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Around the NFL 2013 Offseason (Version 5150)

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Old 06-26-2013, 06:09 PM   #196
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Re: Around the NFL 2013 Offseason (Version 5150)

Early evidence definitely not looking good for Hernandez. I gave him the benefit of the doubt when I first heard about this, but I have a hard time believing he didn't have any role in this. If he is guilty, it will be a shame, and he'll just be the next name in a long line of talented people who threw it all away over some dumb shit.
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Old 06-26-2013, 06:11 PM   #197
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Re: Around the NFL 2013 Offseason (Version 5150)

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
Weren't there 4 people in the car? How has there been no mention at all of the other two guys?
My assumption is Chrissy and Paulie have already knockoff and buried these two at the farm on the orders of Aaron Hernandez Soprano.
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Old 06-26-2013, 06:33 PM   #198
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Re: Around the NFL 2013 Offseason (Version 5150)

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Originally Posted by CultBrennan59 View Post
^DUDE! Innocent until proven guilty! Gosh! (/sarcasm)
Go to China. They convict people without allowing them a defense all the time. You'll fit right in.
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Old 06-26-2013, 06:46 PM   #199
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Re: Around the NFL 2013 Offseason (Version 5150)

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Originally Posted by CultBrennan59 View Post
^DUDE! Innocent until proven guilty! Gosh! (/sarcasm)
I don't get your sarcasm. Neither Lotus, nor I, ever said disregard forensic evidence, prosecutorial statements, or "hard" circumstantial evidence presented in court. But, we (the collective internet jury pool) had NONE of that up until around 2pm today. Before any of that, it was and is reasonable to say "let's wait and see". Today, based on presentation in court - sh** got real.
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Old 06-26-2013, 06:51 PM   #200
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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
Weren't there 4 people in the car? How has there been no mention at all of the other two guys?
The DA referenced them as being with Hernandez both before and after the murder saying surveillance cams showed AH and two friends accompanied the victim. Their names are being withheld. The DA is saying the murder was orchestrated by AH.

Was rereading DA's statements. Apparently, there is footage of AH with a gun before and after the murder. The gun used to kill the victim was matched by ballistics with the gun AH used in the May incident for which he is being sued in a civil action. This particular gun is now missing and was not found when the home was searched although two others were.
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Old 06-26-2013, 06:51 PM   #201
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Re: Around the NFL 2013 Offseason (Version 5150)

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I don't get your sarcasm. Neither Lotus, nor I, ever said disregard forensic evidence, prosecutorial statements, or "hard" circumstantial evidence presented in court. But, we (the collective internet jury pool) had NONE of that up until around 2pm today. Before any of that, it was and is reasonable to say "let's wait and see". Today, based on presentation in court - sh** got real.
Although it is still possible that someone else in the car besides Hernandez did the actual shooting.

It also is true that we have only heard from the prosecution, not the defense. If every trial were prosecution-only, DA's would never lose in court. And we would have a justice system like China's.
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Old 06-26-2013, 06:56 PM   #202
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Re: Around the NFL 2013 Offseason (Version 5150)

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Although it is still possible that someone else in the car besides Hernandez did the actual shooting.
And that is definitely true. But in felony murder, if he was in the car at the same time he will be charged as if he pulled the trigger.

In my opinion, with the court testimony today, short of some huge frame up, which no one is alleging yet, I think a reasonable person can make some basic judgements. Still, I would hope that the jurors that here this case, if no plea deal follows, would go in with the belief that the cops, prosecutors, and DA's office have the burden to show he is guilty beyond reasonable doubt.

My issue always is people riding the wave of immediate, unverified, items that people are pulling out left and right.
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Old 06-26-2013, 07:00 PM   #203
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Court has issued a gag order so I think this all we will hear for a while.
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Old 06-26-2013, 07:07 PM   #204
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Re: Around the NFL 2013 Offseason (Version 5150)

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And that is definitely true. But in felony murder, if he was in the car at the same time he will be charged as if he pulled the trigger.

In my opinion, with the court testimony today, short of some huge frame up, which no one is alleging yet, I think a reasonable person can make some basic judgements. Still, I would hope that the jurors that here this case, if no plea deal follows, would go in with the belief that the cops, prosecutors, and DA's office have the burden to show he is guilty beyond reasonable doubt.

My issue always is people riding the wave of immediate, unverified, items that people are pulling out left and right.
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Old 06-26-2013, 07:11 PM   #205
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If the police have followed the proper procedures, protected the chain of custody, and have solid forensic evidence of all the things asserted by the DA, AH should cut the best deal he can get. However, those are some significant "ifs". Perhaps the forensics is more fuzzy then the DA asserts. Perhaps there is a gap in the survelliance that AH says "that's when I left". Perhaps the surveillance photos aren't as clear as the prosecutor says (" that's a book not a gun" ), perhaps perhaps perhaps. It's why we have trials.

Me? I think he is guilty and that the prosecutor wouldn't be making such detailed allegations in this very high profile case unless he could back it up. No prosecutor wants to be accused of "OJ'ing" it.
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Old 06-26-2013, 08:50 PM   #206
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Re: Around the NFL 2013 Offseason (Version 5150)

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If the police have followed the proper procedures, protected the chain of custody, and have solid forensic evidence of all the things asserted by the DA, AH should cut the best deal he can get. However, those are some significant "ifs". Perhaps the forensics is more fuzzy then the DA asserts. Perhaps there is a gap in the survelliance that AH says "that's when I left". Perhaps the surveillance photos aren't as clear as the prosecutor says (" that's a book not a gun" ), perhaps perhaps perhaps. It's why we have trials.

Me? I think he is guilty and that the prosecutor wouldn't be making such detailed allegations in this very high profile case unless he could back it up. No prosecutor wants to be accused of "OJ'ing" it.
I could see that....
AND there is no mention of a glove....so that's good.
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Old 06-26-2013, 08:56 PM   #207
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Re: Around the NFL 2013 Offseason (Version 5150)

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Old 06-26-2013, 10:11 PM   #208
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Old 06-26-2013, 10:18 PM   #209
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Can someone remind me what the 'evidence' was on Ray Lewis back in 00? I forget what they said he did. Did he have like a bloody T-shirt or something?
See my post @ 118 and the article I referenced.
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Old 06-26-2013, 10:25 PM   #210
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At least in China they don't waste a bunch of tax dollars and time to put and obviously guilty person on a long trial, years from the arrest.

Theres no such thing as a perfect court system. And you're going to have more people in the world that speculate/assume/are fully confident that someone is guilty, especially in a high profile cases like this one.

Its ok to speculate or guess on something like this. This is why we're here, its a discussion board; we discuss things here. I get your argument. I've been getting your argument, I just don't like your take on it, just as much as you don't like my take.

Quick question though for you, If there was evidence that were to come out showing a video tape of Aaron Hernandez coming into his house with a bloody T-shirt and gun and him clearly saying "I can't believe I just killed Odin Lloyd," your saying we shouldn't say he's clearly guilty until hes had his day in court, correct?
a jury shouldn't say he is guilty till both sides present their arguments. commenters on a website probably wouldn't wait, but even in your scenario I can think mental health reasons and frames that would end up clearing a mans name to some degree if not entirely.
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