how and why the Raiders will make the playoffs

[GTripp0012]

It's tough to make the playoffs in the AFC, with basically every division being like the NFC East in competitiveness every year.

The Bengals, Jags, and Dolphins have crashed the playoff party in the last three years, so certainly, it wouldn't be impossible for the Raiders to do it, but:

1) The Bengals needed to go 6-0 in the division to make it last year
2) The Dolphins needed to get 11 wins to make the playoffs against a soft schedule, and couldn't have done it without Brady's injury
3) The Jaguars' starting QB threw 3 INTs in 13 games in 2007.

If you're into such stats, the average team DVOA of these three teams was only 6.3%, or somewhere between the 2007 Redskins and the 2008 Redskins. So it's certainly possible. But as the Raiders have been the second worst team in football over the last three years, a playoff berth would require both a significant improvement (which is probably coming), and something terrible to happen to Philip Rivers, which may or may not be coming.

[Rainy Parade]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

It's tough to make the playoffs in the AFC, with basically every division being like the NFC East in competitiveness every year.

The Bengals, Jags, and Dolphins have crashed the playoff party in the last three years, so certainly, it wouldn't be impossible for the Raiders to do it, but:

1) The Bengals needed to go 6-0 in the division to make it last year
2) The Dolphins needed to get 11 wins to make the playoffs against a soft schedule, and couldn't have done it without Brady's injury
3) The Jaguars' starting QB threw 3 INTs in 13 games in 2007.

If you're into such stats, the average team DVOA of these three teams was only 6.3%, or somewhere between the 2007 Redskins and the 2008 Redskins. So it's certainly possible. But as the Raiders have been the second worst team in football over the last three years, a playoff berth would require both a significant improvement (which is probably coming), and something terrible to happen to Philip Rivers, which may or may not be coming.

great points, it would certainly be a challenge and a suprising result if it happened this year.

[skinsfan69]

They would have to win the division. No way do they make it as a wild card. San Diego still has to be the favorite but after that I don't think there is a big gap bewtween Oak, Denver and KC.

[freddyg12]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

They would have to win the division. No way do they make it as a wild card. San Diego still has to be the favorite but after that I don't think there is a big gap bewtween Oak, Denver and KC.

KC hasn't done enough to be a winning team IMO, but Denver should at least give teams a run for their money. they are getting younger, but will need another year to be a winning team. SD has the only complete roster in the div.

[SirClintonPortis]

If I remember correctly, he covers the Raiders because it's a part of his job there.

BTW, I think JC is roughly equivalent to Gradkowski. I guess one could argue is he's a slight upgrade.

However, their locker room probably needs some air freshening, and JC could probably at least provide some guidance and direction there, but he can't do it all alone.

[freddyg12]

On the raiders - skins theme, I watched the "30 for 30" movie the other night by ICe Cube, "Straight Outta LA." It was awesome, except for the clips of the LA Raiders killing us in the super bowl!

They showed an interview w/Dexter Manley from back then. Of course, they had to show M. Allen & his famous run on us. That was the apex for the LA raiders, they went hollywood after that, became a ghettoized fan base & mediocre at best for the rest of the 80s.

Interestingly, of the clips they showed about the raiders demise, they had a Raiders - Skins game in LA w/Jay Schroeder throwing a pick 6 to Martin Mayhew. The highlight was also accompanied by Willie Gault saying the raiders didn't have a great qb then. That they showed that game was fitting, since we traded Schroeder to them for the best LT in the game, Jim Lachey. Lachey went on to win a super bowl w/Joe Gibbs & D. Williams. Schroeder continued his downward slide w/the raiders. Kind of funny to look at that w/the recent JC trade having gone down.

Another funny thing in the movie were the tapes of Shanahan being introduced as head coach in 88 I believe. Rod Martin, raiders LB from the super bowl team, said that Shanahan wanted to make them a finesse team and "took the fun out" of football for him. Shanahan's & Al Davis' stormy relationship has always been well known in the press. Yet, w/Bruce Allen here, we have a former raiders gm who obviously can make a deal w/Al Davis et al.

On the raiders making the playoffs this year; I'd say they're about in the same boat we are. It will take some good fortune & overachieving to get there.

[davy]

Originally Posted by freddyg12

On the raiders - skins theme, I watched the "30 for 30" movie the other night by ICe Cube, "Straight Outta LA." It was awesome, except for the clips of the LA Raiders killing us in the super bowl!

They showed an interview w/Dexter Manley from back then. Of course, they had to show M. Allen & his famous run on us. That was the apex for the LA raiders, they went hollywood after that, became a ghettoized fan base & mediocre at best for the rest of the 80s.

