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RGIII Says Don't Expect A Lot of Trickeration in Playbook

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Old 07-07-2012, 07:14 AM   #16
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Re: RGIII Says Don't Expect A Lot of Trickeration in Playbook

1) This is not saying much -- outside of the Tim Tebow world, NFL offenses always "throw and run a majority of the time". I guess this means we're not running a majority WildCat offense, which is a good thing.

2) The first year is unlikely to have much "trickeration" -- that would come over time.
3) Even if they were planning a lot of "trickeration", he wouldn't tell everyone too much about it now.
4) I hope the "trickeration" never includes the swinging gate again.
5) Don't remember any Super Bowl teams based on "Trickeration"
6) Pretty sure "Trickeration" is not a word.
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Old 07-07-2012, 07:58 AM   #17
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Re: RGIII Says Don't Expect A Lot of Trickeration in Playbook

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Old 07-07-2012, 09:55 AM   #18
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Re: RGIII Says Don't Expect A Lot of Trickeration in Playbook

Redskins email report: Bowen breaks down Shanahan’s game plan | WashingtonExaminer.com

This isn’t from a recent game plan, but it is indicative of how Mike Shanahan calls a game. And, yes, I know Kyle Shanahan calls the plays during games, but his dad is heavily involved in both calling plays and planning the script. So it was telling when former Redskins safety Matt Bowen went back and looked over his pregame notes from a Redskins game vs. Denver in 2005. Yes, the game has changed a little bit since that time, but in 2005 Shanahan had a mobile quarterback in Jake Plummer. He will have another one this fall in Robert Griffin III (who obviously should end up being much more dynamic). The zone option read wasn’t in the playbook back then but could be this fall.

You can check out Matt’s notes here at the National Football Post:
An inside look at Shanahan's game plan | National Football Post

Bowen provided further detail on things that surprised him or stood out:

1. The running game is the same » “There’s not a lot of power O or counter left. It’s mostly zone blocking still. The personnel will change a little bit. They use more ‘ace’ personnel because of how the NFL is. If you have a healthy Chris Cooley and Fred Davis, you have them both on the field. I don’t know how many fullbacks are left in the NFL really. Not many teams run regular personnel anymore.”

2. The first 15 analysis » “That’s something to check on, to see the first 15 plays and how he scripts them, how they’re different. The first play series across the 40 I have underlined 40 pass. That means a shot to the end zone. We’ll know their shifts and motions by the end of the first 15. He’ll put his best stuff out there in the first 15 plays. You won’t get anything new after that. If you can handle those shifts and motions after the first 15, you’ll be fine. You don’t panic, and you should be able to run your own defense every play. You shouldn’t be so unprepared that you need to check to a Cover 2. You can play the defense called in the huddle, go through the adjustments based off shifts and motions and just play football.”

3. There was a lot of balance to the game plan, even on critical plays » “Fourth down, third-and-short, ball at the 35 or 37 playing to get into field goal position. They used seven runs and four passes. He wants to run the ball in those situations more than pass it. The boot game hasn’t changed at all. They show up on every single page. RGIII is a much better athlete than Jake Plummer, so I would expect the same thing.”

4. Use of personnel » “He used flush-personnel [five receivers] in the two-minute drill – 18 times in the two-minute drill over a span of four games. That’s a lot. I don’t know who their tight end was at that time. That’s now how it is now. He didn’t have a tight end game back then. He would put five receivers on the field. But that would mean he’d have to put Davis on the bench, and I wouldn’t do that.”

5. First- and second-down tips » “Anytime the Z receiver motions into the formation in the slot and he doesn’t have I formation in the backfield, it’s a pass. Anytime the Z motions across the ball, it’s a pass.”

6. Surprises » “I didn’t expect him to run the ball this much. When they were backed up, it was seven runs to four passes. That’s understandable. Critical plays, seven runs and four passes. On the goal line, 11 runs and five passes. In the red zone, 12 runs and eight passes. That stood out to me. There were 20 plays over four games in the red zone, and they used eight passes, and six of those were boots. And the runs in the red zone are leads and stretches. He wants to run misdirection, especially when he had Jake. They run the naked boot and do all of that – and they’re setting up the boot plays.”

7. Another surprise » “There weren’t as many deep balls as I expected. Back then it was Rod Smith, and he was the key to our personnel. They didn’t have many deep route concepts — a lot of throws to the middle of the field – high-low, slants, dig routes, inside seam routes. They have fade routes in there, but they’re not a very vertical offense like you see with Green Bay and New Orleans. … The first two series they’ll take a shot down the field. That’s normal of every team.”

