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Did We Shoot Ourselves In The Foot??

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Old 03-08-2005, 12:50 PM   #61
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Re: Did We Shoot Ourselves In The Foot??

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Originally Posted by Daseal
But he wanted a trade.

Didn't he ask to be released? Thats why we didn't release him because we wanted something in return.
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Old 03-08-2005, 01:20 PM   #62
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Re: Did We Shoot Ourselves In The Foot??

Tahoe, please read this article. This is why I'm glad that LC is gone. Hopefully you can understand where I'm coming from.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...les/index.html
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Old 03-08-2005, 01:22 PM   #63
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Re: Did We Shoot Ourselves In The Foot??

Well - more than anything he wanted out.
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Old 03-08-2005, 03:00 PM   #64
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Re: Did We Shoot Ourselves In The Foot??

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Originally Posted by Redskins_P
Tahoe, please read this article. This is why I'm glad that LC is gone. Hopefully you can understand where I'm coming from.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...les/index.html
Good story. Thanks. It's nice to hear Coles' story upfront. However, that doesn't change my opinion.

Don't get me wrong. I don't blame Coles for wanting to leave. If I was in his shoes, I would want to leave too! No changing the fact that our offense stinks, and like Coles, I have my doubts that our offensive scheme will improve much at all next year (particularly now that we have no Cap room to get a few more quality players on offense). Yes, I NEVER blamed Coles for wanting to leave, even though I see me wasting more money for another frustrating year of DirecTV.

And don't misunderstand me. I'm a huge Gibbs fan for what he did in the past, and for what he's trying to do now. And I'm also a big Snyder supporter for all the money he spends trying to make my favorite team better. Yes, I'm a true Redskin faithful. But that doesn't change my opinion that Snyder and Gibbs screwed up. And you can't blame Vinnie either. Responsibility lies at the top.

And don't think I don't understand where you're coming from. I was never opposed to getting rid of Coles if that's what he wanted. What I'm disgusted about is the way it was done; the way we let Coles have his way at the expense of our Cap. A $9.3 million Cap hit is devastating. You can't deny that! I'm a contracts lawyer, and while I admit that there may be something pertinent here about NFL contracts that I'm not aware of, I'm still incredulous about how poorly this was negotiated! I'm still looking for a good reason as to how this benefits us. Somebody please tell me! Surely, a straight-up Coles for Moss swap doesn't benefit us greatly - if at all. But when you consider the $9.3 million Cap hit we took, the $5 million check we have to write the Jets next year, and the No. 1 draft choice we gave up in getting Coles, My God: We got royally screwed! It's monumental stupidity. That's up there right behind the Vikings giving up 11 players for Herschel Walker.

My point is: If I had been Snyder (as owner and chief of personnel or whatever he is), or Coach Gibbs (as Prez), you tell Coles I don't care what you were told. If you want out, Buddy, you've got to renegotiate your contract to avoid a devastating hit to my team. Otherwise, go look at that big screen I bought you and SHUT THE F___ UP!!!!!

Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but benching a disgruntled Coles would have cost the Skins only about $1.3 million a year for the next 3 years. That's a lot better than $9.3 mil this year. UNBELIEVEABLE!!

What will be interesting to me is to hear player reaction. How do the players REALLY feel about having the money it would have taken to improve ourself this season heading on a downtown train to New York?

Yours truly.
Relaxed but Still Incredulous
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Old 03-08-2005, 03:18 PM   #65
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Re: Did We Shoot Ourselves In The Foot??

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Originally Posted by Tahoe Skin
Good story. Thanks. It's nice to hear Coles' story upfront. However, that doesn't change my opinion.

Don't get me wrong. I don't blame Coles for wanting to leave. If I was in his shoes, I would want to leave too! No changing the fact that our offense stinks, and like Coles, I have my doubts that our offensive scheme will improve much at all next year (particularly now that we have no Cap room to get a few more quality players on offense). Yes, I NEVER blamed Coles for wanting to leave, even though I see me wasting more money for another frustrating year of DirecTV.

