initial post.

I said nothing about the Redskins or their mess of quarterbacks under the Turner, Schottenheimer, Spurrier, Gibbs II, Zorn, and Shanahan regimes. I said nothing about that either. Again, you misquoted me.

I simply stated that the fact that during the last 7 Super Bowls, there has been a first round selection at quarterback that has played in the big game. Not necessarily won it but played in it. And there will be for the 8th straight Super Bowl one or two first round draft choices that will play in the Super Bowl in a few weeks.

So, most of the time, a first round draft choice playing quarterback is guaranteed success more so than a free agent QB or even a QB selected anywhere between the 2nd and 7th round of the draft.

Now, please quote me.

sportscurmudgeon · 01-19-2012, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by REDSKINS4ever

As I said, hit or miss. But how often does that happen? Very rarely. Warner won the Super Bowl in 1999 and lost it on 2008. Brees won it in 2009. Warner was not a free agent pick up coming from another team. He signed from off of the street without any NFL experience. As far as Brees goes, the Chargers did get a draft pick later from New Orleans as compensation. Brees was released due to the Chargers having spent a #1 draft pick on Phillip Rivers and Brees was coming off a career threatening shoulder injury.

From 2004 until 2010, a first round draft choice played quarterback in the Super Bowl. Anyway you put it, three first round draft choice QBs remain active in the playoffs which means one of them or two of them will be in the Super Bowl again for the 8th straight year.

You cannot argue with data; you are absolutely correct.

Here is some more data you cannot argue with. Here are first round QB picks over the last decade or so who have been "less than satisfactory":

Tim Couch
Akili Smith
Duante Culpepper (injury ended his career early)
Cade McNown
David Carr
Joey Harrington
Patrick Ramsey (fondly remembered around here...)
Byron Leftwich (not horrible but not great either)
Kyle Boller
Rex Grossman (you already have a first round pick in town; why worry about getting another one)
JP Losman
Jason Campbell (Skins ditched that first round pick...)
Vince Young
Matt Leinart
JaMarcus Russell
Brady Quinn

The data say that you can find great QBs in the first round AND that you can find mediocre QBs in the first round AND that you can find QBs that just cannot play in the first round.

skinsfaninok · 01-19-2012, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sportscurmudgeon

You cannot argue with data; you are absolutely correct.

Here is some more data you cannot argue with. Here are first round QB picks over the last decade or so who have been "less than satisfactory":

Tim Couch
Akili Smith
Duante Culpepper (injury ended his career early)
Cade McNown
David Carr
Joey Harrington
Patrick Ramsey (fondly remembered around here...)
Byron Leftwich (not horrible but not great either)
Kyle Boller
Rex Grossman (you already have a first round pick in town; why worry about getting another one)
JP Losman
Jason Campbell (Skins ditched that first round pick...)
Vince Young
Matt Leinart
JaMarcus Russell
Brady Quinn

The data say that you can find great QBs in the first round AND that you can find mediocre QBs in the first round AND that you can find QBs that just cannot play in the first round.

And there is no sure thing that luck won't be on this list or rg3

#HTTR

01-19-2012, 08:09 AM	#335
REDSKINS4ever The Starter Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Born and raised in D.C. and now lives in Harlem, New York Posts: 2,036	Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins This is my take on Matt Flynn. The guy is overrated. He has played admiringly great in the two games that he's replaced Aaron Rogers to run the first team offense. But against the Patriots last year and the Lions this year, that's only two games. The guy has not been a legitimate starter and you can't properly evaluate a back up quarterback based on what he did in just two lousy games. Secondly, as a lot of people would agree, a free agent signing of a QB is not how you win in the NFL. In the last seven Super Bowls, a first round draft choice has played quarterback. If anything, that alone should be the standard for drafting your own QB. A free agent QB will always be hit or miss while a quarterback drafted in the first round is almost always a hit. In today's NFL, only a first round selection at quarterback guarantees success at that position. Last edited by REDSKINS4ever; 01-19-2012 at 08:14 AM.

01-19-2012, 09:47 AM	#339
SmootSmack The Bluths Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 43,220	Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins In his defense, I think he just said a first round pick has played in the Super Bowl, not necessarily won. As have 2nd round picks, 6th round picks and FAs of course. __________________ You're So Vain...You Probably Think This Sig Is About You

01-19-2012, 10:52 AM	#340
GTripp0012 Living Legend Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Grand Rapids, MI Age: 25 Posts: 15,152	Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins You can win the super bowl with a free agent pickup at QB, you just can't win it with a third or fourth rate FA signing at quarterback. __________________ Shanahan: “The bad thing is he's [Sav Rocca] probably our best offensive weapon and that’s not good.”

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