8. Tough to defend » My take: Players talk about using their eyes right and not falling for stuff, but talk to enough players and they will admit they’re often looking at things they shouldn’t. So: “This is the type of game plan that is more about reading your keys because they ran so much misdirection — where are your eyes pointed? We had guys running into each other against Denver.”
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Old 07-07-2012, 11:08 AM   #19
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Re: RGIII Says Don't Expect A Lot of Trickeration in Playbook

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Really.......love this kid.
I nearly cried when I saw what we gave to trade up for him but everything I have seen and read since has made me believe it was a wise and savvy move.
Can't wait........
Yeah, I would have kept all those picks, myself. Now I'm praying Shanny was right this time. So far so good, but the hype is pretty meaningless till Opening Day. Hopefully the stuff that needs to get done in practice and in study is getting done.

This whole Luck/Griffin controversy reminds me of the Manning/Leaf draft. Both those guys were sure things too. Irsay doesn't seem that football savvy, so I don't mind Shanny picking after him especially since rumor was we'd pick Griffin first regardless. Almost feel sorry for Luck not getting nearly the great press Griffin got, and the situation he's walking into at Indy. But would love to see us look like we got "Manning" while they got "Leaf", this season.
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Old 07-08-2012, 09:44 AM   #20
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Re: RGIII Says Don't Expect A Lot of Trickeration in Playbook

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Peyton Manning and Ryan Leaf are the class of the NFL draft, but experts say one of them stands head and shoulder pads above the other
posted 4/13/1998 on SI.com

...But in the view of a six-man blue-ribbon panel that analyzed game tapes of the players for SI, Leaf doesn't rank as high as Manning. Each expert was asked: If you had to pick one of these players, whom would you take? With different degrees of conviction, each said Manning. Three said they would be shocked if the Colts didn't select him.

The panel was made up of Tampa Bay Buccaneers director of player personnel Jerry Angelo; Sid Gillman, who was instrumental in the development of the West Coach offense; Denver Broncos coach Mike Shanahan; former New York Giants quarterback and Super Bowl MVP Phil Simms; UCLA coach Bob Toledo, whose Bruins played Tennessee and Washington State in each of the last two seasons; and former San Francisco 49ers coach Bill Walsh. The panelists raised doubts about Leaf's mental preparedness and mechanics but still liked him as a player. However, they think Manning is the superior prospect at the most important position in the game.

...Leaf admits that he "hit the banquet circuit a little hard and ordered too much room service late at night." Maybe his ballooning to 261 pounds reflected nothing more than a kid loving life and celebrating his newfound celebrity. But maybe it was a red flag.

"I was at the combine for the weigh-in," says Angelo, "and it really surprised me. Here's what could be the biggest day of your life, the day you're going to expose yourself to your future employers for the first time, and you show up out of shape and overweight. To me, that's a signal. The quarterback has to be the CEO of your team. You have to trust him. I'd have some hard questions if that happened and we were going to pick him."

The "Is RG3 another Ryan Leaf" debate is overblown. Cool part is you can go back in time & search on google for articles from 4/1-4/15/1998, right before the 1998 draft. As above, there were concerns about Leaf before the draft (including showing up 20 lbs overweight). Shanahan actually evaluated him at that time (as above) -- and also predicted it wasn't close.

I think we should give RG3 a chance before we call him RG Leaf. We don't know what's going to happen, but I think he's already shown more potential than Leaf ever did.
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Old 07-08-2012, 10:02 AM   #21
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Re: RGIII Says Don't Expect A Lot of Trickeration in Playbook

It's just possible that both Luck & Griffin live up to or exceed expectations. I seriously doubt that either will be the epic fail that was Ryan Leaf.
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Old 07-08-2012, 12:52 PM   #22
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Re: RGIII Says Don't Expect A Lot of Trickeration in Playbook

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Originally Posted by HailGreen28 View Post
Yeah, I would have kept all those picks, myself. Now I'm praying Shanny was right this time. So far so good, but the hype is pretty meaningless till Opening Day. Hopefully the stuff that needs to get done in practice and in study is getting done.

This whole Luck/Griffin controversy reminds me of the Manning/Leaf draft. Both those guys were sure things too. Irsay doesn't seem that football savvy, so I don't mind Shanny picking after him especially since rumor was we'd pick Griffin first regardless. Almost feel sorry for Luck not getting nearly the great press Griffin got, and the situation he's walking into at Indy. But would love to see us look like we got "Manning" while they got "Leaf", this season.
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Old 07-09-2012, 12:38 PM   #23
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Re: RGIII Says Don't Expect A Lot of Trickeration in Playbook

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Originally Posted by Mattyk View Post
Redskins email report: Bowen breaks down Shanahan’s game plan | WashingtonExaminer.com

This isn’t from a recent game plan, but it is indicative of how Mike Shanahan calls a game. And, yes, I know Kyle Shanahan calls the plays during games...The zone option read wasn’t in the playbook back then but could be this fall.
Read Bowen's article when it came out, great read.

