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Griffin's Impact on our Offense

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Old 04-17-2012, 02:39 PM   #151
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Re: Griffin's Impact on our Offense

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um, why are we wasting so much space arguing about QB's when we're going to be drafting blackmon?

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Great 1.
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Old 04-17-2012, 02:45 PM   #152
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Re: Griffin's Impact on our Offense

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I get the feeling your not even reading my post because you don't respond to any of the points I make and we're just going around in circles.
Here are my points:

(a) the 'majority of football people' are draft media talking heads they are not scouts

(b) they draft media is wrong all the time therefore when you prop a player up based on there opinion you're just relying on the opinion of people who have been proven wrong time and time again as recently as last year

(c) [from watching your clip] even after Cam had a great rookie year some are saying that Luck is still better but some are not as evident by the debate you posted 2 guys on the panel are actually making my point. But that line of logic or rhetoric behind that debate is based on the persistence of an inaccurate/wrong headed evaluation that the same draft media made of Cam in the first place

And finally (for the 3rd time); since we are just 2 guys on the internet having a discussion why don't you tell me the areas you think Luck is better then Cam and Griff based on their NFL skillset? (instead of pushing the opinions of the often and recently wrong draft media?)...is it arm strength, timing, deep ball, pro-readiness, accuracy, efficiency, size, playmaking
He definitely has Cam on pro-readiness hands down. I think he also has him on timing, accuracy, and efficiency. Cam did not play in a pro ready offense and had to adjust. Cam is more of an athlete, but Luck is more polished and pro-ready.
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Old 04-17-2012, 02:54 PM   #153
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Re: Griffin's Impact on our Offense

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Originally Posted by Monkeydad View Post
Interesting article/analysis on RGIII. Never heard of the Lewin Career Forecast before, but Griffin just scored the highest mark EVER.

Player Year LCF
Robert Griffin 2012 2530
Philip Rivers 2004 2476
Drew Brees 2001 2190
Colt McCoy 2010 2092
Carson Palmer 2003 1973
Peyton Manning 1998 1784
Andrew Luck 2012 1749
Chad Pennington 2000 1678
Brady Quinn 2007 1518
Jason Campbell 2005 1506


FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS: Innovative Statistics, Intelligent Analysis | Lewin Career Forecast 2012
thats actually really impressive.
i wanna lock up Griffin so bad man i hate that the Colts pick before us.
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Old 04-17-2012, 03:09 PM   #154
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Re: Griffin's Impact on our Offense

Do you think Irsay will drag the pick-out or announce it right away. I figure are pick should take about 2 seconds.
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Old 04-17-2012, 03:17 PM   #155
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Re: Griffin's Impact on our Offense

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Originally Posted by NYCskinfan82 View Post
Do you think Irsay will drag the pick-out or announce it right away. I figure are pick should take about 2 seconds.
i hope they sign him to a contract soon, so we know 100% we are getting mr. griffin
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Old 04-17-2012, 03:52 PM   #156
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Re: Griffin's Impact on our Offense

I would like to think the Colts would be working out a deal for Luck by now and have an agreement on a contract of some sort. In the past teams would come to a verbal agreement but they still waited until other players started signing contracts to see where the market was, but now its pretty much set so their really is no need to hold out and no need to avoid coming to an agreement prior to the draft.

Also even if the Colts are undecided one would have to think the snub RG3 gave the Colts for a meeting would have to be a small indicator that he does not want to be with you otherwise he would have made a point to visit them. He knows he's going either #1 or #2 so meeting with the two top teams would not have killed him. So if he doesn't want to be with you then there really is no need to draft him since you don't want an unhappy player when there was another player (Luck) just as good or in some peoples minds better who would love to be with the Colts.
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Old 04-17-2012, 03:57 PM   #157
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Re: Griffin's Impact on our Offense

I have a co-worker who is like a kid in a candy shop over the Skins getting RG3 so when he gets all giddy and asks me if I'm excited over our #2 pick? I ask ... "who Luck"? or when he says "I can't wait to hear our future franchise QB named" I ask "Luck"? lol. I love getting under his skin. lol. I do remind him though there is the possibility the Colts take RG3. I do hate all the media attention he seems to be getting. I wish everyone would just stop trying to sell RG3 cause I am afraid the Colts will second guess themselves and take RG3 at the last second. Which does hold a little weight.
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Old 04-17-2012, 04:02 PM   #158
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Re: Griffin's Impact on our Offense

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Originally Posted by Bubba305-ST21- View Post
i hope they sign him to a contract soon, so we know 100% we are getting mr. griffin
Bubba, I agree with you. I would think that the Colts want their QB "in the fold" so to speak as quickly as they can for off season activities. With that being said, you would hope they are negotiating right now with Luck's agent and getting things worked out. But who knows with Irsay!
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Old 04-17-2012, 04:04 PM   #159
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Re: Griffin's Impact on our Offense

