John McCain spreading fear about childhood vaccines

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

From what I understand there is not only no reliable evidence that mecury causes autism there is also no unreliable evidence either. It is one of those strange theoretical ideas that somehow has taken hold and refuses to die. No one has one shred of evidence to support the claim. I do understand that the use of mecury is actually very needed to stabilize vaccines but I am by no means any type of expert. I suspect that if vaccines actually caused autism there'd be a good amount of evidence and uproar. I get really tired of this culture of belief that Big Business and the US Government have the wherewithall to perpetrate conspiracies against people when A) the US Government shows an incredible lack of ability to do anything well, especially keep secrets and B) It is completely counter to Big Business interests to produce a product that exposes them to risks they don't need. They're in business to make money and making products that cause autism is a pretty stupid way of doing it.

Yea there has never been any companies that produce a product which cause harm. You have never read the stories about drug companies covering up info about side effects from drugs they produce. You have never heard about a co producing a product which has caused injuries and death and ignored the facts and kept on producing the product. It happens all the time.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by firstdown

Yea there has never been any companies that produce a product which cause harm. You have never read the stories about drug companies covering up info about side effects from drugs they produce. You have never heard about a co producing a product which has caused injuries and death and ignored the facts and kept on producing the product. It happens all the time.

That's my point... they all get caught. It isn't widespread and when it does happen they get caught. But some people would have us all believe that big business goes out of its way to make products that unecessarily expose them to risk simply to save a few peenies. I think those situations are the exceptions. In this case if the vaccines DO cause autism it would be beyond stupid to continue using mercury(which they are trying to phase out simply because of the bad pub anyways).

And msheig I'll grant you that cigarettes are bad, that everyone knows it and that tobacco companies have known it for ever if you grant that using the tobacco industry as a comparison is darn near impossible given it's history, huge influence on our economy and unique market. There is literally no other industry even remotely like it.

[mheisig]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

That's my point... they all get caught. It isn't widespread and when it does happen they get caught. But some people would have us all believe that big business goes out of its way to make products that unecessarily expose them to risk simply to save a few peenies. I think those situations are the exceptions. In this case if the vaccines DO cause autism it would be beyond stupid to continue using mercury(which they are trying to phase out simply because of the bad pub anyways).

And msheig I'll grant you that cigarettes are bad, that everyone knows it and that tobacco companies have known it for ever if you grant that using the tobacco industry as a comparison is darn near impossible given it's history, huge influence on our economy and unique market. There is literally no other industry even remotely like it.

The pharmaceutical industry seems pretty similar to me. They don't have the same brand loyalty as the tobacco industry does, but on a regular basis we see drugs getting recalled and one class action suit after another against the drug companies.

I don't think they're intentionally producing products that they know will harm people, but I think they tend to downplay the risks and will sometimes just release a product so people will buy it and deal with the consequences later.

It almost seems like a shotgun approach to drug distribution - yeah, a few might be bad but they're making so much money in the process that settling a few $100 million + lawsuits is a drop in the bucket.

[That Guy]

i didn't think psychologists could prescribe drugs. I thought that was the difference between them and psychiatrists...

and i don't think you can say scientists and doctors are clueless, since cure rates and life expectancy are way up from the 1800s, and will continue to rise to the best of available knowledge.

I mean, electronic principles and radio communication really hasn't changed much (except for making things smaller) since about the 1920s. calculus, geometry, that whole earth around the sun thing

some things don't change, and besides better biophysical/gene and quantum/nano knowledge, a lot of today's information will still hold true (like balanced diets, exercise, etc).

just because we can't cure everything instantly doesn't make this the dark ages or the pursuit of knowledge worthless, and, by the way, leeches are still used.

[DynamiteRave]

Originally Posted by That Guy

i didn't think psychologists could prescribe drugs. I thought that was the difference between them and psychiatrists...

and i don't think you can say scientists and doctors are clueless, since cure rates and life expectancy are way up from the 1800s, and will continue to rise to the best of available knowledge.

I mean, electronic principles and radio communication really hasn't changed much (except for making things smaller) since about the 1920s. calculus, geometry, that whole earth around the sun thing

some things don't change, and besides better biophysical/gene and quantum/nano knowledge, a lot of today's information will still hold true (like balanced diets, exercise, etc).

just because we can't cure everything instantly doesn't make this the dark ages or the pursuit of knowledge worthless, and, by the way, leeches are still used.

You're right. My mistake.

[jsarno]

Man, I hope Obama gets these kinds of pointless threads dedicated to him too. Otherwise, that would be just be a shame to attack someone over one little insignificant (in the grand scheme of things) comment.