Interestingly, of the clips they showed about the raiders demise, they had a Raiders - Skins game in LA w/Jay Schroeder throwing a pick 6 to Martin Mayhew. The highlight was also accompanied by Willie Gault saying the raiders didn't have a great qb then. That they showed that game was fitting, since we traded Schroeder to them for the best LT in the game, Jim Lachey. Lachey went on to win a super bowl w/Joe Gibbs & D. Williams. Schroeder continued his downward slide w/the raiders. Kind of funny to look at that w/the recent JC trade having gone down.

Another funny thing in the movie were the tapes of Shanahan being introduced as head coach in 88 I believe. Rod Martin, raiders LB from the super bowl team, said that Shanahan wanted to make them a finesse team and "took the fun out" of football for him. Shanahan's & Al Davis' stormy relationship has always been well known in the press. Yet, w/Bruce Allen here, we have a former raiders gm who obviously can make a deal w/Al Davis et al.

On the raiders making the playoffs this year; I'd say they're about in the same boat we are. It will take some good fortune & overachieving to get there.

Better make that Joe Gibbs & M.Rypien.

[freddyg12]

Originally Posted by davy

Better make that Joe Gibbs & M.Rypien.

my bad, Lachey came here in 88, year after Williams won the SB mvp. I always associate Schroeder w/Williams because the latter said that one game JS told him "get your ass outta there" when he replaced him once during their qb shuffle of 87. Williams got the last laugh for sure.

[BringBackJoeT]

Originally Posted by freddyg12

On the raiders - skins theme, I watched the "30 for 30" movie the other night by ICe Cube, "Straight Outta LA." It was awesome, except for the clips of the LA Raiders killing us in the super bowl!

They showed an interview w/Dexter Manley from back then. Of course, they had to show M. Allen & his famous run on us. That was the apex for the LA raiders, they went hollywood after that, became a ghettoized fan base & mediocre at best for the rest of the 80s.

Interestingly, of the clips they showed about the raiders demise, they had a Raiders - Skins game in LA w/Jay Schroeder throwing a pick 6 to Martin Mayhew. The highlight was also accompanied by Willie Gault saying the raiders didn't have a great qb then. That they showed that game was fitting, since we traded Schroeder to them for the best LT in the game, Jim Lachey. Lachey went on to win a super bowl w/Joe Gibbs & D. Williams. Schroeder continued his downward slide w/the raiders. Kind of funny to look at that w/the recent JC trade having gone down.

Another funny thing in the movie were the tapes of Shanahan being introduced as head coach in 88 I believe. Rod Martin, raiders LB from the super bowl team, said that Shanahan wanted to make them a finesse team and "took the fun out" of football for him. Shanahan's & Al Davis' stormy relationship has always been well known in the press. Yet, w/Bruce Allen here, we have a former raiders gm who obviously can make a deal w/Al Davis et al.

On the raiders making the playoffs this year; I'd say they're about in the same boat we are. It will take some good fortune & overachieving to get there.

I've watched almost all of the 30-for-30s, but deliberately skipped this one because I knew, as did everyone I imagine, that the Redskins-Raiders SB would be profiled, arguably the most disappointing loss in the history of the franchise. Since then, my Raider hatred has been right on par with my Cowboy hatred. If we are actually going to post on this board evaluations of how the Raiders are going to fare going forward, I'd much prefer that the title read instead "How and why the Raiders will continue to suck."

[firstdown]

So you really think because JC is a hard working QB that will turn the other players into hard working players? Wonder why it didn't work here? Oh, maybe it did but his stron effort could not over come his lack of talent.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by firstdown

So you really think because JC is a hard working QB that will turn the other players into hard working players? Wonder why it didn't work here? Oh, maybe it did but his stron effort could not over come his lack of talent.

We had bigger problems, don't you think?

[Rainy Parade]

Originally Posted by firstdown

So you really think because JC is a hard working QB that will turn the other players into hard working players? Wonder why it didn't work here? Oh, maybe it did but his stron effort could not over come his lack of talent.

no, my point was that switching from Russell to Gradkowski was obviously a spark and that team won with Gradkowski (hardly a worldbeater himself) so i meant that handing the keys to a guy who gives a shit and works hard might have a similar effect.

[MonkFan4Life]

True Matt we did have other problems but unless JC has contracted a sudden case of the Leaders then he won't bring much of a change in Oakland. They have talent but who is the leader of that team ? IMO the QB needs to be the leader of the offense if not the team. I think that Jason's leadership was never a strong suit. All that lead by example crap is for the other guys, the QB has to be the guy. He has to make the other 10 guys in that huddle believe that they can accomplish whatever task they are up against. If he finds a way to call his own protections, become more vocal at the line, and actually fortifies himself as the guy then Oakland could be heading up the charts. Many of you have called me out for my hatred of JC but it wasn't him, but his game. He can't sit and crave the love of his Front Office, Coaches, Fans, he has to make them understand that they must love him because he is what they want him to be. He never did that here which is why he is gone. If anyone wonders why I said leader so much, and that he lacked leadership skills then I'll say that I wouldn't have if JC's former teammates didn't express the how much it lacked before Donovan got here.

