Warpath  

Home | Forums | Salary Cap Info | Shop | Donate | Stay Connected




Go Back   Warpath > Redskins Forums > Redskins Locker Room


Brandon Winey as a starter

Redskins Locker Room


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-13-2004, 02:52 PM   #1
Pro Bowl
 
SKINSnCANES's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: New Jersey
Age: 32
Posts: 5,411
Brandon Winey as a starter

Assuming Samuels doesnt rework his contract, which seems like it may be the case, and since he has so much trade value, what do you guys think about getting a first round pick for Sameuls, getting the cap room to mabye pick up some other post June 1st free agents, and startign Winey.

It seems like a huge downgrade on paper but when I watched him last year he played well. He stepped in for Samuels and in my opinion played better. The QB had much better protection when he was playing.

Mabye this was because the blockign patterns were changed at the end, but still, he did his job when Samuels didnt.

What do you guys think.
__________________
"I'm used to winning, coming from the University of Miami. " Clinton Portis
SKINSnCANES is offline   Reply With Quote

Advertisements
Old 04-13-2004, 02:59 PM   #2
Impact Rookie
 
SkinsRock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Crofton, MD
Age: 44
Posts: 907
Winey is a good player and did what a back up should do, he came in and there wasn't a drop-off. Even though Samuels hasn't played like it the past year or two, due to the Spurrier/Helton no-protection passing scheme, he is a pro bowl caliber player....Winey isn't. They just need to find a way to get it done.
SkinsRock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 03:02 PM   #3
Pro Bowl
 
SKINSnCANES's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: New Jersey
Age: 32
Posts: 5,411
Well if Brunell starts then Winey playing as left tackle isnt the blindside tackle. Which puts the bigger job on Jansens shoulders, who is a solid enough tackle to handle that. I dont want to see Samuels leave but I dont think we would be as devistated as most people think.
__________________
"I'm used to winning, coming from the University of Miami. " Clinton Portis
SKINSnCANES is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 04:33 PM   #4
Special Teams
 
Phinehas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 106
A recent Washington Times piece said that Samuels was willing to try to restructure his contract any way he could to help make his cap numbers more manageable, but that he just didn't want to sign an extension yet with two years left on his current contract. Not being a cap expert like some (Canucks) around here, I'm not sure what kind of restructuring can be done without extending the contract, but I have to say that the article made Samuels look quite decent and reasonable, even indicating he might be willing to sign an extension next year.

--Phin
Phinehas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 04:49 PM   #5
Playmaker
 
Defensewins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 2,838
Next year is to late, we need cap relief this year. I don't blame this on Samules, it is really Snyder and Cerrato's fault for mismanaging our cap. But Samules is not playing up to his $8M salary cap number that he is going to count this year.
Since Brunnell is a lefty, we should seriously consider shipping Samuels out for a mid to high 1st round draft pick and start Winey. But not give up the #5 pick! It would be stupid to give Samuels and the #5 pick for the #2 pick.
Another point in considering Winey... in Gibbs first year as coach in 1981 or 1982, he started an undrafted rookie Joe Jacoby and Bugel molded him into a Hall of Famer. Winey at least already has a couple of starts under his bealt, where as Jacoby was an undrafted rookie..

Last edited by Defensewins; 04-13-2004 at 05:00 PM.
Defensewins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 04:55 PM   #6
F the Shannys

 
CrazyCanuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,873
The only type of restructuring that would help would be an extension.

I don't understand Samuels logic. He says he won't restructure now, but might do so next year?

Let's fast forward to one year from now:

Samuels's 2005 cap hit will be $9.6M. His salary for 2005 will be $6M.

If he has a good year in 2004, he will be in the driver's seat and will be able to demand more from the Skins in any extension. Plus he'll know that if the Skins cut him he can find a good offer elsewhere, probably with a nice signing bonus.

If he has a bad year in 2004, then he will likely not want to restructure either since he'll be due $6M in salary in 2005, and any restructure or new deal would probably want to pay him less.

So I don't really see his logic when he says he might restructure next year. He might be trying look better in the public's eyes.
CrazyCanuck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 04:59 PM   #7
F the Shannys

 
CrazyCanuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,873
So the way I see it, Samuels either restructures now or he's gone for sure in 2005.

