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To Read Option, or Not

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Old 03-14-2013, 08:43 PM   #31
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“I’ve probably spoke to 20 scouts today [at the West Virginia Pro Day workout] and what everyone is doing right now is preparing to stop this read option this whole offseason,” Jaworski said. “Either the QB is going to get crushed or someone is going to stop it. I think it’s going to be a combination of both.”

He added that Eagles coach Chip Kelly will not be able to run his Oregon offense at the NFL level. “Categorically, it will not work,” Jaworski said.

From Ron Jaworski.
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Old 03-15-2013, 05:19 AM   #32
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Re: To Read Option, or Not

I think we should truly "sprinkle" it in. I remember an interview with RG stating how they "sprinkle it in". Sike. That wasnt a sprinkle that was damn near the whole salt shaker. Shanny needs to make sure they call keepers far and between.
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Old 03-15-2013, 11:38 AM   #33
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Re: To Read Option, or Not

If we abandon it, we're not utilizing Griffin's talent to its fullest potential.

Until the league catches up and learns how to stop it, keep going pedal to the metal.

I do not believe the league's defenses CAN stop it. It's not a scheme that they have to figure out like Hideo Nomo's quirky wind-up or the Dolphin's Wildcat experiment...you can't really learn something that presents itself as completely unpredictable. Griffin's fake handoffs are like Houdini's tricks. He's so good at hiding the ball so well that no one knows where it is that you can't learn how to defend it. It will always freeze defenders and send them in the wrong directions. It's not something they can adjust to, they have to either hesitate until they know for sure who has the ball, or they have to gamble one way or the other. Maybe a new defensive alignment can be developed to try to cover the field better, but the offense is based on causing the defense to guess and react.

I don't see this being a fading trend. It works. We have changed the way the pro game is played.
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Old 03-15-2013, 11:43 AM   #34
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Re: To Read Option, or Not

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Originally Posted by REDSKINS4ever View Post
The read option should continue to be valuable play in the Redskins scheme of things. I say we should keep it. Because it was from a college football playbook, I was surprised how NFL defenses had all types of problems stopping the read option all season long. Will there ever come a time when RG3 will run the tradition Shanahan modified West Coast Offense? Probably so...but until then the coaches should continue to implement what's been working.
If he really slows down or injuries pile up and we really need to make protecting him a priority, we'll revert to Mike Shanahans QB rollouts that worked with Elway, Plummer and Cousins vs. Cleveland.

I THOUGHT this is what we'd run with RGIII. He fakes a handoff and rolls out with the option to take off running if there is no open receivers. I never imagined the offense we have now. I don't think anyone saw it coming.
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Old 03-15-2013, 11:43 AM   #35
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Re: To Read Option, or Not

MD hit one part of exactly right, Griffin's fakes are amazing, both he and Morris have said they really don't know who will get it until the last split second. That will freeze the defender each time. What you did see in the SB was the Ravens taking a shot at CK nearly each time, but I think that was on CK, he held his fake too long letting the defender get near him. Griffin's decision making and execution is a huge part of making it work at the NFL level.
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Old 03-15-2013, 11:52 AM   #36
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Re: To Read Option, or Not

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Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule View Post
MD hit one part of exactly right, Griffin's fakes are amazing, both he and Morris have said they really don't know who will get it until the last split second. That will freeze the defender each time. What you did see in the SB was the Ravens taking a shot at CK nearly each time, but I think that was on CK, he held his fake too long letting the defender get near him. Griffin's decision making and execution is a huge part of making it work at the NFL level.
Exactly. The only way defenses can stop it is if Griffin has some sort of "tell" that defenses learn to pick up on to know what he's going to do with the ball.
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Old 03-15-2013, 12:01 PM   #37
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Re: To Read Option, or Not

We're not getting rid of it and defenses aren't going to "figure it out" enough to eliminate it. What we won't be able to do probably is take it and utilize it for 80-100% of a particular game plan like we did once in a while last year. It will have to be a component of a more diverse game plan like it was for us most of the time last year.