Then again, he still needs to win the QB job for all of that to matter right ? One more thing, dude are you Jason Campbell's cousin or something ?

Be easy and Hail To The Redskins !!!

[freddyg12]

Originally Posted by MonkFan4Life

True Matt we did have other problems but unless JC has contracted a sudden case of the Leaders then he won't bring much of a change in Oakland. They have talent but who is the leader of that team ? IMO the QB needs to be the leader of the offense if not the team. I think that Jason's leadership was never a strong suit. All that lead by example crap is for the other guys, the QB has to be the guy. He has to make the other 10 guys in that huddle believe that they can accomplish whatever task they are up against. If he finds a way to call his own protections, become more vocal at the line, and actually fortifies himself as the guy then Oakland could be heading up the charts. Many of you have called me out for my hatred of JC but it wasn't him, but his game. He can't sit and crave the love of his Front Office, Coaches, Fans, he has to make them understand that they must love him because he is what they want him to be. He never did that here which is why he is gone. If anyone wonders why I said leader so much, and that he lacked leadership skills then I'll say that I wouldn't have if JC's former teammates didn't express the how much it lacked before Donovan got here.

Then again, he still needs to win the QB job for all of that to matter right ? One more thing, dude are you Jason Campbell's cousin or something ?

Be easy and Hail To The Redskins !!!

Since this is a skins forum, let's look back at the SB winning qbs of Gibbs. Only 1 was a vocal leader, Joe T. Otherwise, Rypien & D. Williams were both guys that led by example.

If a coach has a strong personality & there is a sense of discipline & unity on a team, I don't think on field leaders have to be constant spokesmen. That's one of many reasons that I wished JC could've stayed & played for Shanahan. I believe Shanahan would've given him the kind of 'mandate' to lead that he needed, since he doesn't appear to be a vocal leader.

In this sense, under a coach like Shanahan (or Gibbs), the qb becomes the voice of the coach & doesn't have to shout the message, just convey it.

[MonkFan4Life]

Originally Posted by freddyg12

Since this is a skins forum, let's look back at the SB winning qbs of Gibbs. Only 1 was a vocal leader, Joe T. Otherwise, Rypien & D. Williams were both guys that led by example.

If a coach has a strong personality & there is a sense of discipline & unity on a team, I don't think on field leaders have to be constant spokesmen. That's one of many reasons that I wished JC could've stayed & played for Shanahan. I believe Shanahan would've given him the kind of 'mandate' to lead that he needed, since he doesn't appear to be a vocal leader.

In this sense, under a coach like Shanahan (or Gibbs), the qb becomes the voice of the coach & doesn't have to shout the message, just convey it.

You are right IF you have a coach that is your leader, or vocal then you don't HAVE to be but why can't you lead your team. I'm going to try my best to keep this on topic as it relates to the Raiders. Now, you wish that Shanny would've kept JC but he didn't. Do you know why JC ended up in Oakland ? Because the tape doesn't lie. Period, Point, Blank. The man doesn't quite exude Franchise guy. It isn't about the line or the receivers it's the tape on him. His slow decision making, his reluctance to learn and call his line protections, his reluctance to take charge of the offense. That is why. I can't stand how we as Redskins fans always say well if we have a line then we can have anyone back there. It is simply not true.

As a QB you have to have something uncanny about you that get's you over that hump. People say that Rothlesberger is shit but he makes a rack of money and do you know why ? Because when the game is on the line you know that you know that you have a chance. Until JC can find that IT Factor Fairyand show the higher ups that he gives you that he will be a second tier QB. For all the "executives" and "unnamed sources" that say how good he is NO ONE WANTED HIM. Let me repeat,.... NO ONE WANTED HIM. It wasn't the "horrible line that he had", it wasn't the "running back that has lost it", or the "Wide Receivers that can't get it done",.. it was him. The QB that doesn't get the ball out fast enough, or the QB that doesn't have one bit of pocket presence, and who is clearly missing that IT factor.

As I said before, if he gets that then he can be more that a QB with pretty good stats once the game is over but really didn't do much for you.

If anyone would like to argue JC's lack of leadership then as I said before, why is it that Donovan brought what was NEEDED so badly ? Remember the players said this, not just me. Once he gets all of that down then IF he wins the job in Oakland then they might be able to hold down one of the top spots in the AFC. Til then, enjoy your 8-8 ceiling Oakland.