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QB Combo Possibilities: Which Do You Want (QB Rumors: Verse 10)

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View Poll Results: Which QB Combo Do You Want
Griffin/Grossman 103 83.06%
Orton/Tannehill 5 4.03%
Manning/Cousins 14 11.29%
Weeden/J.Johnson 2 1.61%
Hoyer/Foles 0 0%
Voters: 124. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 03-02-2012, 09:00 AM   #196
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Re: QB Combo Possibilities: Which Do You Want (QB Rumors: Verse 10)

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
I'm increasingly getting the impression that what I heard the first few months of all this is the real story re: our interest in RG3. It maybe it's that I got burned at the very last minute by a usually extremely reliable source re: Gabbert that I'm now hesitant
Who's to say that intel was wrong? Three of the ES insiders had made the exact same claim you did last year. Maybe they just got a offer the couldn't refuse and decided the extra players were worth more than what they had Gabbert rated as. Either that or they are putting info out there for the sole purpose of throwing people off.
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Old 03-02-2012, 09:07 AM   #197
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Re: QB Combo Possibilities: Which Do You Want (QB Rumors: Verse 10)

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Originally Posted by EARTHQUAKE2689 View Post
And the fact that we could get one by giving up what would be in value: Laron Landry (1st round) Roger Crawford (2nd round) Leonard Hankerson (3rd round) and Roy Helu (4th round) is amazing.
Or we could be giving up Charles Rogers (1st round), Taylor Jacobs (2nd round), Chad Rinehart (3rd round) and Dallas Sartz (4th round). That's the thing with draft picks, how many you have is far less relevant than how you use them.

As badly as we shredded the Vinny era (with damn good reasons), how many of the picks we traded away turned into a valued player? We were just cursed with making bad choices with the picks we had in addition to trading some away. There's no guarantee on any draft able player but it seems like the bust potential for RGIII is relatively low.
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Old 03-02-2012, 09:18 AM   #198
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Re: QB Combo Possibilities: Which Do You Want (QB Rumors: Verse 10)

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Originally Posted by NC_Skins View Post
Who's to say that intel was wrong? Three of the ES insiders had made the exact same claim you did last year. Maybe they just got a offer the couldn't refuse and decided the extra players were worth more than what they had Gabbert rated as. Either that or they are putting info out there for the sole purpose of throwing people off.
Who knows for sure. I had thought since mid-October DE/OLB (kept thinking Quinn specifically) and was told the interest in Gabbert was zero...then suddenly a source close to Kyle Shanahan says otherwise and everything flips.

Anyway, I've got information overload right now
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Old 03-02-2012, 09:19 AM   #199
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Re: QB Combo Possibilities: Which Do You Want (QB Rumors: Verse 10)

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Or we could be giving up Charles Rogers (1st round), Taylor Jacobs (2nd round), Chad Rinehart (3rd round) and Dallas Sartz (4th round). That's the thing with draft picks, how many you have is far less relevant than how you use them.

As badly as we shredded the Vinny era (with damn good reasons), how many of the picks we traded away turned into a valued player? We were just cursed with making bad choices with the picks we had in addition to trading some away. There's no guarantee on any draft able player but it seems like the bust potential for RGIII is relatively low.
Reminds me of a brainless trade made in 2008. Jason Taylor for a 3rd round draft choice makes me mad even now. I'm so glad Cerratto isn't our GM anymore.
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Old 03-02-2012, 09:22 AM   #200
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Re: QB Combo Possibilities: Which Do You Want (QB Rumors: Verse 10)

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You can certainly understand the desire though. Franchise QB's make teams contenders year in and year out. They also cover up deficiencies when the rest of your team struggles. It's quite the paradox. Infinitly easier to find grunt and supporting players then it is to find a franchise QB but it's much easier to find a franchise QB then it is to put together 30 or so regular supporting players needed to be a contender with a game manager at QB.

I mean I look at the Jets, the model that so many people here wanted to follow with their dominant offensive line, running game, and defense coupled with an average QB. Now that team is falling apart. It's so hard to keep it going with that big supporting cast, as someone is always getting injured or aging to fast, then it is with a QB that can change games a la RG3.

I'm going to stick with my mantra. Quality over quantity. Just because the no-RG3 plans means we get 3 or 4 extra Day 1 and 2 players doesn't mean we're going to be better off.

