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One Night Only: Offensive Packers-Redskins Game Review, Mythbusters Edition

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Old 09-18-2013, 09:30 AM   #76
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Re: One Night Only: Offensive Packers-Redskins Game Review, Mythbusters Edition

Green bay secondary is flat out garbage. Our guys match up with them just fine.

Yes decision making is a problem.

I'd say this, RG3 problems are an easy fix compared to protection and game planning at this point. Coaches on the o-side have had there asses handed to them.

Unless we push Polumbus off a cliff, that problem is never going to be fixed.
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Old 09-18-2013, 09:33 AM   #77
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Re: One Night Only: Offensive Packers-Redskins Game Review, Mythbusters Edition

RG3 has a qbr rating of two !!! in the first half of games this yr.How anybody thinks he looks good or comfortable is beyond me.The garbage time stats in the 2nd half mean nothing
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Old 09-18-2013, 09:35 AM   #78
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Re: One Night Only: Offensive Packers-Redskins Game Review, Mythbusters Edition

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Seems pretty obvious he's not 100% comfortable in the pocket, now whether it's due to all the blitzes he's facing, the knee, or maybe a combo of both, who knows. All I know is he's not the same guy he was last year, at least to this point.
I think it definitely has to do with his comfort level and the fact that the defense does not respect his legs. He is trying to change how he plays to go along with the physical and mental issues that come from his surgery. He will get back just dont know when...
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Old 09-18-2013, 09:36 AM   #79
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Re: One Night Only: Offensive Packers-Redskins Game Review, Mythbusters Edition

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Just some disagreements about football. Nothing deeper than that. Nothing some wins won't fix
Thats good to know. Any word on if Has is going to come back to the sidelines?
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Old 09-18-2013, 09:38 AM   #80
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Re: One Night Only: Offensive Packers-Redskins Game Review, Mythbusters Edition

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RG3 lowest QB rating in the league in the first half of games 33.3%, second half is the 5th highest. His completion % is 45.8 (11/24) in the first half. His accuracy is a problem.

So when the defense softens, he does well.

NBC Sports.

RG3 is not comfy in the pocket and his mechanics are inconsistent and not stable.
It's not like the defense is softening considerably in the second half.

End of the fourth quarter, sure. Problem is, the Redskins did not have the ball at the end of the fourth quarter: Green Bay just ran out the clock on them.

As far as true garbage time, plays where the defense has no incentive to stop the first down because they want the clock to run, it's applicable to just one drive this year: the second TD drive to Hankerson against Philadelphia. But even that touchdown pass was thrown against a defensive call that should have defended it.

All analysis of the Redskins season needs to be aware of the fact that they've been playing from behind the entire time. But its easy to say that the defense is doing something different that leads to better results for the Redskins in the second half...when you don't actually check to make sure that's true.

It's a pretty ridiculous split, and I do think the Redskins offensive coaches are changing things up at the half (to adjust to the defense), but I think the things that the defenses are doing in the first half are close to what their doing in the second.
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Old 09-18-2013, 09:42 AM   #81
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Re: One Night Only: Offensive Packers-Redskins Game Review, Mythbusters Edition

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Seems pretty obvious he's not 100% comfortable in the pocket, now whether it's due to all the blitzes he's facing, the knee, or maybe a combo of both, who knows. All I know is he's not the same guy he was last year, at least to this point.
I really think that fans are less comfortable watching RG3 play than he is actually playing.

And who could blame them, it's an uncomfortable team watch right now. The whole team looks out of their element.

It's a silly thing to place on the quarterback, but he's the guy with the highly scrutinized rehab, so it isn't shocking.
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Old 09-18-2013, 09:46 AM   #82
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Re: One Night Only: Offensive Packers-Redskins Game Review, Mythbusters Edition

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Green bay secondary is flat out garbage. Our guys match up with them just fine.

Yes decision making is a problem.

I'd say this, RG3 problems are an easy fix compared to protection and game planning at this point. Coaches on the o-side have had there asses handed to them.

Unless we push Polumbus off a cliff, that problem is never going to be fixed.
We had a lot of guys that produced against GB on the offensive side. RG3, Hankerson, Jordan Reed, Garcon, Morris, Trent, Kory, and Moss all showed up to play.

I'm less discouraged after GB about the offensive skill talent. Morgan's performance sticks out like a sore thumb, and Will Montgomery was really bad, but two problems are much more correctable than everybody.
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Old 09-18-2013, 09:48 AM   #83
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Re: One Night Only: Offensive Packers-Redskins Game Review, Mythbusters Edition

Anbody want to talk about the defense?