In the end all the other punk teams can run it and have it neutralized but they don't have who we have to run it. THAT makes a huge difference.
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Old 03-15-2013, 12:09 PM   #38
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Re: To Read Option, or Not

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Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule View Post
MD hit one part of exactly right, Griffin's fakes are amazing, both he and Morris have said they really don't know who will get it until the last split second. That will freeze the defender each time. What you did see in the SB was the Ravens taking a shot at CK nearly each time, but I think that was on CK, he held his fake too long letting the defender get near him. Griffin's decision making and execution is a huge part of making it work at the NFL level.
I agree with the bolded statement, but what most people seem to forget about when it comes to the read option. It is used in college to replace someone who doesnt throw well but is athletic. The people saying it will be stopped tend to refer to that some colleges are already shutting it down.

The problem is that you dont draft a QB in the NFL who you dont believe can throw. Stack the defense to stop the read option, and RG3 will go over the top. Keep showing that look and OC's are smart enough to show the read option look but bring in a blocker last second to seal off the the people looking for the read option and pass over the top of it.

The read option is not the offense. It is a play within the entire whole. That makes it something that you cant deploy 11 players on defense to stop, you still have to respect the fact that RG3, Kaep, and Wilson can all throw the ball. That respect is not always there in college when it comes to the read option, and rightly so.
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Old 03-15-2013, 12:59 PM   #39
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Re: To Read Option, or Not

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I agree with the bolded statement, but what most people seem to forget about when it comes to the read option. It is used in college to replace someone who doesnt throw well but is athletic. The people saying it will be stopped tend to refer to that some colleges are already shutting it down.

The problem is that you dont draft a QB in the NFL who you dont believe can throw. Stack the defense to stop the read option, and RG3 will go over the top. Keep showing that look and OC's are smart enough to show the read option look but bring in a blocker last second to seal off the the people looking for the read option and pass over the top of it.

The read option is not the offense. It is a play within the entire whole. That makes it something that you cant deploy 11 players on defense to stop, you still have to respect the fact that RG3, Kaep, and Wilson can all throw the ball. That respect is not always there in college when it comes to the read option, and rightly so.
Very good points
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Old 03-15-2013, 01:31 PM   #40
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Re: To Read Option, or Not

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Only idiots who don't know what they're talking about think the read option offense somehow puts rg3 at greater risk of injury. As long as the offense works, keep running it.


I mean, the sheer ignorance of this statement is why I wonder/have wondered if you're a kid. Historical evidence, logic and basic common sense are completely at odds with this nonsense you continue to spout.

1. Running QBs by and large tend to break down faster than pocket passers, period. Again, how is it that you can be a football fan and not recognize this most simple of observations?

2. Statistically speaking (here's the logic angle) the more hits any player takes, but especially a QB much smaller than the defenders he faces, increases the risk of injury. Can really bad hits/injuries happen in the pocket? Of course, as everybody wants to bring Tom Brady into this debate. Guess what, it took Brady nearly 10 years to suffer a season ending injury, while RG suffered one in less than 10 months.

3. Common sense, son. Just plain common sense. You're opening up your franchise player to ferocious hits in the most brutal sport in the world.

The "perfect world" argument, of RG learning/knowing when to slide or drop to the turf or get out of bounce is as nonsensical as ignoring the above realities. Nobody's perfect to begin with. Add to it this is a sport where things happen in an instant, defenders appear from seemingly nowhere, and they're all gonna be head-hunting RG when he becomes a runner, it's hard for me to fathom why any Redskins/RG fan would prefer over exposing him. Wonders never cease...
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Old 03-15-2013, 02:11 PM   #41
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Re: To Read Option, or Not

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I mean, the sheer ignorance of this statement is why I wonder/have wondered if you're a kid. Historical evidence, logic and basic common sense are completely at odds with this nonsense you continue to spout.

1. Running QBs by and large tend to break down faster than pocket passers, period. Again, how is it that you can be a football fan and not recognize this most simple of observations?

2. Statistically speaking (here's the logic angle) the more hits any player takes, but especially a QB much smaller than the defenders he faces, increases the risk of injury. Can really bad hits/injuries happen in the pocket? Of course, as everybody wants to bring Tom Brady into this debate. Guess what, it took Brady nearly 10 years to suffer a season ending injury, while RG suffered one in less than 10 months.

3. Common sense, son. Just plain common sense. You're opening up your franchise player to ferocious hits in the most brutal sport in the world.