I understand the desire and want a franchise QB also, my play on words is none of those are franchise QB's other then PM right now. The others either are not franchise QB's yet or never will be. So everytime I hear "I want us to get a franchise QB" my immediate thought is then you must want PM cause RGIII has done nothing as of yet to warrant the "franchise" tag. Projected or not.
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Old 03-02-2012, 09:26 AM   #201
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Re: QB Combo Possibilities: Which Do You Want (QB Rumors: Verse 10)

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And the fact that we could get one by giving up what would be in value: Laron Landry (1st round) Roger Crawford (2nd round) Leonard Hankerson (3rd round) and Roy Helu (4th round) is amazing.
Maybe someone else asked this...but who is Roger Crawford?
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Old 03-02-2012, 09:27 AM   #202
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Re: QB Combo Possibilities: Which Do You Want (QB Rumors: Verse 10)

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Reminds me of a brainless trade made in 2008. Jason Taylor for a 3rd round draft choice makes me mad even now. I'm so glad Cerratto isn't our GM anymore.
Just to make you madder, it was actually a second round pick, which the Dolphins used to draft......Pat White out of West Virginia. Kinda reinforces my point about other teams wasting our picks rather than us wasting them under Cerrato.
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Old 03-02-2012, 09:30 AM   #203
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Re: QB Combo Possibilities: Which Do You Want (QB Rumors: Verse 10)

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I get the Manning talk.. he's not Brad Johnson, McNabb, etc... but he's at best a few year guy causing us to once again change our offense.... and at worst a one game and done QB... and with the season starting WELL after the draft you don't have the luxury of knowing... so if we can't keep him... we are in the SAME spot next year... either way by the next two years we need to find a FRANCHISE QB. We should only get Manning if we KNOW it means SB. In all of his years, with better teams than us by far, they didn't win the super bowl more than once. Someone explain to me how he would add anything bit 1) a backup QB taking over for him or 2) (the better scenario) he leads us to better records, we have worse draft picks, and he is still gone...

Call me stupid but if we draft a QB first round the next FIVE years we end up with a QB that will be here longer than Peyton...
I'm sorry your going to have to help me out. This is like the second time I've seen this perhaps from you perhaps not but I just don't understand what the Skins will have to change? I see us needing to get better with the OL, and needing better blocking, but thats a given for whoever takes the QB position even if it's RGIII.

The worse case scenario I see is PM coming here and having to learn the play calls and getting on page with the WR's here. I believe there will be a small hickup until he is familiar with the system and familiar with the WR's.
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Old 03-02-2012, 09:37 AM   #204
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Re: QB Combo Possibilities: Which Do You Want (QB Rumors: Verse 10)

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This is still a great thread.

I suspect RGIII carries far higher bust potential than most believe him to carry. He's a highly mobile QB from a basic college offensive system and, more importantly IMO, it's unclear if his hearts in the game. Can he eat, sleep and breath for the game 46 weeks each year? Wasn't it just a cpl/few months ago he was considering a law degree and putting pro football on hold? Really? Really?? It's pro friggin football and you wanna be the next Johnny Cochran...what fine chap you are indeed, sir!!!

I hope there isn't a $ limit on PM. Peyton's never struck me as an unreasonable guy, so he'll accept there's "consensus" idea what he's worth in the market. We should beat that number by a few hundred thousand. The real ? is whether Peyton wants to sign here i.e. does he believe this bidding team, right now, gives him the best opportunity to win right now? I'll be ecstatic if he dons the Burgundy and Gold!!!

I'll put it on a t-shirt: Peyton Manning: We're not ****in around anymore!!!
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I'm in your camp but not so much about his heart. Hell he can play football while getting his law degree and racking up the $$$. My issue is the Skins giving up all those picks, and having extremely high expectations for him and what if he has trouble transitioning from the spread offense to a NFL offense? What if he has trouble reading defenses? What if the coaching staff gets all worked up over trying to change his throwing motion like McNabb's footwork and RGIII does not play as well? What happens if RGIII has trouble getting past his first read or it's just a major hickup with him that might take a few to several yrs for him to overcome?
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Old 03-02-2012, 09:42 AM   #205
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Re: QB Combo Possibilities: Which Do You Want (QB Rumors: Verse 10)

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I'm in your camp but not so much about his heart. Hell he can play football while getting his law degree and racking up the $$$. My issue is the Skins giving up all those picks, and having extremely high expectations for him and what if he has trouble transitioning from the spread offense to a NFL offense? What if he has trouble reading defenses? What if the coaching staff gets all worked up over trying to change his throwing motion like McNabb's footwork and RGIII does not play as well? What happens if RGIII has trouble getting past his first read or it's just a major hickup with him that might take a few to several yrs for him to overcome?
Seems that you're so worried about everything that could go wrong, but what if the guy is the real deal and a QB you can hang your hat on as a franchise for the next decade?

Life is about taking chances, I'd rather roll the dice than be paralyzed by over-analysis.