Didn't think so.
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Old 09-18-2013, 09:50 AM   #84
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Re: One Night Only: Offensive Packers-Redskins Game Review, Mythbusters Edition

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It's not like the defense is softening considerably in the second half.

End of the fourth quarter, sure. Problem is, the Redskins did not have the ball at the end of the fourth quarter: Green Bay just ran out the clock on them.

As far as true garbage time, plays where the defense has no incentive to stop the first down because they want the clock to run, it's applicable to just one drive this year: the second TD drive to Hankerson against Philadelphia. But even that touchdown pass was thrown against a defensive call that should have defended it.

All analysis of the Redskins season needs to be aware of the fact that they've been playing from behind the entire time. But its easy to say that the defense is doing something different that leads to better results for the Redskins in the second half...when you don't actually check to make sure that's true.

It's a pretty ridiculous split, and I do think the Redskins offensive coaches are changing things up at the half (to adjust to the defense), but I think the things that the defenses are doing in the first half are close to what their doing in the second.
So the defenses are playing the same coverage looks, pressure schemes and blitz packages in both halfs? CB are not playing off guys giving them routes in the second half opposed to the first half? Safeties playing at the same depth?

The Eagles didnt go prevent?

Tripp I dont go back and look at tape, but it doesnt take a scientist to see whats going on. The numbers are there, disregard them if you want.
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Old 09-18-2013, 09:55 AM   #85
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Re: One Night Only: Offensive Packers-Redskins Game Review, Mythbusters Edition

Bottom line is the entire OFFENSE is playing bad in the 1st half of games, Griffin needs to get it going now or else this season will be a lost cause. We wont come back from a 3-6 start like last season
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Old 09-18-2013, 09:55 AM   #86
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Re: One Night Only: Offensive Packers-Redskins Game Review, Mythbusters Edition

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So the defenses are playing the same coverage looks, pressure schemes and blitz packages in both halfs? CB are not playing off guys giving them routes in the second half opposed to the first half? Safeties playing at the same depth?

The Eagles didnt go prevent?

Tripp I dont go back and look at tape, but it doesnt take a scientist to see whats going on. The numbers are there, disregard them if you want.
It's not about disregarding the numbers, it's just that the Redskins have taken 60% of their snaps in the second half this year, in part because they've kicked off in the first half both times.

They haven't sustained offense in the first half, at all, which is a big factor in the losses. But we're talking about fewer than ten first half drives. Any sample of that size that doesn't produce a touchdown isn't...it's not anything. It could be random.

The second half performance suggests it's partially random.

If this first half/second half trend continues, bring it up and we'll discuss it at the bye week.
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Old 09-18-2013, 09:57 AM   #87
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Re: One Night Only: Offensive Packers-Redskins Game Review, Mythbusters Edition

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Bottom line is the entire OFFENSE is playing bad in the 1st half of games, Griffin needs to get it going now or else this season will be a lost cause. We wont come back from a 3-6 start like last season
It would be awesome if Griffin would play at a pro bowl level the rest of the way...but if he plays like he has the first two weeks the whole season, then this season's not on him.

The Redskins are a struggling team, and that should be the story after two weeks. That's what we can conclude.
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Old 09-18-2013, 09:59 AM   #88
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Re: One Night Only: Offensive Packers-Redskins Game Review, Mythbusters Edition

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The Eagles didnt go prevent?
I did not personally go through the coaches tape against the Eagles, but the people who did say they were blitzing until the last drive trying to stop us.
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Old 09-18-2013, 10:00 AM   #89
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Re: One Night Only: Offensive Packers-Redskins Game Review, Mythbusters Edition

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Felt like this was necessary today. Not so much based on the Warpath's reaction to yesterday's lost, but the media scrutiny on the team is reaching an unproductive level, and the rosy narratives from the preseason that weren't based on anything of substance have turned sour -- though they remain without substance.

I have a relatively small platform that I am going to use to set the record straight for those who are interested in deeper analysis. I'm not going to fight a war against the crazies: the narrative is still going to win the day. I'm just trying to save a few people some trouble by writing this.

Coaches Tape isn't yet available, so I've done pretty much all this off the broadcast feed. I'm not going to be telling you what percentage cover two the Redskins played. Sorry.

Redskins Myth #1: RG3 isn't 100% healthy and he's hurting the team by playing

This is probably the largest, most aggressive myth about the start to the Redskins season, because you neither need to be a Redskins fan or have watched either of their games this year to hold this opinion. But if you did watch the first half of the Eagles game, and know the Redskins started 0-2, you probably feel very strongly about this.

