QB controversey?

[irish]

Originally Posted by SKINSnCANES

Ramsey and Brunell are both very inconsistent and I do not want either to be my starting QB.

Ramsey isnt hitting open guys, he has extremely happy feet, and on third and longs he looks short first. Brunell is the same Brunell that he was last year. He is making some very nice throws and making plays, but the first preseason game he did the same crap. Under pressue he would roll out and then throw it soaring over a receivers head or just throw it away. He doesnt make plays when you need them.

I was very upset that Campbell didnt play the last game. Clearly, hes not going to be our starter, but I dont expect us to have many wins (because of our offense) with either of those two QBs. If one of them steps up, I think at best they just dont make us lose, but they dotn do things to make us win.

Skins, I could not have said it better myself. The best we can hope for with these QBs is that they dont lose games because they wont do anything to help the team win.

[STPainmaker]

Originally Posted by SKINSnCANES

Ramsey and Brunell are both very inconsistent and I do not want either to be my starting QB.

Ramsey isnt hitting open guys, he has extremely happy feet, and on third and longs he looks short first. Brunell is the same Brunell that he was last year. He is making some very nice throws and making plays, but the first preseason game he did the same crap. Under pressue he would roll out and then throw it soaring over a receivers head or just throw it away. He doesnt make plays when you need them.

I was very upset that Campbell didnt play the last game. Clearly, hes not going to be our starter, but I dont expect us to have many wins (because of our offense) with either of those two QBs. If one of them steps up, I think at best they just dont make us lose, but they dotn do things to make us win.

Your point is well taken. The fact of the matter is during the season Ramsey has to be our man.

Brunell will not make it through a season, and by how he played last year I wouldn't want him to. If it came down to him being the starter it would be very bad news.
Campbell, unless he is hiding something very special from us, is a rookie who needs to cut his teeth in practice. Don't worry Gibbs will play him against the steelers, as per the WP article posted in the news section. Don't get me wrong I like Campbell but he doesn't need to be beaten down like Ramsey was early in his career.
Like it or not Ramsey is our guy for now. He has more starts with Gibbs, he gets the most reps....if he could only not look like a tapdancing ape in the pocket.

[Schneed10]

That said, Brunell would probably be a little frustrating too. He looks good now in preseason against scrubs, but I'd be kidding myself if I said that he looks like he's back to his prime form from his Jacksonville days. I don't think he's the same player as he was then, can't scramble as well and there are some throws he can't make any more. But he could manage the game just about as effectively as Ramsey in my opinion.

[paulskinsfan]

I thought about this over the weekend, and many many many budweisers later, Ive arrived with a very controversial theory on this issue. Now, mind you, this is just a theory and I know many of you are reaching for the arrows in your quiver even as I type but its worthy of a discussion. First, you must arrive at this conclusion: Patrick Ramsey is not our qb of the future. This is his fourth year, and he still makes the same mistakes he did as a rookie. He pats the ball, holds it too long, and then he forces throws into coverage instead of just taking what the defense gives him. I know many of you are saying, "Hold on, lets give the kid the season as the starter" and a part of me agrees with you. But another part of me suddenly came to the realization that Patrick Ramsey just isn't the answer. Now, if you can arrive at that conclusion, then what are the options? Brunnell does not have the arm of Ramsey, but he doesn't make as many stupid mistakes either. Brunnell to our team is slightly is similiar to what Trent Dilfer was to the champion Ravens' team. He got them within field goal range and he rarely made a mistake, throwing an occassional td.

So, does Brunnell give us a better chance to win immediately at the beginning of the season? I think he does. I think if we have any chance of beating Dallas in Week 2 it would be with Brunnell. So here's the theory, and please, be gentle when you attack me.....start Brunnell, and back him up with Ramsey until the season is lost, then plug in Campbell and work towards next year. I say this because in all honesty, I was always a big Patrick Ramsey fan, but now he's got an offensive line that is kicking ass, and receivers that are getting open, and he still makes the same mistakes that he did when he was a rookie. OK, take your shots, and remember its a theory.

