Collins & Saunders

skinsguy · 12-09-2007, 11:19 PM

I have no doubt that Saunders' offense works in the NFL. I just question why he may think (and I don't know this for a fact) that JC couldn't utilize more of the offense himself. Campbell is a smart QB, and very talented. No need to hold back on him.

GMScud · 12-09-2007, 11:31 PM

SO, what if Collins continues to play amazingly, we win out, make the playoffs, and then Jason is healthy to play the first playoff game? What then?

GTripp0012 · 12-09-2007, 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GMScud

SO, what if Collins continues to play amazingly, we win out, make the playoffs, and then Jason is healthy to play the first playoff game? What then?

It depends on how healthy.

If he's close to 100%, you go back to Jason. If he isn't, Collins gets the call.

GMScud · 12-09-2007, 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

It depends on how healthy.

If he's close to 100%, you go back to Jason. If he isn't, Collins gets the call.

I just made a post on this in the "If we win the next three games thread." I'd love to hear your opinion.

FRPLG · 12-10-2007, 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GMScud

SO, what if Collins continues to play amazingly, we win out, make the playoffs, and then Jason is healthy to play the first playoff game? What then?

Campbell is our QB is healthy. Any other decision is a major mistake in my judgement. He is the long term answer and enough of learning on the sidelines. Maybe Collins knows the offense very well but something tells me that if they'd run the offense the same way with Campbell by now he'd be pretty proficient at it.

railcon56 · 12-10-2007, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GMScud

SO, what if Collins continues to play amazingly, we win out, make the playoffs, and then Jason is healthy to play the first playoff game? What then?

I say go with Campbell..If he can play and has any mobility...he should start...

MTK · 12-10-2007, 07:21 AM

Vermeil seems to agree that holding back on JC has been the right call:

Lost in the debate over whether the offense is Gibbs's or Saunders's is the singular goal of developing Campbell into a consistent winner. And if that is a franchise's stated objective, there is no way Saunders's entire arsenal was ever going to be unveiled this season or last.

"It was too much for Campbell or any young quarterback," Vermeil said. "The volume is so great. Joe Gibbs and Al Saunders did the right thing -- restrict the package to fit his maturity. They aren't running the entire offense right now. Watch. At the start of next season, Jason will be much better than he is now because he'll get more reps in this offense."

Time in this offense is the only remedy, which Collins's has seven years' worth of learning and practicing.

MTK · 12-10-2007, 08:47 AM

I think it depends on how Collins plays. If he continues to play the way he did against the Bears and assuming we win out, I think you have to stick with Collins the remainder of the year even if JC is ready to come back.

12thMan · 12-10-2007, 09:40 AM

I agree. If we win out and Collins is at the helm, I think you have to stick with him. Also, it seems like the players are already confident in his abilities and leadership.

rickmmrr · 12-10-2007, 09:49 AM

If Collins lights it up you stick with Collins. JC is still thinking too much instead of it being second nature. Having to think about the play slows you down just enough to mess it up. In the Bears game notice how quick Collins made decisions. I'm sure JC will get that in time.

Hog1 · 12-10-2007, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickmmrr

If Collins lights it up you stick with Collins. JC is still thinking too much instead of it being second nature. Having to think about the play slows you down just enough to mess it up. In the Bears game notice how quick Collins made decisions. I'm sure JC will get that in time.

Totally!
JC IS OUR FUTURE..............but he definately pressing to hard, rather than letting it happen. As is evident, he is making horrific mistakes at the worst possible times.
JC has MUCH on his shoulders. Maybe to much right now. He may be very relieved to get out of that for the moment. He may also have an oppurtunity to learn by watching.
AND........a little bench time may help (without the ego issues as he was injured). It worked for Theisman. You never know

Gotta' go.............got a meeting with the Easter Bunny

70Chip · 12-10-2007, 12:29 PM

The Bears decided to blitz which plays right into Collins strengths. When a team blitzes there are opportunites for a QB who knows the scheme and where he can go with the football quickly. I think the Giants will play coverage, assume they can get pressure with their front four, and force Collins to make big throws in a stadium that usually has a 20 mph wind this time of year. It will be a much greater challenge. At some point you have to be able to run the ball against a team like the Giants and I'm not sure we can

BDBohnzie · 12-10-2007, 09:55 AM

It's certainly a wait and see type of deal. I honestly do not see Campbell being 100% once the last week of the season rolls around. If Collins gets hot and wins 3 games in a row and we somehow get the last playoff spot, I think you stick with the hot hand.

Holding back parts of the playbook is by far the best way to handle the situation. He's having a tough enough time executing what they are giving him, why further hinder the situation? I think next year you'll see a much more mature Campbell and Saunders will open the book some more. He'll have one full season plus under his belt, and will be able to apprehend a bit more. There is a reason Collins is able to execute like he can...he and Saunders have been together since '01.

mheisig · 12-10-2007, 10:11 AM

As much as I'd love to see Collin's light it up for the rest of the season and into the playoffs, I'll go on record as saying I'd be pretty shocked if it turns out that way.

Common sense says there's a reason he's 37 years old and been a backup his entire NFL career, it would be pretty unusual for him to suddenly turn into Tom Brady.

MTK · 12-10-2007, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mheisig

As much as I'd love to see Collin's light it up for the rest of the season and into the playoffs, I'll go on record as saying I'd be pretty shocked if it turns out that way.

