Kirk Cousins 24/7 thread

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by Chief X_Phackter

Pretty sure they can negotiate now - after the last regular season game.

I thought it was after the Super Bowl.

[Chief X_Phackter]

I may be mistaken, but if they tag him again I think they will already be about 2/3 of the way to what he was asking for last year in guaranteed money. It doesn't seem like a good business decision to me. Yeah, you get him for one more year, but it makes even less sense to tag him again next year, from a $$$$$ perspective - and if I were him I would get the fuck out of here and try to find an organization that will appreciate how good he is. For fucks sake what else does he have to prove here? Give him an above average defense and it's a wrap...

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by Chief X_Phackter

I may be mistaken, but if they tag him again I think they will already be about 2/3 of the way to what he was asking for last year in guaranteed money. It doesn't seem like a good business decision to me. Yeah, you get him for one more year, but it makes even less sense to tag him again next year, from a $$$$$ perspective - and if I were him I would get the fuck out of here and try to find an organization that will appreciate how good he is. For fucks sake what else does he have to prove here? Give him an above average defense and it's a wrap...

Last year I got their decision to make him prove it again. Now, looking back on it, it feels ridiculous that we thought that way. But he had only been a strong QB for 9 games. I'm glad they took the approach they did.

But the risk of doing that, which was completely understood at the time, was that if he balled out in 2016 his negotiating position would be incredibly strong. And now it is. We're going to have to come up to $22 or $23M per year with lots guaranteed. He bet on himself and his number hit. What more can you say, just gotta pay the man.

[mooby]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Last year I got their decision to make him prove it again. Now, looking back on it, it feels ridiculous that we thought that way. But he had only been a strong QB for 9 games. I'm glad they took the approach they did.

But the risk of doing that, which was completely understood at the time, was that if he balled out in 2016 his negotiating position would be incredibly strong. And now it is. We're going to have to come up to $22 or $23M per year with lots guaranteed. He bet on himself and his number hit. What more can you say, just gotta pay the man.

Gotta say I think it's incredible that we even have to have this debate. The man ain't no A-A-ron Rodgers but he's good enough to win with a good team around him. That easily makes him better than any qb we've had since Rypien not named Brad Johnson. Just pay the man. Find the line between giving him the money he deserves and not screwing the rest of the team.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by mooby

Gotta say I think it's incredible that we even have to have this debate. The man ain't no A-A-ron Rodgers but he's good enough to win with a good team around him. That easily makes him better than any qb we've had since Rypien not named Brad Johnson. Just pay the man. Find the line between giving him the money he deserves and not screwing the rest of the team.

Until we get to the point where the Skins and KC can negotiate again (which I think is after the SB, but maybe is now) and we start hearing serious hesitation by the front office, I am 100% of the opinion that all this debate is spurred on by fans who worry, or give credence to bogus sources.

The Skins will have KC signed before the FT question even comes into play is my opinion.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

Until we get to the point where the Skins and KC can negotiate again (which I think is after the SB, but maybe is now) and we start hearing serious hesitation by the front office, I am 100% of the opinion that all this debate is spurred on by fans who worry, or give credence to bogus sources.

The Skins will have KC signed before the FT question even comes into play is my opinion.

I agree. The cap space is abundant this year, and they have very little committed in future years. They can afford to marry themselves to Cousins for 3 years via a big guaranteed payday.

At this point I think it's likely that McC and Gruden have both given their thumbs up and it's now into the hands of Allen and Schaeffer to negotiate the best deal possible.

[metalskins]

Originally Posted by Chief X_Phackter

I may be mistaken, but if they tag him again I think they will already be about 2/3 of the way to what he was asking for last year in guaranteed money. It doesn't seem like a good business decision to me. Yeah, you get him for one more year, but it makes even less sense to tag him again next year, from a $$$$$ perspective - and if I were him I would get the fuck out of here and try to find an organization that will appreciate how good he is. For fucks sake what else does he have to prove here? Give him an above average defense and it's a wrap...