[Redskins_P]

Originally Posted by paulskinsfan

I thought about this over the weekend, and many many many budweisers later, Ive arrived with a very controversial theory on this issue. Now, mind you, this is just a theory and I know many of you are reaching for the arrows in your quiver even as I type but its worthy of a discussion. First, you must arrive at this conclusion: Patrick Ramsey is not our qb of the future. This is his fourth year, and he still makes the same mistakes he did as a rookie. He pats the ball, holds it too long, and then he forces throws into coverage instead of just taking what the defense gives him. I know many of you are saying, "Hold on, lets give the kid the season as the starter" and a part of me agrees with you. But another part of me suddenly came to the realization that Patrick Ramsey just isn't the answer. Now, if you can arrive at that conclusion, then what are the options? Brunnell does not have the arm of Ramsey, but he doesn't make as many stupid mistakes either. Brunnell to our team is slightly is similiar to what Trent Dilfer was to the champion Ravens' team. He got them within field goal range and he rarely made a mistake, throwing an occassional td.

So, does Brunnell give us a better chance to win immediately at the beginning of the season? I think he does. I think if we have any chance of beating Dallas in Week 2 it would be with Brunnell. So here's the theory, and please, be gentle when you attack me.....start Brunnell, and back him up with Ramsey until the season is lost, then plug in Campbell and work towards next year. I say this because in all honesty, I was always a big Patrick Ramsey fan, but now he's got an offensive line that is kicking ass, and receivers that are getting open, and he still makes the same mistakes that he did when he was a rookie. OK, take your shots, and remember its a theory.

Paulskinsfan you're stupid!!! JUST KIDDING MAN!

I understand you're theory, and I respect where you're coming from. But let me ask you this. Don't you think we should give Ramsey at least a couple of weeks into the season to get comfortable with his receivers?

My theory on Ramsey is that he lacks confidence, and he needs more time to gain that. I think by week 2 if Ramsey is still making the same mistakes....then we should start worrying. But for now, I think he's still trying to gain some confidence.

[ChounsMan]

Ramsey in my opinion is not going to be the starter after this season... I have watched him play 2 preseason games so far & he's not showing me that he's ready to play in the NFL at the starting QB position.

I think he's still trying to win the game all on his own & that's a HUGE no-no..!! Throwing to WR's in the redzone that are blanketed is just flat out retarded. He's got 1st & 10 inside the 20 & he throws on 1st down an int. Now that tells me he's not even thinking about what he's doing ???? No calculating the next down or even thinking ahead 2 secs.

I like Ramsey as a competitor, but this is his 4th year & he's still playing like a rookie or at best a 2nd year sophmore. I'd like to see more of Campbell in the next 2 games with Ramsey & Brunell sharing the 1st halfs alone.

All in all, I don't expect the skins to win more than 7 games with Ramsey behind center, unless Gibbs system really can turn Ramsey's game around. Otherwise, we're going to start hearing chants for Campbell & that's not going to help Ramsey gain any more confidence,

[skinsfanthru&thru]

it's still has to be Ramsey for now, but it is nice to know from what we've seen so far, that if Brunnel is needed he can be relied on and last year was not the real Brunnel. and if absolutely neccesary, Cambell has shown good enough composure in the pocket and touch and zing on his passes to fill in some time late in the season. But unless Ramsey absolutely falls on his face, he's our starting qb.

[BrudLee]

I think people are being a little quick to declare Ramsey's career in Washington ove based on these two preseason games. We have shown precisely nothing to other teams, other than the shotgun formation. No trick plays, no special sets (other than the shotgun formation) - nothing.

We are running a "vanilla" set, while we learn what our players are capable of. Beat up Ramsey for the INTs if you want, but also admit that Brunell likely is throwing for 190 first half yards. Brunell averaged less than 133 yards per FULL GAME last year. That isn;t just bad for the passing game, it's bad for the running game as well. Having a QB who can stretch the field makes Portis's job a lot easier, too.

