Draft, FAs, etc

[mheisig]

Originally Posted by paulskinsfan

The Draft. I might be the only one that thinks this way, but here goes. I devote the entire draft to the offensive and defensive lines. Our o-line backups, i.e. Cory Raymer, are horrible. We really really need to upgrade our backups on the o-line and get some depth. We also need to upgrade the D-line as well. When Griffin was out, our defense really suffered. We need someone who can play in the middle of that line and stuff the run. Id be happy if we used all of our picks on lineman.

Free Agency: No. 2 receiver. I know alot of you will say Patten still has football in him, maybe he does. Maybe Patten would get open, and Brunell just couldn't get him the ball. Often when I watch the game again on TiVo, I will see the receivers being open way way before Brunnell gets them the ball, so maybe Patten was getting open and Brunnell just doesn't have the arm to get the ball there fast enough. Irregardless, FRAYGEELAY (aka Jacobs) is gone and we need to upgrade the WR corp (AGAIN). I think we have 2 glaring needs in free agency: Upgrade WRs, and sign a pass rushing DE.

Thoughts?

HELL YEAH! Could not have said it better myself (actually I could have, "irregardless" isn't a word)

I think you are 100% right on with the draft. I am a firm believer in Madden's old saying that "it all starts with the line." Fans seem SO inclined to go after the next WR with a shitty attitude or the next superstar player. Maybe it's watching too many Sportscenter highlights or playing too much fantasy football where the line doesn't matter, but all those highlights and all those amazing stats, catches, runs and players only happen be cause the line got it done first. On a VERY few occasions will a player do something incredible when the line breaks down, but that is the major exception, NOT the rule. Clinton Portis is nothing if he's got no hole to hit. Mark Brunell or even Peyton Manning are just big targets if they've got no protection. I say we spend almost every pick we have on the offensive line and maybe some on the defensive line. I'm a little more concerned about the offense than the defense so I lean more toward the O-line than the D-line, but it wouldn't hurt to have a pass-rush specialist.

Again I think you're right on with the Patten thing. I think we should ALL temper our enthusiasm over the #2 wideout problem. I would agree that we absolutely need at LEAST one other good WR, especially since we have no depth whatsoever at this position. However, as I said in a previous post, a star #2 WR is NOT the solution.

Santana Moss managed to become the #2 WR in the NFL this year even without the compliment of a true #2 threat. He had 80 less yards than Steve Smith. If people really think that the root of al our problems is the lack of a #2 threat to open up more for Moss, than they must also think that a team has to have a reciever with close to 2000 yards in order to be a real contender.

Let's definitely get some depth at WR and get some good posession guys, but let's not trade every pick, decent player and spend every last dime to reel in a T.O., Randy Moss or some other distaster waiting to happen.

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by mheisig

I am a firm believer in Madden's old saying that "it all starts with the line." Fans seem SO inclined to go after the next WR with a shitty attitude or the next superstar player. Maybe it's watching too many Sportscenter highlights or playing too much fantasy football where the line doesn't matter, but all those highlights and all those amazing stats, catches, runs and players only happen be cause the line got it done first. On a VERY few occasions will a player do something incredible when the line breaks down, but that is the major exception, NOT the rule. Clinton Portis is nothing if he's got no hole to hit. Mark Brunell or even Peyton Manning are just big targets if they've got no protection.

I agree, it all starts with the line. But by the same token, the best pass protection an O-line can offer won't matter if you're wide receivers can't get open. With James Thrash and Taylor Jacobs in the lineup while Randy Thomas and Chris Samuels were healthy, this was painfully obvious.

[Beemnseven]

Regarding the tight end position, Joe Gibbs has always preferred glorified linemen at tight end who block rather than catch, as opposed to Tony Gonzales or Heath Miller. Not saying they can't block, but Gibbs' offense prefers someone like Ron Middleton.

That can be addressed through undrafted free agency on the cheap.

[redrock-skins]

Any chance we could get Reggie Wayne or would that break our budget?

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by redrock-skins

Any chance we could get Reggie Wayne or would that break our budget?

Unfortunately, that would pummel our cap. We don't need another Santana Moss. I'll be happy with Patten's return and another wideout as capable as Patten (either via the draft, trade, or free agency).