Futhermore, there are no shortage of people who will go on TV and basically vouch for this conclusion. These are the worst kind of people: analysts who get money to go on TV and be poor analysts. I'd be a hypocrite if I told you don't listen to anything you hear, but at least consider the source.

I can't tell you whether Griffin is 100%. I suspect that from an explosive, sprinter/athlete type of perspective, Griffin isn't going to be like that all year, if ever again. But we don't pay him to be an olympic sprinter, we pay him to be a quarterback. And from the perspective of quarterback, who dealt with injuries and quarterbacked -- he's good. He's healthy. The ball comes out with excellent velocity from a clean pocket. But if you have a Twitter account and follow Redskins beat reporters like John Keim et al, you already knew that, and aren't going to change your mind because of some mouthbreather on television (or four).

Which leads us to the seemingly more glaring issue:

Redskins Myth #2: RG3 has really struggled with throwing from the pocket in both games this season

I mean, if you slipped into a coma at halftime of the Eagles game and awoke from that coma specifically to read this article, 1) thank you and feel better soon, 2) you'd pretty much have nothing to throw you off that conclusion.

For the rest of us, it just depends if you know what you are looking at. Griffin has forced a lot more balls into tight coverage (sometimes foolishly) the first two games, and has shown a general lack of patience. He's also left very, very few plays on the field in that time.

Griffin's biggest issues are consistent with last season, well before the injury. He's struggling at times to move though his progressions with the pocket collapsing around him. His timing from the shotgun short passing game isn't good, and this can affect his accuracy. He's relatively short for a quarterback, and sometimes doesn't get a clear picture of the defense on half field reads. All of these issues are consistent with last year when he won offfensive rookie of the year. In a lot of ways, he's actually more advanced as a pocket passer now than he was last year, against all odds (you do have to throw out the first half of both games to see statistical evidence of this, which is not something I suggest you do).

The single, and possibly only, biggest difference in RG3 2013 and 2012 has nothing to do with throwing from the pocket. It's as a runner, and more generally, extending plays. Griffin has simply not been effective through two games when forced to extend a play. He hasn't risen beyond all reasonable expectation to save a crumbling team. He's mixed it up between throwing the ball away and forcing a pass to a covered receiver. And it's led to underwhelming results, which should not be a surprise.

Overall, Griffin was 26 of 40 for 320 yards, 2 TDs and a pick against Green Bay. If he has that game in a losing effort in October of last season, before the seven game winning streak raised expectations, we're talking about how advanced he is for his age. Dude is 23 years old.

Redskins Myth #3: RG3 is afraid to keep on the Read Option and Kyle Shanahan is not calling it because he is afraid Griffin will get hurt

Kyle Shanahan didn't call the read option as much as you probably remember last year. It was devastatingly effective when he did call it, but he used it carefully last year. He's doing the same this year. I don't think he's sequencing as well this year, and the defenses aren't playing nearly as scared against us this year as they were last year, and Kyle deserves real blame for this. But this isn't a read option issue.

In the handful of read options Griffin has been given this year, somewhere between 4-6 depending on how you define the play, Griffin has handed off every time.

He's made the right read every time. Alfred Morris is averaging better than 5.0 YPC this year on the read option, again, depending on how you define the play.

This is how disciplined teams defend the read option. You force the quarterback to give the football to the back, and you try to make up the numbers in the running game with safeties filling the hole.

I wish Kyle Shanahan would call the RO a lot more than he does, because it's one less defender Morris has to worry about. But Griffin is not going to get to keep very often against disciplined defenses. That's because the quickest way to get gashed on the read option is to let the quarterback outside contain. Making Griffin give to Morris on the option is choosing death by a thousand papercuts as opposed to having Griffin keep on the option, which is quick and painless.

Redskins "Myth" #4: Forget the Read Option. Kyle Shanahan hasn't called any designed runs for RG3. You mean to tell me he's not using his mobility as a weapon at ALL?

Well, pretty much, yeah. This is not a myth. Kyle and Mike have been a bit protective of RG3 -- and by extension themselves -- at the expensive of the team. But this is a minor reason, not a major reason, the Redskins are 0-2.

So wait, if the Redskins offense talent is capable of attacking and constraining defenses the way Philadelphia and Green Bay have done to ours...why have we struggled so poorly in back to back first halves?

So happy you asked, straw man Redskins fan!

The Redskins have done a number of silly things over the last (insert timeframe you are comfortable with here, not exceeding four years) with their personnel and it's lead to some real, undeniable offensive issues.

The pass protection has been a bit of an issue through two games, although the five starters on the OL are all playing better than they did last year. The Redskins have faced a high pct of blitzes from Green Bay and Philadelphia. Last year, teams hardly ever blitzed RG3, because they were terrified he would break contain and beat them down the field with his legs and arm. Combine that with a run heavy offense out of the pistol, and we never really found out how Griffin handled the blitz last year.

