wrong restructuring?

BeastsoftheNFCeast · 02-26-2008, 02:41 PM

Is there a rule on when players retire that their signing bonus left to be paid out does not count, or anything similar to that? If not, we are dumb as hell for restructuring Thomas and Jansen, they have a combined 32 million dollars left in signing bonus money, both are 32 years old, and both are injury prone in general and are coming off season ending injuries. Essentially we cannot let these guys go no matter how bad they get due to injuries and age, and they both eat up alot of cap space. In my mind, this was a dumb move on the skins part.

steveo395 · 02-26-2008, 02:53 PM

Most offensive lineman can play well past the age of 32. Thomas and Jansen are both still good and I don't see why they wouldn't stay good during the next few years.

SmootSmack · 02-26-2008, 02:55 PM

You can probably find the answer to your question here:

http://www.redskinswarpath.com/redsk...cap-101-a.html

Schneed10 · 02-26-2008, 02:57 PM

If a player retires, his signing bonus accelerates and hits our cap just as it would when you cut a player.

But I have to respectfully disagree with your assessment. When players are extended as was the case for Randy Thomas and Chris Samuels, most of that outstanding signing bonus is due to clear the books within the next two or three years, when they should still be viable, quality NFL starters. If you look at CC's cap sheets, only a few million of signing bonus money is allocated to 2012 and beyond (when they'll be old farts). So if we cut them in three years, not only will the signing bonus not be a major burden, but it will still represent a significant cap savings to cut them at that point.

With Jansen, he was not extended, which shows the Skins are a little wary to committ to him long term given his injury status. His contract is set up in such a way that, unless he proves himself worthy of an extension, he will likely be released two years from now.

BeastsoftheNFCeast · 02-26-2008, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schneed10

If a player retires, his signing bonus accelerates and hits our cap just as it would when you cut a player.

But I have to respectfully disagree with your assessment. When players are extended as was the case for Randy Thomas and Chris Samuels, most of that outstanding signing bonus is due to clear the books within the next two or three years, when they should still be viable, quality NFL starters. If you look at CC's cap sheets, only a few million of signing bonus money is allocated to 2012 and beyond (when they'll be old farts). So if we cut them in three years, not only will the signing bonus not be a major burden, but it will still represent a significant cap savings to cut them at that point.

With Jansen, he was not extended, which shows the Skins are a little wary to committ to him long term given his injury status. His contract is set up in such a way that, unless he proves himself worthy of an extension, he will likely be released two years from now.

Its nice to have someone respectfully disagree for once instead of going crazy. I like your analysis, and I thought of that too, but I still have to respectfully disagree with you. I feel that there are too many questions revolving around the topic of durability due to the combination of consistant major injuries and age of Jansen and Thomas. When someone has a major injuy in their 30's, I feel it generally shortens the amount of quality years they have left. And I feel that we might cut them in 3 years because we really cant afford to cut them in less, not that it might not be the right move. I feel that if you are unable to cut someone untill they are 35, and even when you do it then it still has a significant blow to the cap, that is not a good thing. I know that Jansen did not officially get a contract extension, but in my mind increasing the signing bonus has the same effect because we will not be able to cut him for longer.

Schneed10 · 02-26-2008, 04:42 PM

In the end, this would come down to your opinion of how good Thomas and Jansen are likely to be over the next 3 years or so.

If you don't like their chances of playing well, then it makes sense you wouldn't like the move.

I happen to think Randy Thomas is the best lineman on our team, on offense or defense. Samuels gets the glory as the LT and rightfully so, but Randy has been key to our run blocking as he's the only guy that can get around the edge and mow people down in space. His biggest asset is his speed, and a soft-tissue muscle injury shouldn't affect that.

As for Jansen, I can understand the concern after seeing his leg turn into a pretzel in week 1 against Miami. We should be able to cut him after the 2009 season and save some cap space. I still like him, but I can understand the concern with him.

02-26-2008, 02:41 PM	#1 (permalink)
BeastsoftheNFCeast Special Teams Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 309	wrong restructuring? Is there a rule on when players retire that their signing bonus left to be paid out does not count, or anything similar to that? If not, we are dumb as hell for restructuring Thomas and Jansen, they have a combined 32 million dollars left in signing bonus money, both are 32 years old, and both are injury prone in general and are coming off season ending injuries. Essentially we cannot let these guys go no matter how bad they get due to injuries and age, and they both eat up alot of cap space. In my mind, this was a dumb move on the skins part.

02-26-2008, 02:53 PM	#2 (permalink)
steveo395 The Starter Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 1,434	Re: wrong restructuring? Most offensive lineman can play well past the age of 32. Thomas and Jansen are both still good and I don't see why they wouldn't stay good during the next few years.

02-26-2008, 02:55 PM	#3 (permalink)
SmootSmack Illuminated Dignitary Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 20,534	Re: wrong restructuring? You can probably find the answer to your question here: http://www.redskinswarpath.com/redsk...cap-101-a.html __________________ You're So Vain...You Probably Think This Sig Is About You

02-26-2008, 02:57 PM	#4 (permalink)
Schneed10 I'll Salary Cap Your Ass Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Havertown, PA Posts: 5,357	Re: wrong restructuring? If a player retires, his signing bonus accelerates and hits our cap just as it would when you cut a player. But I have to respectfully disagree with your assessment. When players are extended as was the case for Randy Thomas and Chris Samuels, most of that outstanding signing bonus is due to clear the books within the next two or three years, when they should still be viable, quality NFL starters. If you look at CC's cap sheets, only a few million of signing bonus money is allocated to 2012 and beyond (when they'll be old farts). So if we cut them in three years, not only will the signing bonus not be a major burden, but it will still represent a significant cap savings to cut them at that point. With Jansen, he was not extended, which shows the Skins are a little wary to committ to him long term given his injury status. His contract is set up in such a way that, unless he proves himself worthy of an extension, he will likely be released two years from now. __________________ Summary of Skins' Salary Cap Status \| CrazyCanuck's Detailed Cap Figures by Player \| Salary Cap 101 Vinny, vidi, vici.

02-26-2008, 04:42 PM	#6 (permalink)
Schneed10 I'll Salary Cap Your Ass Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Havertown, PA Posts: 5,357	Re: wrong restructuring? In the end, this would come down to your opinion of how good Thomas and Jansen are likely to be over the next 3 years or so. If you don't like their chances of playing well, then it makes sense you wouldn't like the move. I happen to think Randy Thomas is the best lineman on our team, on offense or defense. Samuels gets the glory as the LT and rightfully so, but Randy has been key to our run blocking as he's the only guy that can get around the edge and mow people down in space. His biggest asset is his speed, and a soft-tissue muscle injury shouldn't affect that. As for Jansen, I can understand the concern after seeing his leg turn into a pretzel in week 1 against Miami. We should be able to cut him after the 2009 season and save some cap space. I still like him, but I can understand the concern with him. __________________ Summary of Skins' Salary Cap Status \| CrazyCanuck's Detailed Cap Figures by Player \| Salary Cap 101 Vinny, vidi, vici.

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wrong restructuring?

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