KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide

BigHairedAristocrat

Please provide evidence supporting your statement that Belcher had multiple injuries to his brain that affected the ipulse control center of his brain, making him more susceptible to rage.

Please also explain how being more susceptible to rage makes you less responsible for your own actions. In my opinion, if you, for any reason, are more susciptable to rage, then you are responsible for working harder than most people at controlling it.

As to your first statement regarding having a bad day, you've acutally proved my other point. You might not premediate murdering that particular peson, but by chosing to react to all those situations the way that you do, and let that anger bulid up inside you, youre cultivating a mindset that makes you more likely to act on it. If a person has impulses like that, they are responsible for working extra hard to control them - not using it as an excuse for when they do snap.

People "snap" because society tolerates that behavior and makes excuses for it. If it didnt, i think you would find alot less people would "snap."

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Dolphins get good press for saving drowning humans.But we only hear about the swimmers theyve pushed ashore.You know who we havent heard from: all the people theyve pushed out to sea.Dolphins dont know what theyre doing-they just like pushing things.

BigHairedAristocrat

I agree with both of those statements. I just beleive it doesnt matter what mental state he was in. he is responsible for allowing himself to get in whatever state it was that allowed him to murder another human being. I also dont think we can dictate how other people should FEEL when coping with a situation like this. My opinion is just that a tribute at his locker is disrepectful.

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Dolphins get good press for saving drowning humans.But we only hear about the swimmers theyve pushed ashore.You know who we havent heard from: all the people theyve pushed out to sea.Dolphins dont know what theyre doing-they just like pushing things.

FRPLG

Right...and I'd add.

I don't think a single one of us is in any position to judge how evil someone is when everyone's definition is different and we have so little information to go on. I don't agree at all with BHA really but I also don't think he's "wrong". It's just not how I look at this situation. Trying to convert someone's opinion on a deeply complicated and nuanced subject such as this is useless.

Paintrain

Bringing it back to the football angle, you're completely right. The lines between public access/privacy in sports are increasingly blurred. Regardless of how we feel about what happened for those 52 other men, coaches, staff, etc. they are dealing with the immediate and violent loss of someone they saw on a daily basis, ate with, traveled with, shared meetings with, shared hotel rooms with and much more. As awful as his acts were on that day, his physical presence is missed (by nothing more than it's absence) by those who interacted with him daily. While the team certainly isn't honoring him, it may be compounding the trauma to those in the locker-room to immediately erase all signs of his existence.

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RedskinRat

And we're back to reading comprehension......

I stated "it wouldn't be a stretch to suggest that an aggressive athlete that has had multiple injuries to this part of the brain may be more susceptible to rage." but thanks for the convenient partial quote.

If you rage you lose the ability to control, you're not about to recognize that.

One of the most common effects of frontal damage can be a dramatic change in social behavior. A person's personality can undergo significant changes after an injury to the frontal lobes, especially when both lobes are involved. There are some differences in the left versus right frontal lobes in this area. Left frontal damage usually manifests as pseudodepression and right frontal damage as pseudopsychopathic (Blumer and Benson, 1975).

There's ton of research out there which I'm not filling the forum with, Google it yourself.

Proving your point? No, I wasn't but if you choose to use that tired old rhetorical trick, feel free.

First you said the person needs to recognize they're raging, then you're saying "Society is to blame"? It's purely on the poor impulse control of the person, not society.

Should Bi-polar/schizophrenics seek out treatment? I doubt most are capable without the intervention/help of others.

This conversation isn't going anywhere productive. I'm done. I feel sorry for everyone concerned including the shooter.

OMFG, it's NOT ****ing *EVIL*!

No such thing!

Chico23231

Regardless of mental state, Belcher is certainly not a victim. Lets be clear.

Chiefs, family and team has handled this about as well as anyone could have. Its a tough, sad situation for all.

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CRedskinsRule

as you said, please provide evidence to support this. We don't know near enough about the limits of the brain capacities to say what makes someone snap. The whole point of saying someone snapped means they went past a point where there mental capacity to respond rationally was there. Explain please how societal pressure at that moment would make a hill of beans difference. The answer is in that moment it doesn't. Geez. Don't make me snap!

Ruhskins

I think you are trying to make a complicated situation into something simple.

Oh and those disrespectful people who you are dictating how should feel and cope just created a trust fund for that little girl.

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punch it in

I include the teammates when i say people he traumatized. I feel horrible for them and the fact that they had to digest all of this and play that day. If a friend of mine or my brother killed my sister in law in front of my mother i do not think i could just go to work the next day. However i would still have to face the fact that my brother was a cold blooded killer and i probably would not be building a monument of sorts in his honor.

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"Coaches who can outline plays on a black board are a dime a dozen. The ones who win get inside their player and motivate." Vince Lombardi

punch it in

It is sad that Belcher did this in every aspect including Belcher as a person. But before you call anyone a moron for calling him a killer - which he is by the way. Ask yourself one question. What if it was your friend, daughter , or sister? What if that was your niece or granddaughter he orphaned. Because they were those things to other people. Would you than say - oh he was a good person who made one horrible mistake? No you would think of him only as a coward and a killer. Im putting myself and my thoughts in the shoes and minds of the true victims here.
Edit: i can only imagine what some people are saying. I have never walked in Belchers shoes and for all i know he was completely out of his head mentally to do what he did. So was Rae Carruth im sure. Somewhere Belchers soul is realizing what he did and he must live with it for all of eternity. That is what i believe. Im sure the guy was slightly (obviously an understatement) unstable . However he was stable enough to drive himself to the stadium and thank his coach and gm for everything they did for him so it sounds like he was pretty aware of his actions. The tribute in his locker was in horrible taste and the true victims here are the friends and family of the girlfriend and daughter.

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"Coaches who can outline plays on a black board are a dime a dozen. The ones who win get inside their player and motivate." Vince Lombardi

punch it in

Im sorry for the rants here but im confused about something. What makes Belcher different than any other person who has ever killed an innocent person? My brothers best friend and wife were gunned down by a maniac killer after the man slit his granddaughters throat in front of his daughter. Believe when i tell you that the fact the guy was a psychopath means nothing to my brother or us or the family members. For the absolute life of me i cannot comprehend that the Chiefs hung his jersey in his locker and paid tribute to him. Columbine was a sad situation, but has anyone ever thought "gee its a shame about that boy and what he must have been going through?" What exactly makes Belchers situation different than anyother cold blooded killer? Imo one life is as valuable as one million lives.

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"Coaches who can outline plays on a black board are a dime a dozen. The ones who win get inside their player and motivate." Vince Lombardi

Gary84Clark

squawk should be spelled sqwawk right?

punch it in

No its squawk and im very passionate about this particular thread because i have been affected personally by a murderer. So again im sorry for my rants but i just dont get the fact that their seems to be a gray area here. The man killed - he is a killer, and other than - "this scumbag took a life and hurt alot of people (including his teammates" - imo there is nothing else to say about it! It is no different than any other murder!
Im done.

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"Coaches who can outline plays on a black board are a dime a dozen. The ones who win get inside their player and motivate." Vince Lombardi