And don't misunderstand me. I'm a huge Gibbs fan for what he did in the past, and for what he's trying to do now. And I'm also a big Snyder supporter for all the money he spends trying to make my favorite team better. Yes, I'm a true Redskin faithful. But that doesn't change my opinion that Snyder and Gibbs screwed up. And you can't blame Vinnie either. Responsibility lies at the top.

And don't think I don't understand where you're coming from. I was never opposed to getting rid of Coles if that's what he wanted. What I'm disgusted about is the way it was done; the way we let Coles have his way at the expense of our Cap. A $9.3 million Cap hit is devastating. You can't deny that! I'm a contracts lawyer, and while I admit that there may be something pertinent here about NFL contracts that I'm not aware of, I'm still incredulous about how poorly this was negotiated! I'm still looking for a good reason as to how this benefits us. Somebody please tell me! Surely, a straight-up Coles for Moss swap doesn't benefit us greatly - if at all. But when you consider the $9.3 million Cap hit we took, the $5 million check we have to write the Jets next year, and the No. 1 draft choice we gave up in getting Coles, My God: We got royally screwed! It's monumental stupidity. That's up there right behind the Vikings giving up 11 players for Herschel Walker.

My point is: If I had been Snyder (as owner and chief of personnel or whatever he is), or Coach Gibbs (as Prez), you tell Coles I don't care what you were told. If you want out, Buddy, you've got to renegotiate your contract to avoid a devastating hit to my team. Otherwise, go look at that big screen I bought you and SHUT THE F___ UP!!!!!

Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but benching a disgruntled Coles would have cost the Skins only about $1.3 million a year for the next 3 years. That's a lot better than $9.3 mil this year. UNBELIEVEABLE!!

What will be interesting to me is to hear player reaction. How do the players REALLY feel about having the money it would have taken to improve ourself this season heading on a downtown train to New York?

Yours truly.
Relaxed but Still Incredulous

Good post Tahoe, and I understand what you're saying.

Like I said, we'll have to wait and see how much this will effect us on the field. Financially, yes we got a big stick up our ass. You're right about that.
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Old 03-08-2005, 03:21 PM   #66
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Re: Did We Shoot Ourselves In The Foot??

Redskin P, you've got it right. Tahoe Skin, I'm sorry to say, you don't.

Tahoe, you're being too short-sighted. You're considering the 2005 salary cap, which is good, but you're not giving one iota of thought to the 2006 cap situation. Before the Coles trade, the Redskins were projecting to have a salary cap total of $107 million in 2006. After trading him, their 2006 cap situation projects to be $100 million. By the way, the salary cap has been rising at about 6% a year or so, which means the 2006 salary cap will be about $90 million. So you're saying keeping Coles would be a good idea, even though it would have us $17 million over the cap instead of $10 million over it? Not only that, but you're advocating the signing of even more free agents this year, a CB, a DE, and whatever else you wanted.
In other words, if the team were in your hands, you'd run it right into the ground in 2006. You'd have to jettison great guys who want to be here, people like LaVar and Jansen, and forget about resigning Patrick Ramsey.
I'd rather drop a guy who doesn't want to be here now if it means I have a fighting chance at keeping the guys who want to be here in 2006 and beyond. Laveraneus Coles is not worth blowing up the team for in 2006.

It's this kind of short-sighted thinking that has gotten the Redskins into trouble in the Dan Snyder era. It's about time we started looking down the road, do some serious planning, and build something that is meant to last.
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Old 03-08-2005, 03:29 PM   #67
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Re: Did We Shoot Ourselves In The Foot??

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Originally Posted by Schneed10
Redskin P, you've got it right. Tahoe Skin, I'm sorry to say, you don't.

Tahoe, you're being too short-sighted. You're considering the 2005 salary cap, which is good, but you're not giving one iota of thought to the 2006 cap situation. Before the Coles trade, the Redskins were projecting to have a salary cap total of $107 million in 2006. After trading him, their 2006 cap situation projects to be $100 million. By the way, the salary cap has been rising at about 6% a year or so, which means the 2006 salary cap will be about $90 million. So you're saying keeping Coles would be a good idea, even though it would have us $17 million over the cap instead of $10 million over it? Not only that, but you're advocating the signing of even more free agents this year, a CB, a DE, and whatever else you wanted.
In other words, if the team were in your hands, you'd run it right into the ground in 2006. You'd have to jettison great guys who want to be here, people like LaVar and Jansen, and forget about resigning Patrick Ramsey.
I'd rather drop a guy who doesn't want to be here now if it means I have a fighting chance at keeping the guys who want to be here in 2006 and beyond. Laveraneus Coles is not worth blowing up the team for in 2006.

