Warpath  

Home | Forums | Salary Cap Info | Shop | Donate | Stay Connected




Go Back   Warpath > Redskins Forums > Redskins Locker Room


A New Look Offense or the Same but Better?

Redskins Locker Room


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-28-2012, 09:18 AM   #106
The Starter
 
30gut's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,099
Re: A New Look Offense or the Same but Better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTripp0012 View Post
The baseline on these DVOA stats is against both runs and passes. So first round run calls are being compared to all first and ten plays leaguewide. Etc. These are the Redskins rates and ranks from the 2011 season.
Thanks G, very interesting.

What is the percentage in the figures?
Is it the percentage chance of converting for a 1st down?

Can you post or link the complete data set?
__________________
No longer were NFL coaches dealing inflexibly with spread [QBs] in ways that caused stunted development for players like [A. Smith and Vick] now, the idea is to bring what the quarterback can do, and what he should do, together as an organic whole
30gut is offline   Reply With Quote

Advertisements
Old 05-28-2012, 09:42 AM   #107
The Starter
 
30gut's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,099
Re: A New Look Offense or the Same but Better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HailGreen28 View Post
I'm just thinking this season will seem like night and day between Grossman scrambling, and Griffin running the same play. With more bootlegs/rollouts from under center called.
Yep, some of the yards that Grossman left out there because of mobility and lack of arm strength/velocity, deep ball accuracy Griff will capitalize on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hail
Yeah, would love to see the deep passing you're talking about on the rollouts.
I def think we'll see more 5-7 step drop intermediate passing:

__________________
No longer were NFL coaches dealing inflexibly with spread [QBs] in ways that caused stunted development for players like [A. Smith and Vick] now, the idea is to bring what the quarterback can do, and what he should do, together as an organic whole
30gut is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2012, 04:15 PM   #108
Playmaker
 
HailGreen28's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,654
Re: A New Look Offense or the Same but Better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 30gut View Post
I def think we'll see more 5-7 step drop intermediate passing:

(snip pretty cool video)
Hated the first play lol, but nice video. Hope we do see more of that this season.
HailGreen28 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2012, 11:42 PM   #109
Living Legend
 
GTripp0012's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Evanston, IL
Age: 26
Posts: 15,994
Re: A New Look Offense or the Same but Better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 30gut View Post
Thanks G, very interesting.

What is the percentage in the figures?
Is it the percentage chance of converting for a 1st down?

Can you post or link the complete data set?
The percentage is simply this:

Outcome value of the play/baseline

A 30% play was 30 percent more valuable than the expectation for the down and distance.
__________________
according to a source with knowledge of the situation.
GTripp0012 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2012, 09:14 AM   #110
The Starter
 
30gut's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,099
Re: A New Look Offense or the Same but Better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTripp0012 View Post
The percentage is simply this:

Outcome value of the play/baseline

A 30% play was 30 percent more valuable than the expectation for the down and distance.
Thanks,
Do you have the 1st down stats for the Texans?
I wonder how we compare to a good running team.

Personally I don't think Kyle is gonna make significant or meaningful changes.
I think the offense we saw last year is gonna be the offense we see this year.
But, I'm filled with hope and eagerness to be proved utterly wrong.
Because if they harnessed the talent of Griffin and really altered the offense around his skillset he could have a huge impact.
But, at the end of the day I think Robert Griffin is a 'coach proof' talent.
__________________
No longer were NFL coaches dealing inflexibly with spread [QBs] in ways that caused stunted development for players like [A. Smith and Vick] now, the idea is to bring what the quarterback can do, and what he should do, together as an organic whole

Last edited by 30gut; 05-29-2012 at 12:20 PM.
30gut is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2012, 02:28 PM   #111
The Starter
 
InsaneBoost's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: DC
Age: 26
Posts: 1,300
Re: A New Look Offense or the Same but Better?

Better:

In all honesty, I feel our offense was good enough last year. Not saying it was elite or anything along that line, but good enough to compete with "the best" (which they still did, damn Giants). The problem naturally, was QB, and that's what it's going to boil down to this year.

Defenses stacked the box to force the ball into Rex Grossmans hands for the simple fact he didn't scare anyone. Granted he did get some wins, but 9/10 times it's going to work for you.

If Robert Griffin III can come out and shine and cause defenses to respect us, then were finally going to see this offense come together, we'll be able to mix things up a lot better and hurt defenses both in the air and on the ground.

So I guess in a sense, it all boils down to RGIII. Not saying we can't use better players at certain positions and add better depth, but the main reason we failed last year was because nobody feared Grossman.
__________________

InsaneBoost is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2012, 02:39 PM   #112
Living Legend
 
Monkeydad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: PA
Age: 35
Posts: 16,275
Re: A New Look Offense or the Same but Better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HailGreen28 View Post
To my untrained eye, Kyle's offense changed to more rollouts/bootlegs when Beck briefly replaced Grossman last season. Looking forward to seeing a much more wide-open offense with RG3.
That's because Beck could actually run well. Rex was the master of the "step into a defender for a sack fumble".

I expect the offense to adapt to RGIII's mobility. They'd be stupid not to tailor the playbook to his talents.
__________________
Not sent from a Droid, iPhone, Blackberry or toaster
Monkeydad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2012, 03:03 PM   #113
‎\m/
 
Mattyk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Age: 41
Posts: 81,771
Re: A New Look Offense or the Same but Better?

