Updated: Daschle Withdraws; Didn't these guys have to fill out an application?

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

Nice. I am not really intending to bash Obama with this thread. I want him to succeed. It just seems like, after all the "Change" rhetoric, we are getting more of the same. It is particularly eggregious after that lengthy application process that most applicants were required to go through.

I think it was you, Saden, who said one of your big concerns was that it seemed the lobbyists were running the shop. Who in particular were you concerned with and why? (If it wasn't Saden, then this is directed to whomever made the statement) (yes, I am too lazy to search for it).

Sigh...I gotta do everything around here

http://www.thewarpath.net/499687-post7.html

(it was the anti-saden)

[saden1]

I screwed up, Nancy Killefer has a $946.69 tax lien against her home not 1 million. Don't ask me how I miss read that. Still, that's very bad.

Anywho, Obama is at least apologizing to the country and owning up to his mistakes. All I ask is you try and I can't say he isn't trying.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by saden1

Anywho, Obama is at least apologizing to the country and owning up to his mistakes. All I ask is you try and I can't say he isn't trying.

Here is where Obama is making points with me. Ignoring policy debates and politics in general the one thing that killed me about Bush's administration, and most politicians in general, is that when they did screw up (and they all do) they never owned up to it. I don't know why it is so hard for politicians to say "yeah we f'ed that up". A lot of the stuff anchoring Bush was smaller stuff that they could have diffused with honesty and openess. Instead it was always cloak and dagger/stay on message. What is it with these people? It's like they have no clue about actual human social patterns. Seriously, they all need to take a cue from the Simpson and appoint a Secretary of keepin' it real. Looks like Obama is trying.

[GMScud]

Not closely related, nor threadworthy, but....

Did anyone see Letterman just straight up trash Blagojevich tonight?? Hilarious.

I've never seen such denial in my life. The former governor is either mentally retarded or a sociopath. Either way, he's done. He's the Roger Clemens of governorship.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by GMScud

Not closely related, nor threadworthy, but....

Did anyone see Letterman just straight up trash Blagojevich tonight?? Hilarious.

I've never seen such denial in my life. The former governor is either mentally retarded or a sociopath. Either way, he's done. He's the Roger Clemens of governorship.

Blogo is truly handicapped. He would make a perfect Jerry Springer guest.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

Here is where Obama is making points with me. Ignoring policy debates and politics in general the one thing that killed me about Bush's administration, and most politicians in general, is that when they did screw up (and they all do) they never owned up to it. I don't know why it is so hard for politicians to say "yeah we f'ed that up". A lot of the stuff anchoring Bush was smaller stuff that they could have diffused with honesty and openess. Instead it was always cloak and dagger/stay on message. What is it with these people? It's like they have no clue about actual human social patterns. Seriously, they all need to take a cue from the Simpson and appoint a Secretary of keepin' it real. Looks like Obama is trying.

It is so easy to say I messed up, the sooner you say it the sooner you get out of the doghouse. I never got cover-ups either. The cover-up is always worse than the lie yet some folks still have a hard time with it. The Bush folks were a special bunch. Even in their attempt at appealing to the public in their exit interview was a miserable failure.

[firstdown]

Well what else could Obama have said? He push this "Change" thing and then within his first days in office tried to bring in people that did not represent any form of change. I guess the good news is that he brought in about $200,000 to the IRS in unpaid taxes.

[dmek25]

does that make you wonder how many politicians are NOT paying their taxes? one of those things that make you go hmmm?

[dmek25]

Originally Posted by firstdown

Well what else could Obama have said? He push this "Change" thing and then within his first days in office tried to bring in people that did not represent any form of change. I guess the good news is that he brought in about $200,000 to the IRS in unpaid taxes.

he could have said mission accomplished, and stood there with a stupid look on his face

[Miller101]

Originally Posted by firstdown

I personaly do not have a problem when Obama or another President chooses someone then we find out they had an issue hidden. Its what they do when they find out these things that concerns me. I always wondered why Dem's thought it was OK to over tax the rich because most of them are also rich and now I know. They just cheat on their taxes.

Overtax the rich? They should pay more taxes. They make more! Let them pay up!

[724Skinsfan]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

Here is where Obama is making points with me. Ignoring policy debates and politics in general the one thing that killed me about Bush's administration, and most politicians in general, is that when they did screw up (and they all do) they never owned up to it. I don't know why it is so hard for politicians to say "yeah we f'ed that up". A lot of the stuff anchoring Bush was smaller stuff that they could have diffused with honesty and openess. Instead it was always cloak and dagger/stay on message. What is it with these people? It's like they have no clue about actual human social patterns. Seriously, they all need to take a cue from the Simpson and appoint a Secretary of keepin' it real. Looks like Obama is trying.

I know I'm in the minority but I really could care less if my leader says "I screwed up". We already know. You're forgiven. Now fix it. Hopefully, this will be the last time we hear "Sorry" even if he does truly seem to be genuine. He's doing a good job, he'll continue to need the confidence of the American people. I don't think calling yourself out is an effective tool for a leader.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by 724Skinsfan

I know I'm in the minority but I really could care less if my leader says "I screwed up". We already know. You're forgiven. Now fix it. Hopefully, this will be the last time we hear "Sorry" even if he does truly seem to be genuine. He's doing a good job, he'll continue to need the confidence of the American people. I don't think calling yourself out is an effective tool for a leader.

Actually I agree. Personally I don't much care whether they do or not as it applies to my own feelings. I just know basic human social patterns indicate that from a logical and practical standpoint it is rarely if ever better to obscure the truth in these types of situations. They get points back when they say the screwed up from lots of people. Why they don't see this is baffling. It actually makes you wonder how many things go on that we never know about. I guess it'd have to be a pretty good amount of situations they successfully keep obscured to overcome the obvious and tremendous negativity they get whenever they are discovered.

[saden1]

If you don't/can't say "I screwed up" how can you have a conversation about how to rectify the problem?

[KLHJ2]

Originally Posted by 724Skinsfan

I know I'm in the minority but I really could care less if my leader says "I screwed up". We already know. You're forgiven. Now fix it. Hopefully, this will be the last time we hear "Sorry" even if he does truly seem to be genuine. He's doing a good job, he'll continue to need the confidence of the American people. I don't think calling yourself out is an effective tool for a leader.

I disagree, I believe that it is imperative that a leader have integrity and take responsibility for his/her actions. Somebody is going to find out, you might as well own up to it. It is ok to call yourself out, but if you are calling yourself out over the same mistake more than once, then you are showing that you have a weakness about you. In that case you may not want to own up to it, but by then you have already proven that you are seriously flawed as a leader and taking ownership no longer matters.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by saden1

If you don't/can't say "I screwed up" how can you have a conversation about how to rectify the problem?

Well there's a difference between saying it and meaning it. In either case, whether you openly admit it or not, meaning and knowing it is more important than saying it to me. I would guess there are plenty of times that politicians know they screwed up and don't say it. Telling everyone just helps make them feel better.