[Monkeydad]

^

Oh he does. When anyone says his full name in public, it's "hate speech"!

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Buster

^

Oh he does. When anyone says his full name in public, it's "hate speech"!

Dumb comment.

Unfortunately, even people in his own party are making dumb comments

ABC News: Ferraro 'Absolutely Not' Sorry for Comment

Jsarno, I think that the original poster started this thread because it is of personal interest to him. But we wouldn't have known that based on the original post. Otherwise, you're right, it's nothing more than "Presidential Candidate Comments On Issue During Campaign Year"

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Dumb comment.

Unfortunately, even people in his own party are making dumb comments

ABC News: Ferraro 'Absolutely Not' Sorry for Comment

Jsarno, I think that the original poster started this thread because it is of personal interest to him. But we wouldn't have known that based on the original post. Otherwise, you're right, it's nothing more than "Presidential Candidate Comments On Issue During Campaign Year"

I'm not so sure those comments by Ferraro are completely off base though. Obama is almost to cult hero status, when was the last politician that popular? We are so eager to scream racism, we completely dismiss...well...racism. I have heard people actually say they would vote for Obama cause he's black. (which makes me laugh cause he's not) If you vote for someone cause he's black, guess what? You're a racist. Now, if you vote for someone cause of what they stand for, then that's cool. Unfortunately, not many that I have encountered could even tell you the state Senator Obama is from. So do I think Ferraro made dumb comments, yes. Do I think they are completely off base...absolutely not.

ps- That's the best sig I've seen from you SS.

[djnemo65]

Originally Posted by jsarno

I'm not so sure those comments by Ferraro are completely off base though. Obama is almost to cult hero status, when was the last politician that popular? We are so eager to scream racism, we completely dismiss...well...racism. I have heard people actually say they would vote for Obama cause he's black. (which makes me laugh cause he's not) If you vote for someone cause he's black, guess what? You're a racist. Now, if you vote for someone cause of what they stand for, then that's cool. Unfortunately, not many that I have encountered could even tell you the state Senator Obama is from. So do I think Ferraro made dumb comments, yes. Do I think they are completely off base...absolutely not.

ps- That's the best sig I've seen from you SS.

Sounds like you hang out with some real dimwits Jsarno.

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by djnemo65

Sounds like you hang out with some real dimwits Jsarno.

And why is that? Cause I am not afraid to break down barriers and speak without fear of being politically correct?

Sometimes, some people need to learn that there is more to see of this world than the view they see of the inside of thier own anus.

[djnemo65]

Originally Posted by jsarno

I'm not so sure those comments by Ferraro are completely off base though. Obama is almost to cult hero status, when was the last politician that popular? We are so eager to scream racism, we completely dismiss...well...racism. I have heard people actually say they would vote for Obama cause he's black. (which makes me laugh cause he's not) If you vote for someone cause he's black, guess what? You're a racist. Now, if you vote for someone cause of what they stand for, then that's cool. Unfortunately, not many that I have encountered could even tell you the state Senator Obama is from. So do I think Ferraro made dumb comments, yes. Do I think they are completely off base...absolutely not.

ps- That's the best sig I've seen from you SS.

And I just saw this....Obama is not black? His dad is from Kenya. What in god's name are you talking about?

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by djnemo65

And I just saw this....Obama is not black? His dad is from Kenya. What in god's name are you talking about?

I think he meant not 100%. Isn't his mother a Caucasian American, and he was raised by his mother and his Indonesian stepfather

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by djnemo65

And I just saw this....Obama is not black? His dad is from Kenya. What in god's name are you talking about?

No he's not black...he's only part. His mother is just as white as his father is black. Just cause he embraces his black roots over his caucasian roots doesn't make him any more black.
If you are an Obama supporter, this is the kind of thing I am talking about. Know your candidate before supporting one.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by jsarno

I'm not so sure those comments by Ferraro are completely off base though. Obama is almost to cult hero status, when was the last politician that popular?

My right-leaning tendencies (e.g., pro-death penalty, pro-surge, "small gov't is good gov't") prevent me from getting 100% behind Obama. But, he's certainly the most charismatic speaker we've had in a LONG time. Moreover, like Reagan and JFK and unlike Bush and Hillary, his message is positive and uplifting. He also is youthful and intelligent. I think there are more than enough reasons for people to find Obama inspiring, fascinating, etc.

In some quarters, Obama may be appealing because he is black. In other quarters, however, Obama's race is not so helpful. Moreover, there are an awful lot of black politicians who have never been propelled to such prominence in such a short period of time.

So, I guess I have to ask you if you really think Obama is so popular because he is black? If so, do you believe that his skin color may adversely affect him among a certain segment of the population?