The more I think about this, the more complicated it is. The Redskins almost have to tag Cousins this year, if they want to keep him long term. Because, Cousins is going to take the best offer. He is not loyal to sticking with the Redskins if they can't offer him the best deal. The Redskins have already paid him $20M in guaranteed money. So, they tag him again, they're paying him $44M in guaranteed money for last year and this year. I think last year, Cousins was wanting something close to $20M/year with about $60M guaranteed. So, you tag him again, he's getting just $16M shy of his original asking price of $60M guaranteed.

So, if you're the Redskins, you probably slap the exclusive franchise tag on him so that he can't negotiate with other teams, and hope you can negotiate a contract where he can get about $30M guaranteed this year, which would be a total of about $50M guaranteed money with what he got last year. The biggest thing would be to negotiate on the yearly base salary. In the end, the Redskins would wind up giving Cousins basically what he was asking for last year with a bit more per year, which is probably the best deal the Redskins could get. I have a feeling though, that yearly salary would probably go up. It would just wind up being a case where the Redskins were willing to give Cousins what he wanted all long (with somewhat of an increase), but they just wanted one more year out of him to make sure he was worth it.

If the 'skins decide to do the nonexclusive tag on Cousins, then that's a big gamble. The upside is that they could see, exactly, what other teams think of Cousins' worth, which would help to decide what type of contract the Redskins must offer Cousins if they want to keep him. If they don't match, they get two first rounders or whatever else is negotiated. At least the Redskins would not leave the table empty handed. The bad news is, if the plan all along is to keep Cousins no matter what, then if a team says they will give Cousins $26/yr with $65M guaranteed, then if the 'skins want to match that, you're looking at having to pay Cousins $85M in guaranteed money (with the tag cost from the previous year), in addition to what his base salary is going to cost. So, all in all, the Redskins will have wound up giving Cousins much more than what Cousins was asking for last year - and as far as the money side of it goes, the Redskins will have gambled and lost.

So, basically, I'm saying that the Redskins are tagging Cousins. If they tag him as exclusive, then that tells me they really want to keep him and negotiate a long term deal. Probably highly likely. If they tag him nonexclusive, they're probably hoping the right team will come by (maybe one that happens to have a franchise quarterback who is unhappy with the team) to offer the right deal that gives the Redskins what they need in order to be OK with moving on from Kirk Cousins. I see this is not very likely, but not out of the realm of possibility.

No tag whatsoever means they're either going to gamble big and hope that Cousins comes down to earth on what he's asking for, or that they already have plans to move on from him and draft a guy they hope has a higher ceiling. I don't see this happening at all. I think the Redskins want Kirk Cousins long term. I think they just want an opportunity to hold negotiations on a level playing field, and tagging him is about the only way to do it.

[Schneed10]

It's an absolute lock that they'll tag him. I doubt anybody would sign him to a deal knowing they'd have to give up two 1sts. Stranger things have happened I guess, but I don't see it.

He'll either play under the tag this year as a Redskin, or he'll have a long term deal to be here for a while.

[Chief X_Phackter]

Originally Posted by metalskins

The more I think about this, the more complicated it is. The Redskins almost have to tag Cousins this year, if they want to keep him long term. Because, Cousins is going to take the best offer. He is not loyal to sticking with the Redskins if they can't offer him the best deal. The Redskins have already paid him $20M in guaranteed money. So, they tag him again, they're paying him $44M in guaranteed money for last year and this year. I think last year, Cousins was wanting something close to $20M/year with about $60M guaranteed. So, you tag him again, he's getting just $16M shy of his original asking price of $60M guaranteed.

So, if you're the Redskins, you probably slap the exclusive franchise tag on him so that he can't negotiate with other teams, and hope you can negotiate a contract where he can get about $30M guaranteed this year, which would be a total of about $50M guaranteed money with what he got last year. The biggest thing would be to negotiate on the yearly base salary. In the end, the Redskins would wind up giving Cousins basically what he was asking for last year with a bit more per year, which is probably the best deal the Redskins could get. I have a feeling though, that yearly salary would probably go up. It would just wind up being a case where the Redskins were willing to give Cousins what he wanted all long (with somewhat of an increase), but they just wanted one more year out of him to make sure he was worth it.

