Redskins Add WRs Pierre Garcon and Joshua Morgan

EARTHQUAKE2689 · 03-20-2012, 11:00 PM

Jarvis will be good.

SirClintonPortis · 03-20-2012, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EARTHQUAKE2689

Hankerson 1,150 yards 7 TDs
Garcon 800 yards 5 TDs
Morgan 600 yards 3 TDs
Davis 700 yards 5 TDs

Hankerson going over 1000 yards is...not likely. Dude always takes his time before you go "WOW!" and his recovery from his injury had a late start because they delayed the surgery, hoping that they wouldn't have to perform the surgery. Maybe next year. Garçon has a better shot at 1000 yards if he indeed takes over for Moss.

skinsfaninok · 03-20-2012, 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EARTHQUAKE2689

Gaffney: Another team Cooley: 500 or so, I'm being too nice on Hankerson, I just think he is going to be that guy but non homerism:

Hankerson 900 yards 7 TDs
Davis 800 4 TDs
Garcon 700 yards 5 TDs
Cooley 450 yards 3 TDs
Morgan 400 2 TDs

everyone else: 450 yards 2 TDs

We did throw for nearly 4k with the garbage of QBs this year.

switch garcon and hank

30gut · 03-20-2012, 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SirClintonPortis

We know what Gaffney and Moss provides, but it isn't much anyway...Expecting a "second wind" from a WR nearing 33 years of age is a course of action that will lead to disappointment......it is not unreasonable to expect him to play at a higher level than he did last year and be better than Brown.

I feel like we're going in circles now where you devalue Moss and Gaffney's actual production while talking up heretofore unseen production from a UDFA rooke RT and a drastically underperforming and injured RT.
My point is simple net-net Gaffney and Moss are better WRs then Willie Smith and Jammal Brown are RTs.
I don't see how anyone can say they know what Gaffney and Moss provide and say its not much when compared against the level of play at the RT position.

2011
Jabar Gaffney 68 catches 947 yards 5 tds
Pierre Garcon 70 catches 947 yards 6 tds
Santana Moss 48 catches 548 yards 4 tds (missed 4 games with a broken hand)
Moss's 2010 season (then one where he didn't break his hand like this year) 93 catches(top 10), 1,115 yards(top 10) 6 tds

Quote:

Originally Posted by SCP

I would like a little clarification as to what specific points are you trying to establish with the use of the stat of DYAR and DVOA. As in what is this stat supposed to tell me specifically.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 30gut

I understand your point here but I'm not using FBO to predict anything.
I posted the their stats as a reference.
And of course FBO metric has limitation every stat does but the limits you address apply to Garcon and Morgan just like the apply for Moss and Gaffney

The stats are for reference.
For example when you say that Moss/Gaffney don't provide much you can look refer to the stats and see there actual production numbers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SCP

I believe there is no conclusive way to use DYAR as a solid estimator for the how good a reciever is

Me too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SCP

...So now we're back to talking physical impact after leaving the lovely ivory tower of blind statisical inferences?

Actually the only one making blind statistical inferences is you.
I posted the stats you made assumptions and inferences based on the stats.

Quote:

Originally Posted by my actual post

Football Outsiders ranks our passing offense:22th
Jabbar Gaffney ranks 33rd in DYAR and 48th in DVOA which is actually ahead of newly signed P.Garcon 81st and 78th respectively.
Interestingly enough the injured S.Moss DYAR/DVOA 80th DYAR/79th DVOA, rival Garcon.

Quote:

I'd like a RT too, but we are not in a position to sit back and relax at the state of our WR corps either, especially two years from now, when Gaffney cross that threshold into the realm of unproductiveness(33 years of age) and we only have Leonard Hankerson's game against Miami to say it's not a problem.

Who said anything about sitting back and relaxing about our WR corps? I surely did not:

Quote:

Originally Posted by 30gut

I would have been just as happy with Early Doucet or Harry Douglas and saved some of that 21 mil/42mil/5

So again, simply put I think addressing the RT position this offseason with a proven quality starter provides greater benefit to our rookie QB then adding a couple of 2nd tier WRs with upside.
Or as i've stated previously:

Quote:

Originally Posted by 30gut

Did the signing of Garcon and Morgan improve the WR corps? Yes.
But, again for me I think RT more so they any other position on offense was the weakest link on our starting 11.
I'm an oldschool type guy and I think physical superiority at the point of attack is the single most successful way to improve an offense.
I think finding a definitive upgrade at the RT position, more then any else, would be the most beneficial to support a rookie QB.
If people expect a Cam Newtonesque season from Griffin people shouldn't overlook the quality of Newton's OL.

EARTHQUAKE2689 · 03-20-2012, 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

switch garcon and hank

I'll keep it this way for now.

los panda · 03-20-2012, 11:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 30gut

I feel like...
...stated previously:

how long did that take?

30gut · 03-20-2012, 11:58 PM

I'll play too:

Garcon 1,000
Davis 800
Moss 700
Morgan 600
Gaffney 500
Hankerson 200
Helu 400

DynamiteRave · 03-21-2012, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 30gut

I'll play too:

Garcon 1,000
Davis 800
Moss 700
Morgan 600
Gaffney 500
Hankerson 200
Helu 400

Ouch. Interesting you add Moss though since I think almost everyone has written him off as a goner.