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by redrock-skins

Any chance we could get Reggie Wayne or would that break our budget?

if there's one expensive guy worth getting this offseason it'd be him (or maybe mathis). I'd love that, but i think we're looking at the 2nd tier (no TO, no wayne) which will be plentiful and somewhat cheap. P warrick, P Price, K robinson (Very talented, fast, WANTS to come here specifically, alcoholic), B Lloyd (talented but inconsistant), D givens, R Caldwell (had good numbers before he got injured), K Mccardell (old), etc.

I'd take a flyer on K robinson and R Caldwell and also eye S Moss if he falls to us in the 3rd round. All would be very cheap and only 1 of the 4 (including patten) would have to actually step up. Denver did that with CBs and DL this season and spray and pray actually seems to work well with 2nd tier talent.

At DE, kampman seems like the price/performance guy and there's decent depth at DE/DT in the draft we'll be able to pick from in the 2nd. It'd be alright to get a guy that'd take a bit to break in since wynn will probably be back (even though i think he makes too much for his production, the coaches seem to really like him in the lockerroom).

OL i know much less about... 2 bucs starters are FAs and both would be great backups (stussie/mahan), but i don't know if either would agree to that (or how practical it is to pay that much to a backup).

[diehardskin2982]

Sign Strong Safety Adam Archuleta to go along with Sean Taylor in the backfield

Oline I'd rather have quality Vets who are used to the speed of the NFL. Dline I'd go through the draft

[Schneed10]

I'd add that a bulldozer at TE would help us too. Someone who can really lay the lumber in run blocking.

[paulskinsfan]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

I'd add that a bulldozer at TE would help us too. Someone who can really lay the lumber in run blocking.

LOL, when we had the #25 pick I really really wanted them to take Heath Miller TE from VA. I watched him yesterday in Pittsburgh, he's a certified bad ass. Can you imagine what defenses would face with both him and Cooley in the game? I mean, defenses would have no idea if we were gonna run or pass. Oh well, if "ifs" and "buts" were candy and nuts.....

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by paulskinsfan

LOL, when we had the #25 pick I really really wanted them to take Heath Miller TE from VA. I watched him yesterday in Pittsburgh, he's a certified bad ass. Can you imagine what defenses would face with both him and Cooley in the game? I mean, defenses would have no idea if we were gonna run or pass. Oh well, if "ifs" and "buts" were candy and nuts.....

Miller would have been a good addition for sure. Hopefully Campbell turns out to be worth the pick, it will take a while to find out. The Campbell selection was designed to be an investment in our long-term future. Hopefully he brings us stability once Brunell is gone.

[offiss]

Personally I really feel we missed the boat with last years draft, although I really like Rogers I feel we would have been better served as a team as a whole if we traded down and drafted more players. Or at least used the pick we used on Campbell to trade down at the time and pick up more players.

We have 3 QB's and a lot of holes to fill, and I can't say I have a whole lot of confidence that we will address any real needs with this draft.

Rabach is nothing special, we should have drafted Chris Spencer last year, I aslo feel Dockery is nothing more than a backup, Dockery is to slow, and Rabach is to weak.

I would also address our return game we need a bonified return man.

a punter, a kicker, we really have a lot of needs and so few picks, and we haven't shown any ability to find talent in the later rounds, I am not really exited about the upcoming draft as I usually am.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by offiss

Personally I really feel we missed the boat with last years draft, although I really like Rogers I feel we would have been better served as a team as a whole if we traded down and drafted more players. Or at least used the pick we used on Campbell to trade down at the time and pick up more players.

We have 3 QB's and a lot of holes to fill, and I can't say I have a whole lot of confidence that we will address any real needs with this draft.

Rabach is nothing special, we should have drafted Chris Spencer last year, I aslo feel Dockery is nothing more than a backup, Dockery is to slow, and Rabach is to weak.

I would also address our return game we need a bonified return man.

a punter, a kicker, we really have a lot of needs and so few picks, and we haven't shown any ability to find talent in the later rounds, I am not really exited about the upcoming draft as I usually am.

And if a frog had wings, he wouldn't bump his ass when he hops. Woulda coulda shoulda.

[That Guy]

wynn is expensive, daniels is getting older, i'd say a DE even if he comes in as a #3 with potential is a must, as is at least one but probably two WRs (one FA, one for depth in the draft). I'd still vote for tapp and S moss myself :P

after WR and DE i'd get 1 guy that can start at G/T and at least one backup and a young CB that can be our #3. a DT #2/#3 is also a must.