The "perfect world" argument, of RG learning/knowing when to slide or drop to the turf or get out of bounce is as nonsensical as ignoring the above realities. Nobody's perfect to begin with. Add to it this is a sport where things happen in an instant, defenders appear from seemingly nowhere, and they're all gonna be head-hunting RG when he becomes a runner, it's hard for me to fathom why any Redskins/RG fan would prefer over exposing him. Wonders never cease...
Running QB's tend to get hurt because they dont throw the ball away. Vick is considered a running QB, but honestly how many times was that a called run? Steve Young was a running QB, but how many times was that a called run. When RG3 has been injured, how many were called runs?

I say it has more to do with the O-line myself. Dont force them to scramble, and they wont. If you are afraid of a QB with legs, then a QB with legs shouldnt be drafted.

Brady and Peyton shouldnt even be in this conversation. They dont suffer a ton of injuries due to how quickly they read the defense and how quickly they get the ball out of their hands. In other words, they are great at avoiding hits. Had RG3 stepped out of bounds against the Ravens and Falcons, are we even having this discussion?
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Old 03-16-2013, 05:48 AM   #42
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Re: To Read Option, or Not

Rg does have amazing fakes and that can still be utilized. Thing is the hit that did him in.. If you go back and look he was on his way down. Tough getting to the ground when you move like he does he looks like hes gonna twist his ankle the few times I saw him slide quickly because it's not like he didn't ever slide I saw him.
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Old 03-16-2013, 06:50 AM   #43
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Rg does have amazing fakes and that can still be utilized. Thing is the hit that did him in.. If you go back and look he was on his way down. Tough getting to the ground when you move like he does he looks like hes gonna twist his ankle the few times I saw him slide quickly because it's not like he didn't ever slide I saw him.
he isn't Jason Campbell bad at sliding, his problem is more related to his competitive nature, on the Ngata play he could have cut outside and go out of bounds, but we would have had a longer 4th down. His competitive instinct took him inside to get a few more yards and Ngata got him at a bad angle. It has nothing to do with the zone read plays, or even pocket passing. Every bad hit came from Griffin not wanting to give up when he saw a sliver of opportunity, he will be successful if he can reset his internal gauge for success from college speed openings to pro speed openings, and only game experience will prove that one way or the other.
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Old 03-16-2013, 09:50 AM   #44
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Re: To Read Option, or Not

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Goat View Post


I mean, the sheer ignorance of this statement is why I wonder/have wondered if you're a kid. Historical evidence, logic and basic common sense are completely at odds with this nonsense you continue to spout.

1. Running QBs by and large tend to break down faster than pocket passers, period. Again, how is it that you can be a football fan and not recognize this most simple of observations?

2. Statistically speaking (here's the logic angle) the more hits any player takes, but especially a QB much smaller than the defenders he faces, increases the risk of injury. Can really bad hits/injuries happen in the pocket? Of course, as everybody wants to bring Tom Brady into this debate. Guess what, it took Brady nearly 10 years to suffer a season ending injury, while RG suffered one in less than 10 months.

3. Common sense, son. Just plain common sense. You're opening up your franchise player to ferocious hits in the most brutal sport in the world.

The "perfect world" argument, of RG learning/knowing when to slide or drop to the turf or get out of bounce is as nonsensical as ignoring the above realities. Nobody's perfect to begin with. Add to it this is a sport where things happen in an instant, defenders appear from seemingly nowhere, and they're all gonna be head-hunting RG when he becomes a runner, it's hard for me to fathom why any Redskins/RG fan would prefer over exposing him. Wonders never cease...
RG is a very good passer, but he will also be a running QB whether we run the read-option of not. Again as others have said many times, RG took the worst hits scrambling, not on the read-option.

So the question is, does the read-option increase the chance of RG taking vicious shots? Last season says that the confusion and hesitation inflicted on opposing defenses actually reduced the risk.

If you want to reduce RG's vulnerabilities as a running QB, you have to make him stop scrambling, extending plays, and running upfield on broken plays. That's why running QBs don't last, before and since the read-option was introduced to the NFL.
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Old 03-16-2013, 10:00 AM   #45
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Re: To Read Option, or Not

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Let's go for the breach of etiquette, and straight to the triple dog dare
The dreaded triple dog dare.
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