But, neither article, especially Bowen's didn't live up to his billing for me because unless he's doing a 2 part series he never really gets down to answers the question he posed:
Quote:
How has the offensive game plan under Mike Shanahan evolved since he was the head coach in Denver?
The article is a great breakdown of Mike Shanahan's offense with Mike Shanahan as the playcaller. They both pay lip service and acknowledge that Kyle calls the plays yet never delve into Kyle's playcalling style/tendency.

I would much rather have read about our offense with Kyle Shanahan as the playcaller.


Here are some areas that stand for me:
Quote:
3. There was a lot of balance to the game plan, even on critical plays » “Fourth down, third-and-short, ball at the 35 or 37 playing to get into field goal position. They used seven runs and four passes. He wants to run the ball in those situations more than pass it.
^^Kyle thus far does not share this same balance.

Quote:
4. Use of personnel » “He used flush-personnel [five receivers] in the two-minute drill – 18 times in the two-minute drill over a span of four games. That’s a lot. I don’t know who their tight end was at that time. That’s now how it is now. He didn’t have a tight end game back then. He would put five receivers on the field. But that would mean he’d have to put Davis on the bench, and I wouldn’t do that.”
I would love to see Kyle use more 5 receivers sets especially with Griffin's comfortable level in a spread offense.



Quote:
6. Surprises » “I didn’t expect him to run the ball this much. When they were backed up, it was seven runs to four passes. That’s understandable. Critical plays, seven runs and four passes. On the goal line, 11 runs and five passes. In the red zone, 12 runs and eight passes. That stood out to me. There were 20 plays over four games in the red zone, and they used eight passes, and six of those were boots. And the runs in the red zone are leads and stretches. He wants to run misdirection, especially when he had Jake. They run the naked boot and do all of that – and they’re setting up the boot plays.”
This would be the most pleasant surprise for me considering Kyle's pass first nature but I'm not holding breath.

Quote:
7. Another surprise » “There weren’t as many deep balls as I expected. Back then it was Rod Smith, and he was the key to our personnel. They didn’t have many deep route concepts — a lot of throws to the middle of the field – high-low, slants, dig routes, inside seam routes. They have fade routes in there, but they’re not a very vertical offense like you see with Green Bay and New Orleans. … The first two series they’ll take a shot down the field. That’s normal of every team.”
I hope this is one area that changes to take advantage of Griffin's deep ball acumen, I think they similarly took more shots with Cutler.

Quote:
8. Tough to defend » My take: Players talk about using their eyes right and not falling for stuff, but talk to enough players and they will admit they’re often looking at things they shouldn’t. So: “This is the type of game plan that is more about reading your keys because they ran so much misdirection — where are your eyes pointed? We had guys running into each other against Denver.”
I agree with this completely, I can already envision how much more confusion and hesitiation the offense could cause for defenses with a sprinkling of zone read.

Great article by Matt Bowen though
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Last edited by 30gut; 07-09-2012 at 02:20 PM.
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Old 07-09-2012, 12:42 PM   #24
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Re: RGIII Says Don't Expect A Lot of Trickeration in Playbook

It's always fun to see an athlete who's experienced such stardom stay grounded. Glad he's able to keep his sense of humor, and I couldn't be more excited to see what he does for the Skins this year.
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Old 07-09-2012, 01:51 PM   #25
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Re: RGIII Says Don't Expect A Lot of Trickeration in Playbook

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It's just possible that both Luck & Griffin live up to or exceed expectations. I seriously doubt that either will be the epic fail that was Ryan Leaf.
We'll know two or three years from now more about Griffin and Luck. Both were great in college but whether or not that talent translates over into the NFL remains to be seen. We will definitely see flashes of greatness from both rookie QBs this year.
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Old 07-09-2012, 02:30 PM   #26
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Re: RGIII Says Don't Expect A Lot of Trickeration in Playbook

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It's just possible that both Luck & Griffin live up to or exceed expectations. I seriously doubt that either will be the epic fail that was Ryan Leaf.
LIAR! ONE MUST FAIL!


or not, you never really know till the games are played.
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Old 07-09-2012, 02:31 PM   #27
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Re: RGIII Says Don't Expect A Lot of Trickeration in Playbook

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We'll know two or three years from now more about Griffin and Luck. Both were great in college but whether or not that talent translates over into the NFL remains to be seen. We will definitely see flashes of greatness from both rookie QBs this year.
Even Rex had 'flashes' of greatness. blind squirrels and their nuts, etc.
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