EARTHQUAKE2689 · 03-21-2012, 12:06 AM

That's 4k plus and ouch on Hank, I think Moss's age is what hurts him.

skinsfaninok · 03-21-2012, 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DynamiteRave

Ouch. Interesting you add Moss though since I think almost everyone has written him off as a goner.

Well that's w royal but now I see moss staying

DynamiteRave · 03-21-2012, 12:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EARTHQUAKE2689

That's 4k plus and ouch on Hank, I think Moss's age is what hurts him.

Gaffney's around the same age though. I think he's only a year younger.

EARTHQUAKE2689 · 03-21-2012, 12:14 AM

yeah he is and I have both of them gone.

DynamiteRave · 03-21-2012, 12:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EARTHQUAKE2689

yeah he is and I have both of them gone.

lol well that's fair. I'll never agree with Gaffney staying and Moss going. If anything they both need the boot.

Haha. I had it backwards.

30gut · 03-21-2012, 12:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DynamiteRave

Ouch. Interesting you add Moss though since I think almost everyone has written him off as a goner.

For the life of me I don't understand why everyone has written Moss off.
Dude played through a broken hand this year and is only one year removed from a top 10 season in catches and yards.
And Moss knows this offense and plays a lot in the slot.
I'll bet Moss will become Griffin safety blanket.

I think Hankerson is a talented receiver but he's a 2nd year receiver coming off a major injury, he's still adjusting to the league and to the offense.
Garcon, Morgan, Moss, Davis, Gaffney are all pro's that either know the scheme or have already earned there stripes as NFL WRs.
Hankerson is gonna have an uphill battle for reps and playing time.
There's gonna be stiff competition in the WRs corps at training camp.

Dirtbag59 · 03-21-2012, 12:35 AM

I would rather have a bunch of 800 yard receivers anyway then one 1,000 yard receiver, unless of course you gave me a Fitzgerald, Johnson, or well Johnson. Almost always better in theory when the opposing defense has to spread out and cover everyone rather then keying in on one guy. A lot like the setup the Packers have going right now.

Also in regards to developing QB's sometimes have a true number 1 can stunt a guys development (a la Culpepper) or allow him to break out (a la Schuab and for now Stafford).

03-20-2012, 11:00 PM	#811
EARTHQUAKE2689 You did WHAT?!? Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: In The Kitchen With Dyna. Age: 24 Posts: 11,036	Re: Redskins Add WRs Pierre Garcon and Joshua Morgan Jarvis will be good. __________________ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpp3ycMvQd0 This is why you need Mentos. To justify your questionable problem solving skills. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z7geP5ev0VI Awesome isn't it.

03-20-2012, 11:58 PM	#817
30gut The Starter Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 2,075	Re: Redskins Add WRs Pierre Garcon and Joshua Morgan I'll play too: Garcon 1,000 Davis 800 Moss 700 Morgan 600 Gaffney 500 Hankerson 200 Helu 400 __________________ No longer were NFL coaches dealing inflexibly with spread [QBs] in ways that caused stunted development for players like [A. Smith and Vick] now, the idea is to bring what the quarterback can do, and what he should do, together as an organic whole

03-21-2012, 12:06 AM	#819
EARTHQUAKE2689 You did WHAT?!? Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: In The Kitchen With Dyna. Age: 24 Posts: 11,036	Re: Redskins Add WRs Pierre Garcon and Joshua Morgan That's 4k plus and ouch on Hank, I think Moss's age is what hurts him. __________________ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpp3ycMvQd0 This is why you need Mentos. To justify your questionable problem solving skills. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z7geP5ev0VI Awesome isn't it.

03-21-2012, 12:14 AM	#822
EARTHQUAKE2689 You did WHAT?!? Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: In The Kitchen With Dyna. Age: 24 Posts: 11,036	Re: Redskins Add WRs Pierre Garcon and Joshua Morgan yeah he is and I have both of them gone. __________________ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpp3ycMvQd0 This is why you need Mentos. To justify your questionable problem solving skills. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z7geP5ev0VI Awesome isn't it.

03-21-2012, 12:35 AM	#825
Dirtbag59 Naega jeil jal naga Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Atlanta, Georgia From: Silver Spring, Maryland Age: 27 Posts: 13,978	Re: Redskins Add WRs Pierre Garcon and Joshua Morgan I would rather have a bunch of 800 yard receivers anyway then one 1,000 yard receiver, unless of course you gave me a Fitzgerald, Johnson, or well Johnson. Almost always better in theory when the opposing defense has to spread out and cover everyone rather then keying in on one guy. A lot like the setup the Packers have going right now. Also in regards to developing QB's sometimes have a true number 1 can stunt a guys development (a la Culpepper) or allow him to break out (a la Schuab and for now Stafford). __________________ Flacco is 1337 Fanclub President

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Redskins Add WRs Pierre Garcon and Joshua Morgan

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