If the 'skins decide to do the nonexclusive tag on Cousins, then that's a big gamble. The upside is that they could see, exactly, what other teams think of Cousins' worth, which would help to decide what type of contract the Redskins must offer Cousins if they want to keep him. If they don't match, they get two first rounders or whatever else is negotiated. At least the Redskins would not leave the table empty handed. The bad news is, if the plan all along is to keep Cousins no matter what, then if a team says they will give Cousins $26/yr with $65M guaranteed, then if the 'skins want to match that, you're looking at having to pay Cousins $85M in guaranteed money (with the tag cost from the previous year), in addition to what his base salary is going to cost. So, all in all, the Redskins will have wound up giving Cousins much more than what Cousins was asking for last year - and as far as the money side of it goes, the Redskins will have gambled and lost.

So, basically, I'm saying that the Redskins are tagging Cousins. If they tag him as exclusive, then that tells me they really want to keep him and negotiate a long term deal. Probably highly likely. If they tag him nonexclusive, they're probably hoping the right team will come by (maybe one that happens to have a franchise quarterback who is unhappy with the team) to offer the right deal that gives the Redskins what they need in order to be OK with moving on from Kirk Cousins. I see this is not very likely, but not out of the realm of possibility.

No tag whatsoever means they're either going to gamble big and hope that Cousins comes down to earth on what he's asking for, or that they already have plans to move on from him and draft a guy they hope has a higher ceiling. I don't see this happening at all. I think the Redskins want Kirk Cousins long term. I think they just want an opportunity to hold negotiations on a level playing field, and tagging him is about the only way to do it.

I don't know man, it's all a gamble. At this point, to me the franchise tags (either one) are the biggest gambles. They slapped the non-exclusive tag on him last year and he just signed it and took the 20 mil - betting on himself (WIN). I suspect he would do that again this year, knowing it's very unlikely the tag would be used a third time. Then he'll pack up his 45 mil and go get a giant contract elsewhere. Now is the time to lock him up - long term. Use the tag on someone else, PG, DS...

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by metalskins

IF the FO is able to sign Cousins at $10 million per year, you had better hurry up and get a pen in Cousins' hands ASAP!!!

is it duress if duct tape and hookers are used?

[metalskins]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

It's an absolute lock that they'll tag him. I doubt anybody would sign him to a deal knowing they'd have to give up two 1sts. Stranger things have happened I guess, but I don't see it.

He'll either play under the tag this year as a Redskin, or he'll have a long term deal to be here for a while.

I believe that as well. I don't think any team (including the Browns) would give up two first rounders for Cousins either. The only scenario that would make sense to me involving the nonexclusive, and one I used as an example earlier, would be in the case of the Chargers (or whoever they plan to be called later on lol), and Phillip Rivers not wanting to go down with that ship. Maybe complains enough to where he wants a trade, and the Redskins work out some sort of trade for Kirk Cousins. But other than that, I honestly believe the Redskins main intent is to get Cousins signed. Maybe I'm wrong and they'll get him signed the day after the Super Bowl. That would be great!

[metalskins]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

is it duress if duct tape and hookers are used?

It depends on which street corner you got the hookers from, and if the duct tape was purchased from Home Depot or Lowe's.

[warriorzpath]

Kirk Cousins's ceiling right now appears to be Alex Smith. And the Chiefs were the most complete team to me in the playoffs.

What does that mean for you with Kirk Cousins leading the Redskins?

[metalskins]

Originally Posted by warriorzpath

Kirk Cousins's ceiling right now appears to be Alex Smith. And the Chiefs were the most complete team to me in the playoffs.

What does that mean for you with Kirk Cousins leading the Redskins?

Actually, watching Alex Smith last night, I still feel Kirk Cousins is better than Smith. However, Smith has grown into being a solid game manager, but he still has a weak arm and a slow wind up when he throws the ball.

[warriorzpath]

Originally Posted by metalskins

Actually, watching Alex Smith last night, I still feel Kirk Cousins is better than Smith. However, Smith has grown into being a solid game manager, but he still has a weak arm and a slow wind up when he throws the ball.

There's slight differences in strengths and weaknesses, but I think they're comparable. Biggest difference to me that makes Alex Smith better is being veteran savvy.

The most noticeable similarity that both share and that you describe Smith as, is they are great managers. And that's where their ceilings are.