It's this kind of short-sighted thinking that has gotten the Redskins into trouble in the Dan Snyder era. It's about time we started looking down the road, do some serious planning, and build something that is meant to last.
From what I understand the salary cap is based on the TV contracts which will end after this season, and it is expected that the new one willraise the salary cap substantially, which may actually bring it to closer to $100 million. If that happens, we should be in good shape.
Also, I'm just going by what I've read from people who seem to know more about it.
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Old 03-08-2005, 03:35 PM   #68
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Re: Did We Shoot Ourselves In The Foot??

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Originally Posted by SkinsRock
From what I understand the salary cap is based on the TV contracts which will end after this season, and it is expected that the new one willraise the salary cap substantially, which may actually bring it to closer to $100 million. If that happens, we should be in good shape.
Also, I'm just going by what I've read from people who seem to know more about it.
That's a pretty big IF there isn't it? Even if it does get up to $100 million, keeping Coles still would have had us well over the limit. Getting rid of his ass now is in the best interests of our team's ability to build a consistently winning program.
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Old 03-08-2005, 04:09 PM   #69
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Re: Did We Shoot Ourselves In The Foot??

The cap IS going to go up substantially in 2007. Probably on the order of 11-15% making it closer to 100-103. That is what is expected by all who know what they are talking about. Teams like the skins have prepared for it already.
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Old 03-08-2005, 04:54 PM   #70
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Re: Did We Shoot Ourselves In The Foot??

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The cap IS going to go up substantially in 2007. Probably on the order of 11-15% making it closer to 100-103. That is what is expected by all who know what they are talking about. Teams like the skins have prepared for it already.
Did you mean to say 2006? Because if it gets to $100 million in 2007 that doesn't help us much.

Cutting Coles is just another way of preparing the team for cap-longevity in 2006 and beyond. Someone had to go at some point to make it under the cap, might as well have been a malcontent. That's all I'm sayin.
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Old 03-08-2005, 05:09 PM   #71
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Re: Did We Shoot Ourselves In The Foot??

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Originally Posted by Schneed10
Before the Coles trade, the Redskins were projecting to have a salary cap total of $107 million in 2006. After trading him, their 2006 cap situation projects to be $100 million. By the way, the salary cap has been rising at about 6% a year or so, which means the 2006 salary cap will be about $90 million. So you're saying keeping Coles would be a good idea, even though it would have us $17 million over the cap instead of $10 million over it?
Funny thing about throwing numbers around. Your numbers seem to be higher than the ones I've seen. But perhaps you have better numbers than the Washington Times, which in today's article flatly disagrees with your assessment in stating:

"The trade of Coles back to the Jets means the Redskins will take a huge salary cap hit next season (Washington also lost a first-round draft pick when they acquired the restricted free agent in 2003)."

http://www.washtimes.com/sports/2005...0841-3835r.htm

In any case, yes I would rather spread out the Cap hit over several years, rather than have it come crashing down as it has this year.
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Old 03-08-2005, 06:20 PM   #72
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Re: Did We Shoot Ourselves In The Foot??

Don't believe anything regarding the cap in the WT, I have no idea where they get their info but it's usually way off.
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Old 03-08-2005, 06:28 PM   #73
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Re: Did We Shoot Ourselves In The Foot??

we have the space this year, we don't have the space next year... so better now than later.
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Old 03-08-2005, 06:30 PM   #74
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Re: Did We Shoot Ourselves In The Foot??

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Don't believe anything regarding the cap in the WT, I have no idea where they get their info but it's usually way off.
Oh, I don't believe anything ANYONE says about Cap figures. Not even statements coming from the Redskins front office.
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Old 03-08-2005, 06:51 PM   #75
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Re: Did We Shoot Ourselves In The Foot??

Calia there is no upside to Borrows
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