And honestly, as a defensive coordinator facing the Redskins, when you see Broughton, Cartwright or even Betts in the backfield (instead of Portis), you don't cheat your safeties up to the line, you leave them in pass coverage. That doesn't help Patrick.

[offiss]

Originally Posted by BrudLee

I think people are being a little quick to declare Ramsey's career in Washington ove based on these two preseason games. We have shown precisely nothing to other teams, other than the shotgun formation. No trick plays, no special sets (other than the shotgun formation) - nothing.

We are running a "vanilla" set, while we learn what our players are capable of. Beat up Ramsey for the INTs if you want, but also admit that Brunell likely is throwing for 190 first half yards. Brunell averaged less than 133 yards per FULL GAME last year. That isn;t just bad for the passing game, it's bad for the running game as well. Having a QB who can stretch the field makes Portis's job a lot easier, too.

And honestly, as a defensive coordinator facing the Redskins, when you see Broughton, Cartwright or even Betts in the backfield (instead of Portis), you don't cheat your safeties up to the line, you leave them in pass coverage. That doesn't help Patrick.

Whether we stretch the field with the pass, or run the ball to force a team to over commit to the running game, one or the other has to happen, we have to be able to impose our will on a defense, in doing so force them to over commit allowing us an advantage either in the secondary with the passing game, or at the line of scrimmage with the running game, and that's what we are not seeing in pre-season, Gibbs is not going to show that, he's not going to allow continuity on offense until the games count, his play calling right now is to see how the line looks and take a look at the new backs, but primarily he wants to get the passing game going, so we are right now throwing more and without the ade of a real running game, my hope is that once the season starts we will be running the ball down teams throats, which will give Patrick a much easier time of it with the passing game. From what I have seen so far from our line I am very encouraged that they will be able to that in the opener.

[illdefined]

i'm sorry but i must've missed it. what exactly was the official excuse for Brunell stinking up ALL of last season?

i remember he was good last pre-season too, but what's the current reason going around for his sucky regular season? was it an injury? if so, why wasn't Ramsey put in earlier?

i'm not being facetious either, i really wanna know

[Redskins_P]

Originally Posted by illdefined

i'm sorry but i must've missed it. what exactly was the official excuse for Brunell stinking up ALL of last season?

i remember he was good last pre-season too, but what's the current reason going around for his sucky regular season? was it an injury? if so, why wasn't Ramsey put in earlier?

i'm not being facetious either, i really wanna know

Bad elbow....strained hamstring.

[illdefined]

Originally Posted by Redskins_P

Bad elbow....strained hamstring.

why would you start so many games with a 34 yr old QB with a bad throwing elbow and limited mobility when you have a healthy young backup with experience right there? much more likely, i think Gibbs is just trying to be kind to Brunell, getting some heat off him for last year.

[BrudLee]

Originally Posted by illdefined

i'm sorry but i must've missed it. what exactly was the official excuse for Brunell stinking up ALL of last season?

i remember he was good last pre-season too, but what's the current reason going around for his sucky regular season? was it an injury? if so, why wasn't Ramsey put in earlier?

i'm not being facetious either, i really wanna know

Actually, he wasn't that great in the preseason (26/46, 1 TD, 1 INT) - he was less crappy than everyone else.

[firstdown]

I voted for Ramsey. I feel we must give him 7 or 8 games if he is not showning improvment and if we are not winning its time to say good by to. If he is pulled as the starter we must go with Campbell and get him started as our starting QB. Forget about Brunell and trying to reach the playoffs. It will be the time to start preparing for our future and just hope were not having this conversation a few years from now about Campbell. I would love to see Ramsey her for many more years but he has to make his stand early in the season.

[BrudLee]

I think the depth chart will be Ramsey, Brunell, and Campbell - but if Ramsey can't finish the season (due to inefficiency), Campbell will get the start. If the season is still viable and the playoffs can be reached (which would likely mean that Ramsey was injured), then Brunell will play.