Early returns on that this year aren't good. But the real issue is not about Griffin, or the offensive line (our TEs and backs have done a crappy job picking up blitzes, and that's accounted for more than half of the hits on RG3 this season). It's about a total difference in how teams are defending the Redskins. Specifically, man to man coverage with a high safety.

Last year, teams preferred to zone cover the Redskins, because it allowed their defense to keep 11 sets of eyes on RG3. This year, the Eagles went with a lot more man coverage against the Redskins than they had done last season, and enjoyed some success. Cary Williams picking off RG3 in the second half was a great example of a route you expect a Redskins receiver to win on vs. a mediocre corner, combined with a noodle-armed throw, turning a Redskins first down into an Eagles INT and short field.

The Packers though are a zone coverage team, and so when they are playing man coverage on your receivers, they simply don't respect them. With Casey Heyward out, I didn't think GB could or should try to man cover the Redskins.

They did. And they won decisively. Josh Morgan can't separate from anyone. Garcon can and did, but he's inconsistent in doing so. But the guy the lack of zone coverage really hurts is Santana Moss, whose one remaining NFL skill is finding the void in zone coverage before it closes. That was the Redskins go-to on third down last year, now that teams are man covering Washington on third downs, Moss just gets engulfed by whoever is covering him. He's erased from the pattern. Garcon's routes are inconsistent. And too often, the coached leave Hankerson and Fred Davis (!) on the bench on third down with Paulsen and Morgan on the field instead. Bad moves.

Griffin is going to have to pick up some first downs with his feet before the Redskins start seeing a stead diet of zone coverage again, and the offensive line has allowed him to be pinned inside the pocket a bit. The real issue on third down has been the blitz: we're not picking it up, and our receivers aren't freeing up. In the event that one or both of those things happen, there's a good chance the Redskins lined up illegally or held or something that will bring it back.

It's kinda like the 2010 season all over again, from a talent, usage perspective. The Redskins issues are correctable to an extent, but it's not going to be enough to just throw Jordan Reed out there and hope for the best. Reed, Hankerson, Robinson, Helu, and Garcon can all beat man to man coverage quickly on third down, and so the Redskins need to get players who can't or won't (like Josh Morgan) off the field to give themselves enough options to move the chains.

That is what is ailing the offense right now.
I just got finished watching the nfl rewind tape of the last game of reg season with the cowboys.They skip some plays on the nfl rewind but out of the plays I saw the skins used the Pistol formation 35-51 plays.Thats what almost 75% of the time?
Rg3 had terrible game passing,9-18 100yards,BUT out of the pistol he ran it 6 times for 63 yards even with the gimpy knee and brace.Everytime he ran it that I saw he ran it it was for over 8 or 9 yards and picked up a first down on every run,except for the time he ran it 10 yards for a td!

I cant see the pistol working for us this yr with no threat to run at qb and it doesnt look like our team is good enough to overcome it.The pistol covered up a LOT of our problems on the off line last yr.
With defense's blitzing us so much,combine that with our off line,RG3 not running with the ball and his accuracy problems it's just too much to overcome for us SO FAR.
Then combine that with how bad the defense is
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Old 09-18-2013, 10:04 AM   #90
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Re: One Night Only: Offensive Packers-Redskins Game Review, Mythbusters Edition

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I just got finished watching the nfl rewind tape of the last game of reg season with the cowboys.They skip some plays on the nfl rewind but out of the plays I saw the skins used the Pistol formation 35-51 plays.Thats what almost 75% of the time?
Rg3 had terrible game passing,9-18 100yards,BUT out of the pistol he ran it 6 times for 63 yards even with the gimpy knee and brace.Everytime he ran it that I saw he ran it it was for over 8 or 9 yards and picked up a first down on every run,except for the time he ran it 10 yards for a td!

I cant see the pistol working for us this yr with no threat to run at qb and it doesnt look like our team is good enough to overcome it.The pistol covered up a LOT of our problems on the off line last yr.
With defense's blitzing us so much,combine that with our off line,RG3 not running with the ball and his accuracy problems it's just too much to overcome for us SO FAR.
Then combine that with how bad the defense is
The most common play they run from pistol is the stretch. The second most common is their play action series. Read option is probably the most common play after that, but I don't know of any game where they ran it more than five or six times.

I think -- and you point this out -- the fact that the team may not be good enough to overcome some run of the mill offensive struggles is probably the biggest story through two weeks, not RG3's knee/confidence.
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