Nick Hanauer - Job Creator Myth

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by RedskinRat

More information along the same lines:

Barbara Ehrenreich, Looting the Lives of the Poor


Individually the poor are not too tempting to thieves, for obvious reasons. Mug a banker and you might score a wallet containing a month’s rent. Mug a janitor and you will be lucky to get away with bus fare to flee the crime scene. But as Business Week helpfully pointed out in 2007, the poor in aggregate provide a juicy target for anyone depraved enough to make a business of stealing from them.

The trick is to rob them in ways that are systematic, impersonal, and almost impossible to trace to individual perpetrators. Employers, for example, can simply program their computers to shave a few dollars off each paycheck, or they can require workers to show up 30 minutes or more before the time clock starts ticking.

Lenders, including major credit companies as well as payday lenders, have taken over the traditional role of the street-corner loan shark, charging the poor insanely high rates of interest. When supplemented with late fees (themselves subject to interest), the resulting effective interest rate can be as high as 600% a year, which is perfectly legal in many states.

It’s not just the private sector that’s preying on the poor. Local governments are discovering that they can partially make up for declining tax revenues through fines, fees, and other costs imposed on indigent defendants, often for crimes no more dastardly than driving with a suspended license. And if that seems like an inefficient way to make money, given the high cost of locking people up, a growing number of jurisdictions have taken to charging defendants for their court costs and even the price of occupying a jail cell.

I think I can see where this is going.

Yea, the poor make poor decisions and it cost them money. They always have (thats why they are poor in most cases) and always will but the left never wants to blame them (their voting block) for their bad decisions. I see it everday and you just want to shake them and tell them to stop doing stupid stuff. I'd say my bottom 20% of low income customers have more trafic violations then the other 80% of customers. Then they cannot understand why their insurance is so expensive.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by firstdown

Yea, the poor make poor decisions and it cost them money.

...and when the rich make poor decisions, they make the poor pay for it.


Funny how that works. The poor (and middle class) have to pay for not only their mistakes, but the mistakes of the wealthy as well.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

...and when the rich make poor decisions, they make the poor pay for it.


Funny how that works. The poor (and middle class) have to pay for not only their mistakes, but the mistakes of the wealthy as well.

What poor decisions did the rich make I'm paying for.

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by firstdown

What poor decisions did the rich make I'm paying for.

auto industry bailouts, bank bailouts, defense bailouts... all of these cause by bad ceo level leadership and greedy mortgage bankers that ended up costing us all a lot of money.

and it's silly that i'd pay a 24%+ effective tax rate while those (like letterman) who get free money from subsidized farming, and others that hide money in off shore accounts and use low taxed investment income etc pay 15-18% even though they make 5-100x more than me. fair share and all.

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by firstdown

Yea, the poor make poor decisions and it cost them money. They always have (thats why they are poor in most cases) and always will but the left never wants to blame them (their voting block) for their bad decisions. I see it everday and you just want to shake them and tell them to stop doing stupid stuff. I'd say my bottom 20% of low income customers have more trafic violations then the other 80% of customers. Then they cannot understand why their insurance is so expensive.

got proof? you still haven't told me how all those gi's would have managed even though you said it wouldn't be a problem either.

let's back up statements with facts instead of blind rhetoric please.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by That Guy

got proof? you still haven't told me how all those gi's would have managed even though you said it wouldn't be a problem either.

let's back up statements with facts instead of blind rhetoric please.

I've been in the insurance business for over twenty years and pulled thousands of driving records and its what I see.

What I said about the GI bill was that your saying without the bill they would not have gone to college and I say they would have found a way to attend without the GI bill. You think people need a gov. program I think people know how to make it on their own. The GI bill is not a very good example becuase it a benifit earned by serving.

[That Guy]

without the gi bill there wouldn't have been as many doctors or lawyers. despite what you may think, getting a massive loan to go to harvard just didn't happen all that easily unlike today. less high income earners, less boats etc.

if it'd be so easy, tell me how millions of vets on army enlisted pay in 1940 would afford full college rides while supporting a family... you know, cause it shouldn't be a problem, like you said :P

and i wouldn't trust the tax foundation, check who's funding them and how their views magically match those of their donors... hmm.

and by the way, building one boat for one person doesn't creat thousands of long term jobs. having enough 80-100k earners could sustain an actual workforce much more feasibly.

[dmek25]

there isn't anyone on this board included in the top 1%, so why do we spend time defending them? i say let the rich pull their fair share, and even a bit more, if its going to help the cause. i guarantee they aren't going to miss it

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by dmek25

there isn't anyone on this board included in the top 1%, so why do we spend time defending them? i say let the rich pull their fair share, and even a bit more, if its going to help the cause. i guarantee they aren't going to miss it

Well considering that a person making 350k is technically in the top 1% it's not a far cry that somebody here is in the top 1%. However, it's not who we are addressing when we speak of the top 1%. We are speaking of guys that are raking in millions upon millions of dollars a year.(and billions) Guys like Romney would be included here. Bill Gates included. The doctor down the street making 500k....not included. Why they are all lumped in together is stupid, but it's done by our tax purposes so they can hide the true numbers the ultra rich are having to pay.

Do they lump a guy making 200k with the guy making 7k? Nope, so why would you lump a guy making 350k with a dude making 20 million? They do it so they can make the numbers average out to show the public peasants....LOOK WE ARE PAYING A HIGH NUMBER. When in reality, they aren't.

Proof?

Super-rich taxed at Romney’s rate triple, says BGOV Barometer - Business - The Boston Globe

A Bloomberg review found that the Republican presidential candidate, whose tax return shows he paid an effective rate of less than 15 percent on his 2010 income, has that in common with an increasing number of the nation’s 400 top earners. Of that group, 131 paid less than 15 percent in 2008, compared with just 38 in 1999.

Since 1996, the average effective tax rate for the top-earning 400 dropped by more than one-third, to 18.1 percent from 27.8 percent. In 1996, only 10 of the ultra-rich group paid effective tax rates of less than 15 percent; 305 paid at least 25 percent

[dmek25]

do you only sell people the ins. that they need? is it about making money, or being able to look at your self. most high rollers are ruthless people

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by dmek25

do you only sell people the ins. that they need? is it about making money, or being able to look at your self. most high rollers are ruthless people

I sell insurance to people who don't even need it. Just this morning I sold a guy a homeowners policy and he does not even own a house.

I'm guessing in your book anyone making over a certain $ amount is a high roller?

[dmek25]

that came off like the wealthy never make bad decisions....hmmm

[RedskinRat]

Originally Posted by dmek25

that came off like the wealthy never make bad decisions....hmmm

They have people to do that for them....

[RedskinRat]

George Carlin -"Who Really Controls America" -...

[dmek25]

any time you choose the almighty dollar over morals, you are ruthless. just most high rollers make their money by making ruthless decisions. i couldn't have done what Romney did to make a buck