Skins/Giants post game thread

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by jdc65

The Skins don't win games like this one today, they haven't in years, they find a way to lose these games. The Giants find ways to win these games, as most good teams do. They likely would have lost the Viking game if not for Griffin's spectacular run. Count the Tampa game as mostly a Griffin win as well.

It's time for brutal honesty, Shanahan's coaching record over the last 5 years is 29-41. Here he is 14-25. No way he is coaching any NFL team if not for the early Bronco years with John Elway. Any equity he had built up is gone now. I say that as a fan ecstatic when he was hired and even happier to have Kyle onboard as I thought he would follow as HC.

The defense and special teams are worse than when he arrived, and the entire offense is predicated on misdirection with Griffin's superior ability. It is unsustainable. For every good move they've made, I can point to 2 bad ones, probably 3.

RG could be a superstar, they have a handful of solid pieces to work around, and there is legitimate hope for the future. But in my opinion, Shanahan isn't going to take this team to the next step, and there is no logical reason for any fan to think so other than blind faith and desperate hope.

I'm predicting Haslett won't finish the season, and 5-6 wins means complete change which I am now all for. 7 or more wins will and should keep Mike here, I agree.

Rite on man. Just hope RG-3 and morris and the few others can carry this team a long way - cus i personally dont care why we win - just that we win.


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[The Goat]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

There was absolutely NOTHING wrong with the play calling today minus one series. You just have this illogical hate towards the Shanahan's and it shows.

No, I think Mike needs to takeover play-calling because errors there are costing us significantly. If/when you watch the replay you'll count multiple plays spread throughout the game in which the defense read it perfectly before the ball was snapped. The most obvious ones we're the option to Paul, the option where RG3 lost the ball, and the option that was nearly broken up. The other instances don't have the same trending pattern. Here and there on an obvious blitz from the defense and Kyle hasn't given RG3 a quick slant option to burn the blitz.

And then you get into how poorly we spread the field through the air. I swear, our run game is creating bigger space/holes than the air attack.

Where I was wrong, up to the Falcons game, was thinking we have a pedestrian WR corp. We have a pretty good corp IMO. Moss is stellar this season. Hankerson shows some impressive skill improvement every game. He's learning to create space a little like Moss, and his bigger frame helps him out. Garcon and Morgan, while neither guy is consistent enough, can be swapped out for whoever is on their game. Add Fred Davis and you have a pretty awesome group of pass-catchers. We won't be quite at lethal with Cooley and Paulsen splitting time, but it is most definitely a group that should be able to consistently move the ball AND score.

[imaskin4life]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

We should have hung 40 on these guys today. I'm not excusing the blown coverage on the Cruz TD but it shouldn't have come down to that. 3 fumbles was just horrible.

players usually play the way they practice. multiple fumbles by different players makes me wonder what the redskins did to practice ball security this week - especially if there is limited contact at their practices.

[Mattyk]

Originally Posted by imaskin4life

players usually play the way they practice. multiple fumbles by different players makes me wonder what the redskins did to practice ball security this week - especially if there is limited contact at their practices.

Seemed more like a fluke day than anything. Fumbles weren't a problem coming into today. Hopefully they shake it off and get on track.

[Skinzman]

Originally Posted by punch it in

Dont even want to go here but if you base your feelings on wins / losses than its actually the love thats illogical.


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He screwed up on the trying to "win now" in year 1. Even so, why would anyone expect the roster we had to be completely turned over and winning SB's in 3 years. When he was hired, I told myself that in year 3 is where we should start to see a turn around. Year 4 is when we are a playoff team. And so far, year 3, and that turnaround is looking like its happening. Get a secondary, and we are already a playoff team, so we are on course with what I expected.

I think the problem is that when you expect to take a horrible team with massive cap problems and expect 3 SB victories in the first 4 years. You are setting up yourself for disappointment.

I think everyone assumes that building a team in Madden franchise mode is the same as building a team in the NFL, so once they win a SB in Madden, they think they could pull off 3 SB's in 4 years in the NFL as a GM. And here in lies the biggest problem IMO.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by jdc65

The Skins don't win games like this one today, they haven't in years, they find a way to lose these games. The Giants find ways to win these games, as most good teams do. They likely would have lost the Viking game if not for Griffin's spectacular run. Count the Tampa game as mostly a Griffin win as well.

But the Redskins just won a game like this last week. And the Giants likely would have lost if not for Cruz' TD today. So what's your point?

[punch it in]

I

Originally Posted by Mattyk

Seemed more like a fluke day than anything. Fumbles weren't a problem coming into today. Hopefully they shake it off and get on track.

Id have to agree with this. Very un - characteristic. We matched our season total today. Ugggh. They were all friggin unforced to. This wasnt osi comin around rex's blind side and swatting the ball away. These were just lack of focus.
Edit: most of them coming late in the game and its almost like the players were thinking the sane thing we were. Holy shit were really good and were gonna make a huge statement and the pressure got to em. I would think they will learn from that. So much of the game is mentally being able to accept that you belong on the damn field with whoever you are playing. That it is ok to win even if that goes against what people have come to expect when they are playing us.


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[punch it in]

Originally Posted by Skinzman

He screwed up on the trying to "win now" in year 1. Even so, why would anyone expect the roster we had to be completely turned over and winning SB's in 3 years. When he was hired, I told myself that in year 3 is where we should start to see a turn around. Year 4 is when we are a playoff team. And so far, year 3, and that turnaround is looking like its happening. Get a secondary, and we are already a playoff team, so we are on course with what I expected.

I think the problem is that when you expect to take a horrible team with massive cap problems and expect 3 SB victories in the first 4 years. You are setting up yourself for disappointment.

