One man's view of Santonio Holmes and the Skins

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by SirClintonPortis

Age 33 is the wall that very few WRs ever climb. Ochocinco is about to be cut by the Bengals, and he's 33. A 3 year contract is nuttery. Not to mention that Holmes has usually been more efficient than Moss even with a poor QB or poor OL.

Santana turned 32 a month ago. I'm not saying we give him some huge 3 year deal, but a reasonable 3 year contract with some backloaded money is most likely what Santana will get on the open market. Just my speculation.

Signing a guy in Moss who just turned 32 a month ago who's coming off an 1100+ yard 93 catch season (in a bad offense with no consistent QB play) to a 3 year deal certainly isn't "nuttery." The numbers just have to be right. He's no long-term answer, but it's more reasonable than inking a significantly larger deal for a WR in Holmes who really won't be any better than Moss with our QB situation over the next 2 or so seasons and will bring significant character issues to boot.

[SirClintonPortis]

Originally Posted by GMScud

Santana turned 32 a month ago. I'm not saying we give him some huge 3 year deal, but a reasonable 3 year contract with some backloaded money is most likely what Santana will get on the open market. Just my speculation.

Signing a guy in Moss who just turned 32 a month ago who's coming off an 1100+ yard 93 catch season (in a bad offense with no consistent QB play) to a 3 year deal certainly isn't "nuttery." The numbers just have to be right. He's no long-term answer, but it's more reasonable than inking a significantly larger deal for a WR in Holmes who really won't be any better than Moss with our QB situation over the next 2 or so seasons and will bring significant character issues to boot.

As if a player's performance when his body is "fresher" makes him immune to the depreciation of his body afterwards.

Moss's stats were precisely inflated because he was one of the few "good" offensive players at the offense's disposal, and thus became the default target. But Moss's game is based on his speed, and that fading away fast. Thus, his days as the de facto #1 are nearly gone.

A 3-year deal for him would have to be like Larry Johnson's: one that is easy to cut him should he not prove effective anymore. It doesn't matter if we sign Holmes or not. Any long-term deal for Moss needs to realistically weigh how much he can contribute to WINS in the future. Usually unless the WR is headed for the HOF, WRs hit their wall at around 33 or 34.

Quite frankly, I'd pass on both. We have little need for short-term(Moss) or mid-term(Holmes) players. We need to focus on getting long-term or "eternal-term" players

[artmonkforhallofamein07]

I have heard all of the reports, but at the same time this new regime is pretty tight on the information that comes out. Last year we were connected to alot of the top guys to only find out later that we were never even at the bargaining table.

Also why are all of the article pertaining to the Redskins still going with the Ol' Dan Snyder line? Snyder needs to stay away from player X... Have so many in the media really not checked their stories before sending them to print? There are new cats in charge here.... rant over...

[mooby]

The one thing Holmes has going for him is that he's clutch. But is he consistent? That's an entirely different story. And I don't think it's a good idea to sign a guy to a big money contract when he's one strike away from being suspended big time.

[#56fanatic]

I have been saying since the word was out we were looking at Holmes that we should stay away from him. He and Moss seem to be the exact same players. Yes Holmes is younger, but Moss has been a great Redskins, had the most productive year of his career last year, and will come a whole hell of a lot cheaper than Holmes. I just dont see where we need to bring him in. Why not let our younger guys play? Armstrong had a decent year. Kelly (often injured) has had a ton of time to heal and learn and if he is healthy, I see him as a HUGE contributer. Terrence Austin is another guy that can use some playing time. And the two rookies we have, Hankerson being one that can start. We need to develop our younger guys and let them play. Its all about the Oline. If they get this shored up and solid, the QB can git these guys and be very productive. Look at the Pats, Saints. THey have a very pass happy offense and have found some very good quality, and some great receivers by letting them go out and play. We NEVER do that. We dont need another big name receiver, we need good Olineman.

[That Guy]

we should look at 2nd tier WRs. moss wants back. the jets are making holmes priority #1... so we should scoop edwards out instead, that way we can still get a guy that can't stay off the police blotter, but at a much friendlier price. Plax could be a steal too :P

honestly, between moss AA cooley and hankerson/fred davis/kelly/austin/etc we can do alright. If we don't have a DL worth two dams or we're missing a starting CB, we won't be winning much. we need at least one BIG upgrade on the OL too, preferably so we ditch rabach.