I think we'll see RG3 rolling out a ton. Play-action off the stretch zone will be deadly.
__________________
Support The Warpath! | Warpath Shop
Mattyk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2012, 03:39 PM   #114
The Starter
 
REDSKINS4ever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Born and raised in D.C.....but I'm a New Yorker now....
Posts: 2,125
Re: A New Look Offense or the Same but Better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattyk View Post
I think we'll see RG3 rolling out a ton. Play-action off the stretch zone will be deadly.
Those types of plays will work effectively in the short passing game. Expect a lot of high percentage completions to the fullback in the flat, the tight end in the middle of the field, or the half back in the flat.
REDSKINS4ever is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2012, 03:44 PM   #115
Playmaker
 
los panda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: los angeles, ca
Age: 29
Posts: 4,063
Re: A New Look Offense or the Same but Better?

show me some shades of the 1998 vikings offense
__________________
7 9 21 28 33 42 43 44 49 65 70 81
los panda is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2012, 03:54 PM   #116
Living Legend
 
Monkeydad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: PA
Age: 35
Posts: 16,275
Re: A New Look Offense or the Same but Better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by los panda View Post
show me some shades of the 1998 vikings offense
Why not the 1991 Redskins?
__________________
Not sent from a Droid, iPhone, Blackberry or toaster
Monkeydad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2012, 03:56 PM   #117
Living Legend
 
Monkeydad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: PA
Age: 35
Posts: 16,275
Re: A New Look Offense or the Same but Better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by REDSKINS4ever View Post
Those types of plays will work effectively in the short passing game. Expect a lot of high percentage completions to the fullback in the flat, the tight end in the middle of the field, or the half back in the flat.
Bubble screen!

(Anyone who heard the commentary during the OK State game will understand...)
__________________
Not sent from a Droid, iPhone, Blackberry or toaster
Monkeydad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2012, 03:56 PM   #118
Living Legend
 
GTripp0012's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Evanston, IL
Age: 26
Posts: 15,994
Re: A New Look Offense or the Same but Better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 30gut View Post
Thanks,
Do you have the 1st down stats for the Texans?
I wonder how we compare to a good running team.

Personally I don't think Kyle is gonna make significant or meaningful changes.
I think the offense we saw last year is gonna be the offense we see this year.
But, I'm filled with hope and eagerness to be proved utterly wrong.
Because if they harnessed the talent of Griffin and really altered the offense around his skillset he could have a huge impact.
But, at the end of the day I think Robert Griffin is a 'coach proof' talent.
For the 2011 Texans:

1st down passing
59.2% (3rd)

1st down rushing
-0.6% (16th)

All 1st downs
20.3% (5th)

2nd down passing
8.2% (17th)

2nd down rushing
9.3% (10th)

All 2nd downs
4.9% (16th)

3rd/4th down passing
7.5% (15th)

3rd/4th down rushing
30.3% (8th)

All 3rd/4th downs
13.2% (12th)

All passing
27.3% (9th)

All rushing
7.9% (10th)

All offense
13.3% (9th)

If you look at the trends, the Texans are really similar to us (I suppose thats not the most surprising thing). They're a lot better on offense, sure, but the down/distance splits break down almost exactly identical.
__________________
according to a source with knowledge of the situation.
GTripp0012 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2012, 04:24 PM   #119
Playmaker
 
los panda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: los angeles, ca
Age: 29
Posts: 4,063
Re: A New Look Offense or the Same but Better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Monkeydad View Post
Why not the 1991 Redskins?
fast/slender qb with an accurate/rocket arm (the arm sleeve tops it off) is why 1998 vikings offense. setting the record for points scored would be the cherry on top.

wouldn't mind some shades of the 1991 redskins offense, either
__________________
7 9 21 28 33 42 43 44 49 65 70 81
los panda is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2012, 05:19 PM   #120
The Starter
 
30gut's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,099
Re: A New Look Offense or the Same but Better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTripp0012 View Post
If you look at the trends, the Texans are really similar to us (I suppose thats not the most surprising thing). They're a lot better on offense, sure, but the down/distance splits break down almost exactly identical.
Thanks again bro.
But, I'm scratching my head on the the bolded portion. of your quote.
I guess they're kinda in the same ball park in some areas but I don't see identical.
I'd say they're somewhat close on 1st downs rushing/All 1st downs.
But its hard to guage the degree of difference between the data sets without seeing some other teams figures
For example: 1st down passing:
Texans: 3rd @ 59.2%
B&G: 7th @ 36.5%
Are they as close as the ranking suggests(3rd vs 7th) ? Or was far apart as the % suggests?

But, when it gets to 2nd down even without the knowing where the other teams fall their is a large disparity, first off the rankings are separated by almost 10 spots. And the Texans % figures are all in the positive and ours are all in the negative.

It would be great if this down/distance/run/pass DVOA was coordinated to matching YPA then it would be evening more meaningful.

For example what YPA do the Texans/B&G have on 1st downs rushing? etc..
__________________
No longer were NFL coaches dealing inflexibly with spread [QBs] in ways that caused stunted development for players like [A. Smith and Vick] now, the idea is to bring what the quarterback can do, and what he should do, together as an organic whole

Last edited by 30gut; 05-29-2012 at 05:32 PM.
30gut is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:32 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site is not officially affiliated with the Washington Redskins or the NFL.
Page generated in 0.29508 seconds with 11 queries

Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.2.0 RC5

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25