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I have a co-worker who is like a kid in a candy shop over the Skins getting RG3 so when he gets all giddy and asks me if I'm excited over our #2 pick? I ask ... "who Luck"? or when he says "I can't wait to hear our future franchise QB named" I ask "Luck"? lol. I love getting under his skin. lol. I do remind him though there is the possibility the Colts take RG3. I do hate all the media attention he seems to be getting. I wish everyone would just stop trying to sell RG3 cause I am afraid the Colts will second guess themselves and take RG3 at the last second. Which does hold a little weight.
Well, I think most 'skins fans are hoping for RGIII, but I would not be upset in the least if the 'skins draft Andrew Luck. I just hope, for both teams, down the road when neither QB has the excuse of being rookies, we can say, "I'm glad we got THAT guy!"
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Old 04-17-2012, 04:29 PM   #160
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Re: Griffin's Impact on our Offense

I finally got around to seeing Luck's QB camp last night and came away super impressed. If anyone would be truly disappointed if we got him, you're nuts.
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Old 04-17-2012, 08:08 PM   #161
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Re: Griffin's Impact on our Offense

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He definitely has Cam on pro-readiness hands down. I think he also has him on timing, accuracy, and efficiency. Cam did not play in a pro ready offense and had to adjust. Cam is more of an athlete, but Luck is more polished and pro-ready.
I agree with you on the pro-readiness and timing but not on accuracy and efficiency.

Here's how I breakdown the prospects by measurables:

3 is average for a top level QB prospect
4 is above average
5 is elite

Observables------Newton----Luck----Griffin
Deep Ball Placement------4-----4----------5
Intermediate Placement---4-----4---------4
Short Placement (touch)--3-----4----------4
Armstrength--------------5-----3---------4
the ability to drive the ball with velocity
Athleticism----------------5-----4--------5
Playmaking ----------------5------4------5
or *“Spontaneous genius”
Experience----------------3------4-------4
College playing experience/snaps
Running/Scrambling--------5------3-------4
Production/Efficiency-------5------5------5
Pocket presence-----------5-------5------5
Foot work/Timing-----------3-------5------3
The ability to execute 3-5-7 step drop rhythm/timing passing game
Pro Ready------------------3-------5------3
Experience with pro-style plays, concepts, audibles and verbiage
Size---------------------5---------5-------4
Throwing motion----------5--------3-----3.5
Quick Release------------3---------3-------4
***
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Walsh/spontaneous genius
The single trait that separates great quarterbacks from good quarterbacks is the ability to make the great, spontaneous decision, especially at a crucial time… This is where the great quarterback uses his experience, vision, mobility and what we will call spontaneous genius. He makes something good happen. This, of course, is what we saw in Joe Montana when he pulled out those dramatic victories for Notre Dame.


The final or total assessment depends on how you value each trait.
Some of the most important factors are intangibles factors that are both hard to quantify/compare and are virtually unknowable from our vantage point as avid fans but fans none the less.
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Last edited by 30gut; 04-17-2012 at 08:25 PM.
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Old 04-17-2012, 08:21 PM   #162
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Re: Griffin's Impact on our Offense

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Originally Posted by NYCskinfan82 View Post
Do you think Irsay will drag the pick-out or announce it right away. I figure are pick should take about 2 seconds.
A young quarterback like Luck should have a deal in place before the draft much like when the Detroit Lions signed Matthew Stafford before they drafted him in 2009. If Irsay doesn't sign Luck before the draft, then that could mean that he likes RG3 over Luck and therefore will wait until when it's time to pick to select RG3.
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Old 04-17-2012, 08:59 PM   #163
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Re: Griffin's Impact on our Offense

Cam-------Luck--------Griffin
---4---------4----------5-- Deep Ball Placement
---4---------5----------4-- Intermediate Placement
---3---------4----------4-- Short Placement
---5--------3.5----------4 --Armstrength
---5---------4----------5-- Athleticism
---5--------3.5---------5-- “Spontaneous genius”
---3---------4----------4-- Experience
---5---------3----------4-- Running/Scrambling
---5---------5----------5-- Production/Efficiency
---5---------5----------5-- Pocket presence
---3---------5----------3-- Foot work/Timing
---3---------5----------3-- Pro Ready
---5---------5----------4-- Size
---5---------3---------3.5--Throwing motion
---3---------3----------4-- Quick Release
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Old 04-17-2012, 09:14 PM   #164
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A young quarterback like Luck should have a deal in place before the draft much like when the Detroit Lions signed Matthew Stafford before they drafted him in 2009. If Irsay doesn't sign Luck before the draft, then that could mean that he likes RG3 over Luck and therefore will wait until when it's time to pick to select RG3.
I don't think Cam was signed prior to the draft last year. With the new slotting system there's not the urgency there used to be to get a deal done early.


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Old 04-17-2012, 09:23 PM   #165
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Re: Griffin's Impact on our Offense

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Originally Posted by Mattyk View Post
I don't think Cam was signed prior to the draft last year. With the new slotting system there's not the urgency there used to be to get a deal done early.


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They literally weren't allowed to negotiate with cam due to the lock out. Last year wasn't a gpod measuring stick for this year.
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