If he's gone for sure in 2005, then we should definitely look to unload him now for a high draft pick.
CrazyCanuck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 05:34 PM   #8
Pro Bowl
 
SKINSnCANES's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: New Jersey
Age: 32
Posts: 5,411
He said he would redo his deal but didnt want an extension. Does that mean he will take a new, two year contract and pay cut? So he only wants a two year deal for less money. Is a player acutally admitting hes overpaid?
__________________
"I'm used to winning, coming from the University of Miami. " Clinton Portis
SKINSnCANES is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 05:34 PM   #9
Pro Bowl
 
SKINSnCANES's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: New Jersey
Age: 32
Posts: 5,411
The other thign to keep in mind that I dont know much about Winey is his run blocking. We've got a great back that would benefit from a great oline
__________________
"I'm used to winning, coming from the University of Miami. " Clinton Portis
SKINSnCANES is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 05:38 PM   #10
The Starter
 
joecrisp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Charlottesville, VA
Age: 38
Posts: 1,501
Excellent points, Canuck.

I'm okay with dealing Samuels before the draft-- I just don't want to see him packaged with the #5 pick. The Skins have more leverage and value with that pick than with any player they might consider trading away. If they deal Samuels for more players or picks (preferably mid-first round at minimum for one pick), while retaining their #5 pick, that would be fine.
Don't get me wrong; it's not going to be easy to replace Samuels. I really believe he's going to return to Pro Bowl form under Bugel's guidance. But if he's not willing to restructure now, then the time to deal him is now.
joecrisp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 05:44 PM   #11
Impact Rookie
 
Duffman003's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 590
Theres no way we would get a first round for samuels the way he our quarterbacks have been getting killed. He has not done well under the spurrier regime with offsides and sub par blocking. I would be surprised to get a second for him, but I would rather keep Samuels and let bugel at him.
Duffman003 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 05:51 PM   #12
Uncle Phil
 
SmootSmack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 44,580
Quote:
Originally Posted by joecrisp
Excellent points, Canuck.

I'm okay with dealing Samuels before the draft-- I just don't want to see him packaged with the #5 pick. The Skins have more leverage and value with that pick than with any player they might consider trading away. If they deal Samuels for more players or picks (preferably mid-first round at minimum for one pick), while retaining their #5 pick, that would be fine.
Don't get me wrong; it's not going to be easy to replace Samuels. I really believe he's going to return to Pro Bowl form under Bugel's guidance. But if he's not willing to restructure now, then the time to deal him is now.
I think Crisp pretty much hits the nail on the head here. But I don't think we should be jumping on the Winey bandwagon just yet. He's a solid player but I can't see him being better than a healthy Samuels. I think it's important to remember that Winey joined the lineup right around the time Dockery was starting to find his groove. Samuels had to help compensate for a lot of Dockery's early rookie mistakes.
__________________
You're So Vain...You Probably Think This Sig Is About You
SmootSmack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 06:00 PM   #13
Special Teams
 
Carnage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 468
He was the third overall pick, why are we surprised at these numbers? Even if we think he didin't earn every dollar last season, dumping him for anything less than the third overall pick is insanity. Just be glad he is not Courtney Brown.
Carnage is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 06:13 PM   #14
Pro Bowl
 
SKINSnCANES's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: New Jersey
Age: 32
Posts: 5,411
I think under Bugel our whole line will take a step up. Our guard next to Samuels/Winey is going to be suspect anyways. Either Fiore is going to give this another go around or we go with Dockery again. I sure hope Dockery did a lot of work this offseason becasue he lost some games for us. I think he should just take a paycut, leave the deal at two years and let him have a chance to prove himself. If i was him i wouldnt want a longterm deal becuase he should be able to play at a higher level and should want to prove that to get the big dollars again.
__________________
"I'm used to winning, coming from the University of Miami. " Clinton Portis
SKINSnCANES is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 06:24 PM   #15
F the Shannys

 
CrazyCanuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,873
I agree with Crisp as well.

Losing Samuels would hurt us in 2004, but from all indications the Skins are on a 3 year plan. No point keeping Samuels for 2004 if we're gonna lose him in 2005 anyways.

We have assembled a great core of young guys that we can keep thru 2006 and beyond. Samuels should extend his contract to become a part of this core, or we should try to unload him.

The Skins gotta find a way to turn Samuels into Gallery without giving up the #5.
CrazyCanuck is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:27 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site is not officially affiliated with the Washington Redskins or the NFL.
Page generated in 0.28334 seconds with 9 queries

Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.2.0 RC5

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25