Every QB coming out of college has things to work on, but someone with his physical tools, character, and intelligence, that's a pretty good basis on which to start.
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Old 03-02-2012, 09:44 AM   #206
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Re: QB Combo Possibilities: Which Do You Want (QB Rumors: Verse 10)

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I understand the desire and want a franchise QB also, my play on words is none of those are franchise QB's other then PM right now. The others either are not franchise QB's yet or never will be. So everytime I hear "I want us to get a franchise QB" my immediate thought is then you must want PM cause RGIII has done nothing as of yet to warrant the "franchise" tag. Projected or not.
I don't want Manning because at 36, having missed a season of playing and regular work outs and training, 4 neck surgeries, having been a franchise quarterback and being one are two different things. RG3 is 22 years old. He is a triple A. Athletic, Accurate, Articulate. I would rather roll the dice on a guy that can have a 10 year future for this team, than an old injured one that has a 2 year future with us. Especially if for the reason you state "he is a franchise QB". That can easily and quickly become "was a franchise QB".
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Old 03-02-2012, 09:45 AM   #207
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Re: QB Combo Possibilities: Which Do You Want (QB Rumors: Verse 10)

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Here's the thing though about RG3 compared to the QB's we've been looking at in the draft the last few years. This is not only the first one where 90%+ is willing to trade up to get him, but probably the first QB ever where people are on board with the possibility of giving up multiple first to get him. Nothing remotely close to that happened with Sanchez, Bradford, or Gabbert. Heck people would have flipped if we gave up a second round pick to move up for Gabbert last year.

Either way RGIII is not your average prospect. I'm looking at the drafts over the past decade and I don't think I can find one besides this year where he wouldn't have been the number 1 QB off the board. To think that there are two prospects in the same draft like Luck and RG3, it's amazing.

I mean think about these QB's on draft day

2011 - Cam Newton
2010 - Sam Bradford
2009 - Matt Stafford
2008 - Matt Ryan
2007 - JaWalrus Russell
2006 - Vince Young
2005 - Alex Smith
2004 - Eli Manning
2003 - Carson Palmer
2002 - David Carr
2001 - Michael Vick
2000 - Chad Pennington
1999 - Tim Couch
1998 - Peyton Manning

We have to go back 8 years to find a better draft day prospect then Robert Griffin. Then you have to go back another 6 years (both guys are named Manning). Take that wait till next year crowd.
Thats a nice hindesight look at things and I'd agree with you. But put yourself in the days leading up to those drafts during each year and you'll see fans and teams talking similarly to how everyone here talks about RGIII. I can remember last year Jake Locker was supposed to be the 1, after the Combine Newton looked good. Fans and teams were "hey we should give up the farm for one of them." I can remember fans talking about how Russell and Young were the best things since sliced bread and we should "do whatever it takes to get them" at the time.

Which is another reason I'm not a fan of loosing the draft picks and reaching to get him. 1 pick for one player I'd take him in a heart beat. But as we know thats not how the "chart" works or supply and demand.
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Old 03-02-2012, 09:49 AM   #208
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Re: QB Combo Possibilities: Which Do You Want (QB Rumors: Verse 10)

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Look at your list you are also showing that there is a 50/50 chance this won't work .Out of your list there are only 3 Super bowl QB's on the list (I don't count Carr)
Yeah the blinded "I'm despirate for a franchise QB", RGIII is it, fan fails to notice what your talking about.
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Old 03-02-2012, 09:51 AM   #209
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Re: QB Combo Possibilities: Which Do You Want (QB Rumors: Verse 10)

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Thats a nice hindesight look at things and I'd agree with you. But put yourself in the days leading up to those drafts during each year and you'll see fans and teams talking similarly to how everyone here talks about RGIII. I can remember last year Jake Locker was supposed to be the 1, after the Combine Newton looked good. Fans and teams were "hey we should give up the farm for one of them." I can remember fans talking about how Russell and Young were the best things since sliced bread and we should "do whatever it takes to get them" at the time.

Which is another reason I'm not a fan of loosing the draft picks and reaching to get him. 1 pick for one player I'd take him in a heart beat. But as we know thats not how the "chart" works or supply and demand.
Locker was not going #1, not sure why you keep saying that.

And after the combine Newton actually looked like crap, at least when it came to his throwing.
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Old 03-02-2012, 09:55 AM   #210
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Re: QB Combo Possibilities: Which Do You Want (QB Rumors: Verse 10)

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I don't think going or winning a SB necessarily makes you a great or bad QB there are to many other variables in the formula to sole say the team made or didn't make the SB becasue of it's QB play.
I don't think SB play is even a thought. Simply look at that list and pick how many really good QB's are in it. I'm with Giantone, there are only about 3 so far. Atleast for right now. You could possibly add Newton but it's hard to make a decision off of one year. Bradford could get better but I just don't see it which is a reason I don't want us trading for him.
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