Armstrong bad choice?

[SirClintonPortis]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

We've waited 19 years for a return to the promise land. In this day and age you shouldn't have to wait that long to get yourself back on the championship track. The New Orleans Saints went from 3-13 in 2005 to Super Bowl champs in four years.

Not only that, this team, the coaching staff and the front office have taken the "win now" approach. There's no rebuilding here. There's no time for the "young talent" to develop. In fact, this is an older team -- there's not much in the way of "young talent" to begin with.

Marko Mitchell had his chance. He has seen the ball in regular season play, has been invited to minicamps, and played in preseason. He's bounced around from team to team this year and coaching staffs haven't found a reason to keep him. He's had chance after chance to make an impact.

Let go of him. He's done.

Those 19 years were not necessarily defined by an ipassive FO, especially after Snyder took over.

Basically, there are a 1000 football cliches that are half-truths, but if you want to cling to those instead of concrete economic principles, then I'm glad that you aren't running any football team.

[skinsnut]

Guys,
I agree throwing to the least experienced small WR on a fade in the endzone was probably not the best choice...but the reality is this....when you have a really fast WR opposite Moss, it opens up the game for him and others to get open...regardless if he can catch or not....so lets not just look at his individual numbers, lets look at the impact of having a fast WR does to our overall ability to get the ball to Moss and TE's....

What I saw was that Moss was a lot more open that he has been in a while.

[GusFrerotte]

I disagree with M Westbrook and Albert Connell being bad choices, as they did end up producing late in their stay with us. The Turner era was rather "funky" as the ownership of the franchise, was up in the air for the most part, and we didn't have a D coordinator worth a damn. On top of that you got stuck with the Shuler disaster that put a 7th round QB as our starter. Although Westbrook got banged up often, he still was a lot more servicable that Jacobs and Kelly. I also am not sure Rod Gardner was a waste either since he also did produce for us, but never was a TO, Ocho type like we hoped. THe problem with these guys basically is we have been in rebuilding mode constantly for going on 2 decades.

[Beemnseven]

Dude what the hell are you talking about?

[SirClintonPortis]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

Dude what the hell are you talking about?

Four years is ample time to grab talent steadily through the draft and develop them. In fact, the litmus test for WRs is only three years at most and there should be flashes of talent within the first and second years. You look at the Saints roster, and there's a whole load of players they groomed from the time they drafted them or picked up as UDFA.
Draft well to build the team and draft well to keep the team good. Use FA and trades to fill up any remaining holes or snatch unexpected windfalls. I doubt you'll see any team who does NOT follow this mantra actually make it to the Super Bowl.

[GusFrerotte]

Originally Posted by SirClintonPortis

Four years is ample time to grab talent steadily through the draft and develop them. In fact, the litmus test for WRs is only three years at most and there should be flashes of talent within the first and second years. You look at the Saints roster, and there's a whole load of players they groomed from the time they drafted them or picked up as UDFA.
Draft well to build the team and draft well to keep the team good. Use FA and trades to fill up any remaining holes or snatch unexpected windfalls. I doubt you'll any team who does NOT follow this mantra and actually make it to the Super Bowl.

Amen to that!!!!! We have been using draft picks as bargaining chips to get high priced FAs that usually don't deliver the rate of return on our "investment". For over a decade we have been in this win now mode using draft picks to secure free agent skilled players or linemen instead of using the picks to actually get young talent that can be developed. How the hell can you develop talent, always changing coaching staffs and schemes? Using FAs should be used to fill remaining gaps like you have said, that the draft couldn't cover. We have only been fully utilizing Free agency and have hampered our drafts significantly, thus any rebuilding effort is stymied.

[SirClintonPortis]

Originally Posted by GusFrerotte

Amen to that!!!!! We have been using draft picks as bargaining chips to get high priced FAs that usually don't deliver the rate of return on our "investment". For over a decade we have been in this win now mode using draft picks to secure free agent skilled players or linemen instead of using the picks to actually get young talent that can be developed. How the hell can you develop talent, always changing coaching staffs and schemes? Using FAs should be used to fill remaining gaps like you have said, that the draft couldn't cover. We have only been fully utilizing Free agency and have hampered our drafts significantly, thus any rebuilding effort is stymied.

I do not count traded players as free agents as they are not really "free". However, "established" in the NFL is absolutely NOT synonymous with "risk-free".

Every player transaction carries some risk; it's just that if you usually flame out on a draft pick you just lose the pick and the cheap contract you gave the rookie. Flame out on a "well-paid" FA and you lose out on more money, cap room, and possibly a cheaper alternative. Flame out on a "big-name" trade like Brandon Lloyd and you lose out on cap room, picks for potential future players, and whoever would have been on the roster spot instead of the traded player.

Not that one should NEVER touch trades or FA, but they should be used for finding role players or windfalls like Brees, Reggie White, Cutler, etc. It definitely should not be every season, "let's just grab the top FAs and make a big trade this year at all costs". Even someone playing freaking Madden(at least the ancient Madden 2002) could see that the top FAs for an offseason may not go over a rating of 80 and/or are overpriced and old.