[SBXVII]

Originally Posted by That Guy

we should look at 2nd tier WRs. moss wants back. the jets are making holmes priority #1... so we should scoop edwards out instead, that way we can still get a guy that can't stay off the police blotter, but at a much friendlier price. Plax could be a steal too :P

honestly, between moss AA cooley and hankerson/fred davis/kelly/austin/etc we can do alright. If we don't have a DL worth two dams or we're missing a starting CB, we won't be winning much. we need at least one BIG upgrade on the OL too, preferably so we ditch rabach.

I agree with you here except with Kelly. It's one thing to think "hey we already have a player on the team who can contribute" it's another to think he will actually play when he has not been able to stay healthy since drafted. I go back to my "hope" statement. I'd rather go into the season with Plax, Edwards, Holmes, or Rice and be pleasantly supprised if Kelly stayed healthy and we had two awsome weapons to compliment Moss and AA, or even more weapons if the Rookies pan out then to go into the season thinking.... we have Moss, AA, the Rookies, and hopefully Kelly steps up because if he doesn't step up like in the past we are sitting in a bad spot just like last year with only to decent weapons in Moss and AA.

Speaking of Moss, we could probably get the other Moss cheap also.... imagine the Moss/Moss threat. Say what you will about R.Moss but he's a hard worker and would show the young guys what they need to do to be great. Even if its just for a one year deal. I might even think about T.O. for a 1 yr deal only because he's worth his weight in gold his first yr and he has a great work ethic that our rookies could stand to pick up, then let him go.

[SBXVII]

I'm not saying we need Holms, but we do need a #1 WR. Some would say we drafted one, and I would agree and "hope" one works out, but great teams don't go into the season with hope. They go into the season with a plan.

1st- I'd contact whatever OL FA's that are available.
2nd- I'd contact FA CB's in case we let Rogers go.
3rd- I'd look to any other defensive players that could help the team.
4rth- I'd think about picking up a UFDA QB.

I know, I know my #4 is a bold statement. But if Grossman is resigned then the team won't be too horrid even if I let Beck start. So I think I'd bring in a young Rookie and try them out. If they didn't work out then next year we still can draft a QB, either trade up or look to FA.

[SBXVII]

Ooops, lol, I failed to throw in the fact I'd still contact a WR. Who is out there that are #1's? I think the Junkies mentioned Braylon Edwards, Holmes, and Sidney Rice. They liked the idea of Rice because he's the youngest of the bunch and most physical.

Basically I'd contact the agents of all positions OL, WR, CB, and whatever other defensive positions needed. Its easier to contact the agents and say "hey we are interested come talk to us", most agents know if they can't get a good price out of us they can drive up the cost to other teams by using the Redskins name. So I'm pretty sure if any agents are contacted then players will be holding out until Friday or atleast untill after they talk with the Skins to see what the Skins will pay for them to use against their current team or other interested teams.

[SmootSmack]

I keep hearing Santonio from basically one source repeated several times, but I hear Rice and Jones from several sources. Not sure which if any are going to happen.

[SBXVII]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I keep hearing Santonio from basically one source repeated several times, but I hear Rice and Jones from several sources. Not sure which if any are going to happen.

I know people have issue's with the idea of Plax or R.Moss but if reports are true with R.Moss being in tip top shape and if Plax is ready to reprove himself then they would be cheap pick ups and KS's system is a pass happy system which should make them happy to want to come here over other teams who might be more run oriented.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I keep hearing Santonio from basically one source repeated several times, but I hear Rice and Jones from several sources. Not sure which if any are going to happen.

Smoot knows what's up. A tweet from another insider below.

Holmes looks to be a smoke screen and a good one. ALOT of talk involving Rice this evening like pre lockout. Back at it early AM GN.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

Smoot knows what's up. A tweet from another insider below.

For all I know we're hearing stuff from the same source. I'll say this, the new Redskins have been excellent at smoke screens and misdirections

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

For all I know we're hearing stuff from the same source. I'll say this, the new Redskins have been excellent at smoke screens and misdirections

FUnny you mention that because seems like they've done a 180 according to that same insider. Back to Holmes.

All night I heard about Rice.. this morning in contact with Holmes.

I agree 100%. The Skins are brilliant at smoke screens now.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I keep hearing Santonio from basically one source repeated several times, but I hear Rice and Jones from several sources. Not sure which if any are going to happen.

Do any of these sources think we'd also resign moss?