I think everyone assumes that building a team in Madden franchise mode is the same as building a team in the NFL, so once they win a SB in Madden, they think they could pull off 3 SB's in 4 years in the NFL as a GM. And here in lies the biggest problem IMO.

Lol. I dont play Madden but im pretty sure that video games have nothing to do with any problems with the Redskins.


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[Skinzman]

Originally Posted by punch it in

Lol. I dont play Madden but im pretty sure that video games have nothing to do with any problems with the Redskins.


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The game doesnt have anything to do with any problems of the Skins. It has to do with fans thinking they can take a perennial doormat and have them winning SB's in a year or two so why cant an NFL GM.

[NC_Skins]

Giants 27, Redskins 23: Ten Observations | WashingtonExaminer.com


Good read.

Let’s go right to the 77-yard touchdown pass. The knee-jerk reaction, clearly, is to blame defensive coordinator Jim Haslett. If you want to knock his schemes and the lack of pressure, go right ahead. If you want to question adjustments, go ahead. But it’s awfully difficult to blame him for the coverage mishap on this play. In fact, it’s misguided. A coordinator puts defenders in position and then it’s up to a player to do the rest. He assigned two players to stop the most dangerous target on the other team. Not a bad idea. In this case, corner Josh Wilson and safety Madieu Williams failed to execute a double team. Actually, Williams deserves more of the blame. It’s clear based on Wilson’s alignment at the snap he’s expecting – and needs – safety help over the top. Wilson is shaded inside and never looks at the quarterback. Williams, though, perhaps because of a receiver to the outside, was flat-footed. Here’s the thing: based on how Wilson was aligned, it’s easy to deduce there should have been no hesitation.


On this play, it’s an easy read for the receiver. With Wilson inside and Williams shaded to the outside, Victor Cruz runs a straight go-route. As Wilson said, Cruz hadn’t done much of anything before this catch – six catches for 54 yards. It wasn’t just Wilson covering him; Wilson would shadow him for a series but other times Wilson would show up and then drop into deep middle in a cover-3 look. But back to Haslett. Obviously the defense hasn’t produced enough under Haslett. They allow too many big plays. However, this one falls on the players, Williams in particular. If you don’t like Williams starting, that’s another matter. The Redskins did not have the best plan at safety, hoping Tanard Jackson – who had multiple drug suspensions before he signed – would be their starter. But Williams is the guy; the alternatives are few. Williams is a steady guy, but lacks speed. That’s been evident in other games and it impacts the coverage. I just don’t think the corners trust the safeties all that much right now to be where they need to be and at the right time.

[jdc65]

Originally Posted by redskins5044

Yep fire all the coaches, sounds like a plan. Lets just pretend this year #1 with Shanahan, he's not going anywhere after the season. We have a rookie QB, building from the ground up starting from this year not 2 years ago.

The question isn't just starting over again or not? The real question is can the current regime take this team to the next level? In my opinion, there is no rational reason to expect this team to significantly improve over the next few years with the current leadership. They are not building from the ground up, or shouldn't be. They have had 3 offseasons to build with no noticeable sign of improvement anywhere with the exception of Griffin's remarkable ability.

There are plenty of quality coaches in waiting who can work with Griffin and develope his game. Change should come sooner than later, and cutting your losses early is always the best path to take. It's not happening with Shanahan, it just isn't. Players have lost confidence whether they admit it or not in my honest opinion.

[Mattyk]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

Giants 27, Redskins 23: Ten Observations | WashingtonExaminer.com


Good read.

Keim hits the nail on the head. It was a clearly a blown coverage. That's on the players, not Haslett.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by jdc65

The question isn't just starting over again or not? The real question is can the current regime take this team to the next level? In my opinion, there is no rational reason to expect this team to significantly improve over the next few years with the current leadership. They are not building from the ground up, or shouldn't be. They have had 3 offseasons to build with no noticeable sign of improvement anywhere with the exception of Griffin's remarkable ability.

There are plenty of quality coaches in waiting who can work with Griffin and develope his game. Change should come sooner than later, and cutting your losses early is always the best path to take. It's not happening with Shanahan, it just isn't. Players have lost confidence whether they admit it or not.

Lonely are the brave, and you'll be lonely until we hit December I suspect. Starting to wonder if Snyder will see the big picture before a majority of fans do, which I suspect could take years. It's...a phenomenon

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by Skinzman

The game doesnt have anything to do with any problems of the Skins. It has to do with fans thinking they can take a perennial doormat and have them winning SB's in a year or two so why cant an NFL GM.

There is a big difference between wanting to win more than five games and be somewhat relevant and wanting to win superbowls. I dont think i have ever seen or heard one post or person calling for heads because we arent winning superbowls. Alot of teams do go from doormats to relevant in less than five years. I think alot of people wonder about Shanny because of his last several yeara in Denver. Which i dont believe you can overlook. I mean the "apologists" always want to talk about the two superbowls. Than there is this empty space in their opinion of Shanny. Like he won two superbowls and than packed his bags and came to rescue the horrid redskins that were set back years due to Vinnie. Nobody -even the "haters" will deny that Shanny inherited a mess. However there were several years of Mike Shanahans coaching career in Denver that were -well - not good. He did not win two superbowls, hop on a plane, land in Washington, and start digging us out of a hole. Thats a nice fairytale way to look at it but it is not reality.


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[imaskin4life]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

Seemed more like a fluke day than anything. Fumbles weren't a problem coming into today. Hopefully they shake it off and get on track.

Right, usually we take of the ball but this week there was a problem. Even if we say it was a fluke day, each time it happened (3 times to 3 different players) the player was not holding onto the ball tight enough as if it could be stripped away.

I have no doubt in my mind that we will shake it off because we will emphasize ball security this week.