Common sense says there's a reason he's 37 years old and been a backup his entire NFL career, it would be pretty unusual for him to suddenly turn into Tom Brady.

But it's also unusual for a backup to come into a game and play the way he did the other night.

I honestly don't know what to think right now, obviously I'm hoping that last week was not a fluke.

I'm on the fence, but I'm leaning more towards him playing well.

View Poll Results: Your confidence level in Todd Collins?
Very confident... the Bears game was not a fluke	40	26.85%
On the fence, he could go either way	94	63.09%
Not confident at all... the Bears game was a fluke	15	10.07%
Voters: 149. You may not vote on this poll

12-09-2007, 11:19 PM	#1
skinsguy Pro Bowl Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Greensboro, North Carolina Posts: 6,766	Re: Collins & Saunders I have no doubt that Saunders' offense works in the NFL. I just question why he may think (and I don't know this for a fact) that JC couldn't utilize more of the offense himself. Campbell is a smart QB, and very talented. No need to hold back on him. __________________ "Fire Up That Diesel!"

12-09-2007, 11:31 PM	#2
GMScud Swearinger Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Washington, DC Posts: 12,626	Re: Collins & Saunders SO, what if Collins continues to play amazingly, we win out, make the playoffs, and then Jason is healthy to play the first playoff game? What then? __________________ Tardy

12-10-2007, 07:21 AM	#7
MTK \m/ Join Date: Feb 2004 Age: 52 Posts: 99,832	Re: Collins & Saunders Vermeil seems to agree that holding back on JC has been the right call: Lost in the debate over whether the offense is Gibbs's or Saunders's is the singular goal of developing Campbell into a consistent winner. And if that is a franchise's stated objective, there is no way Saunders's entire arsenal was ever going to be unveiled this season or last. "It was too much for Campbell or any young quarterback," Vermeil said. "The volume is so great. Joe Gibbs and Al Saunders did the right thing -- restrict the package to fit his maturity. They aren't running the entire offense right now. Watch. At the start of next season, Jason will be much better than he is now because he'll get more reps in this offense." Time in this offense is the only remedy, which Collins's has seven years' worth of learning and practicing. __________________ Support The Warpath! \| Warpath Shop

12-10-2007, 08:47 AM	#8
MTK \m/ Join Date: Feb 2004 Age: 52 Posts: 99,832	Re: Collins & Saunders I think it depends on how Collins plays. If he continues to play the way he did against the Bears and assuming we win out, I think you have to stick with Collins the remainder of the year even if JC is ready to come back. __________________ Support The Warpath! \| Warpath Shop

12-10-2007, 09:40 AM	#9
12thMan MVP Join Date: May 2005 Location: washington, D.C. Posts: 11,460	Re: Collins & Saunders I agree. If we win out and Collins is at the helm, I think you have to stick with him. Also, it seems like the players are already confident in his abilities and leadership.

12-10-2007, 09:49 AM	#10
rickmmrr Special Teams Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 395	Re: Collins & Saunders If Collins lights it up you stick with Collins. JC is still thinking too much instead of it being second nature. Having to think about the play slows you down just enough to mess it up. In the Bears game notice how quick Collins made decisions. I'm sure JC will get that in time.

12-10-2007, 12:29 PM	#12
70Chip Playmaker Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Manassas Age: 54 Posts: 3,048	Re: Collins & Saunders The Bears decided to blitz which plays right into Collins strengths. When a team blitzes there are opportunites for a QB who knows the scheme and where he can go with the football quickly. I think the Giants will play coverage, assume they can get pressure with their front four, and force Collins to make big throws in a stadium that usually has a 20 mph wind this time of year. It will be a much greater challenge. At some point you have to be able to run the ball against a team like the Giants and I'm not sure we can __________________ This Monkey's Gone to Heaven

12-10-2007, 09:55 AM	#13
BDBohnzie Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Frederick, MD Age: 46 Posts: 4,628	Re: Collins & Saunders It's certainly a wait and see type of deal. I honestly do not see Campbell being 100% once the last week of the season rolls around. If Collins gets hot and wins 3 games in a row and we somehow get the last playoff spot, I think you stick with the hot hand. Holding back parts of the playbook is by far the best way to handle the situation. He's having a tough enough time executing what they are giving him, why further hinder the situation? I think next year you'll see a much more mature Campbell and Saunders will open the book some more. He'll have one full season plus under his belt, and will be able to apprehend a bit more. There is a reason Collins is able to execute like he can...he and Saunders have been together since '01. __________________ Bad Things man, I mean bad things... “WE TOOK HIM IN THE SIXTH ROUND SO WE'RE NOT SMART EITHER.” - Shanny on what the Skins saw in Alfred Morris

12-10-2007, 10:11 AM	#14
mheisig The Starter Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: The Southeast Age: 41 Posts: 2,119	Re: Collins & Saunders As much as I'd love to see Collin's light it up for the rest of the season and into the playoffs, I'll go on record as saying I'd be pretty shocked if it turns out that way. Common sense says there's a reason he's 37 years old and been a backup his entire NFL career, it would be pretty unusual for him to suddenly turn into Tom Brady. __________________ Your post count, reputation score, popularity ranking, VIP tag or funny signature has no bearing on how I value you as an individual.

Collins & Saunders

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