On Blache

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

I just thought he had the stronger argument, it didn't mean I supported 100% of what he said.

I agree the O is more to blame overall, but it's naive to think the D hasn't had a role at times this year as well. Especially during the 4th quarter as of late, not including today of course.

There were times that the defense got too much into a prevent defense, for example our win against the Cowboys. I was listening to the game on the radio and Sonny Jurgensen was complaining that the team was not blitzing and allowed the Cowboys to score on a late TD. And that was a good game played by the offense. However, I think the offense's slow start in a lot of the games and the missed opportunities to score points, especially those off turnovers, had a big impact in the defense's woes in the 4th quarter.

I do agree that there are a lot of things that need to change on the defensive side of the ball. We need to see more play out of Jason Taylor like we saw today, we need to figure out what's going to happen with our aging LB group, and we need some type of stability/consistency with our defensive backs. But to imply that the defense is the major problem in our loses, overlooking the huge deficiencies (sp?) in the offense is just being too narrow minded. This team's priority should be the offensive line, getting more production of out the offensive side of the ball, and then the defense.

[MrJL]

we NEED an elite defense, though.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by MrJL

we NEED an elite defense, though.

If our offense was average, our defense would be good enough. Our defense is not elite, since we expect our offense to be able to keep us in the game, but they don't. Our defense, although not elite, has kept this team from having a losing record I would say 2 out of the 3 past years (and possible 3 out of the 4 years if we finish 9-7). Our defense is really good, but not Titans/Ravens good. And if our offense would be average, we'd be going to the playoffs.

[thomasfan31]

The defense has carried this team and Blache is the mastermind behind it all this....why are we complaining about him again?!! This thread is just as pathetic as the portis one.

[MrJL]

Originally Posted by thomasfan31

The defense has carried this team and Blache is the mastermind behind it all this....why are we complaining about him again?!! This thread is just as pathetic as the portis one.

Hey, even the Washington Post and commentators were talking about the D being unable to get off the field in the fourth and suffering breakdown in the fourth in the past week.

[maroonandblack30]

I just re-read the whole Gtripp vs. Hail debate and have to say that I find it ludacris that a guy who puts so much effort into analyzing the Skins could ever say they have a "below" average pass defense and that they "give up too many points".

You could make an arguement that they don't have a "great" pass defense, but to say they are below averagae is beyond hysterical. (And I read all your super in-depth stats)

I looked at this arguement from an objective view and honestly I couldn't sum up your arguement in a couple sentences if I had to... You try to use "context neutral stats" to support your arguement but then "discount" Romo's performance because he had a cast on his hand. You lose all credibility with me right there, thats just intellectually dishonest.

Stats are good and all, but they are just tools. Usually they can't show you the whole picture with out context. You have obviously picked the stats that support your arguement while chosing to ignore the once Hail throws out.

Bottom line is this: Anyone who has watched every Skin's game this year will tell you their pass defense is no where close to "below" average.

And where are all these points that the Skins are so bad at "not preventing"? Cause they sure don't show up on the score board.

Your arguement, while eloquent, just doesn't make sense.

The fact that they are 5th in overall defense and 6th in points allowed proves in itself that they are at absolute minimum "average" (most would argue above average). You have yet to address why you consider those stats to be meaningless.

[MrJL]

Originally Posted by maroonandblack30

I just re-read the whole Gtripp vs. Hail debate and have to say that I find it ludacris that a guy who puts so much effort into analyzing the Skins could ever say they have a "below" average pass defense and that they "give up too many points".

You could make an arguement that they don't have a "great" pass defense, but to say they are below averagae is beyond hysterical. (And I read all your super in-depth stats)

I looked at this arguement from an objective view and honestly I couldn't sum up your arguement in a couple sentences if I had to... You try to use "context neutral stats" to support your arguement but then "discount" Romo's performance because he had a cast on his hand. You lose all credibility with me right there, thats just intellectually dishonest.

Stats are good and all, but they are just tools. Usually they can't show you the whole picture with out context. You have obviously picked the stats that support your arguement while chosing to ignore the once Hail throws out.

Bottom line is this: Anyone who has watched every Skin's game this year will tell you their pass defense is no where close to "below" average.

And where are all these points that the Skins are so bad at "not preventing"? Cause they sure don't show up on the score board.

Your arguement, while eloquent, just doesn't make sense.

The fact that they are 5th in overall defense and 6th in points allowed proves in itself that they are at absolute minimum "average" (most would argue above average). You have yet to address why you consider those stats to be meaningless.

For me it's because at times late in the game when the Skins were only a touchdown or a field goal down, as hard as it would be to get that for their O to get that, they've given up a touchdown or a field goal to make it a two score game.

And also because I've actually seen the DB's blanket recievers for an insanely long period and the line not get anywhere near the QB

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by maroonandblack30

The fact that they are 5th in overall defense and 6th in points allowed proves in itself that they are at absolute minimum "average" (most would argue above average). You have yet to address why you consider those stats to be meaningless.

Well, I mean, I addressed this very clearly. PPG simply ignores the amount of drives in a game. Period. If you have an offense that sustains drives, and a defense that allows sustained drives (which I proved that the Redskins do), theres going to be a relatively small amount of points scored in a game. I showed very clearly that the Redskins ACTUALLY prevent points at a league average rate.

That alone doesn't prove that the whole defense is below average (which actually was never, ever my argument). If you had read my arguments throughoughly, as you claim to have, you'll know that I went beyond what the stats say to show the downward trend in production.

But give Hail the credit for predicting the performance by the pass D against the Eagles (sort of), because I thought our downward trend would continue under Blache. I was wrong on that much.

It will be interesting to see how we finish the season, as Blache's major problems this year have come against below average offenses (and divisional opponents). But if you read and understood what I wrote, you'll agree that the defense isn't elite, at least not like the type of elite they showed they could be against Philly.

The "below average" pass defense, was an opinion, nothing more. The defense proved on Sunday that they can still have great games, something they hadn't done in over two months.

[MTK]

Alright guys let's agree to disagree and move on.

thanks