Michael Vick Wants to Get a Dog (Seriously)

[dmek25]

how can the guy be banned for life? that sounds retarded

[warpaint]

Here is a thought maybe we can lure him away from the Eagles next year if we promise him will we keep a box of puppies in the locker room.

[53Fan]

Originally Posted by warpaint

Here is a thought maybe we can lure him away from the Eagles next year if we promise him will we keep a box of puppies in the locker room.

[Hog1]

Would it not be ironic if his dog turned on him and killed him....by say.....drowning?

[over the mountain]

should a pedophile who did his time be allowed to become an elementary school teacher?

you all are focusing on the fact that he is banned from owning a pet, putting your focus on the contrast btw the priority of a dog's life vs a human's life in our society.

im not saying any persons opinion on this is wrong but this punishment is not about dogs or animals. its about the criminal and his acts, not the victim. its about a person who plead guilty to facts which included the direct strangulation of a dog being held into a tub of water by Mike Vicks hands until it died. That he would take labs and poodles and throw them in a cage with a vicious pit so that pit can get his blood thurst on.

The reason Mike Vick can never have a pet for the rest of his life is b/c he did something repeatedly and knowingly that was so inhumane, cold hearted and insane that a life ban was appropriate, much like a pedophile at a school or a felon owning a handgun.

the punishment is about the criminal, not the victim.

with that said, i think as long as its not a pit or rot, i think it sounds like a great idea, to bad it aint happenin.

rbajnree - nice use of (seriously)

[BaltimoreSkins]

Originally Posted by over the mountain

should a pedophile who did his time be allowed to become an elementary school teacher?

you all are focusing on the fact that he is banned from owning a pet, putting your focus on the contrast btw the priority of a dog's life vs a human's life in our society.

im not saying any persons opinion on this is wrong but this punishment is not about dogs or animals. its about the criminal and his acts, not the victim. its about a person who plead guilty to facts which included the direct strangulation of a dog being held into a tub of water by Mike Vicks hands until it died. That he would take labs and poodles and throw them in a cage with a vicious pit so that pit can get his blood thurst on.

The reason Mike Vick can never have a pet for the rest of his life is b/c he did something repeatedly and knowingly that was so inhumane, cold hearted and insane that a life ban was appropriate, much like a pedophile at a school or a felon owning a handgun.

the punishment is about the criminal, not the victim.

with that said, i think as long as its not a pit or rot, i think it sounds like a great idea, to bad it aint happenin.

rbajnree - nice use of (seriously)

Great post. Although I disagree with the last statement. I don't think he should be allowed to have a dog period. Children are shown to be pliable and change behaviors. Adults are much more set in their ways. IHe would be back to killing dogs in a matter of time imo.

[skinsnut]

I don't think he should be a caregiver of any type....that includes people too.
This guy has a very violent background...the fact that they even let him play again is remarkable to me. The worst case scenario in coming back to the NFL was not that he would fail....it's that he would perform well and become a hero figure to the kids.
The NFL has too much of that already....think of a famous Raven and an ex buffalo bill RB off the top of my head.

Is the NFL so desperate for ratings that they needed to allow this guy on the field again?
What about all the wife beaters, etc?
What is the NFL saying....that it is ok to be violent, as long as you pay your dues you can come back?.....what kind of image is that.
Like it or not...NFL players become superstars and become role models to our kids who idolize them....if they learn their background, it normalizes the behavior.

I know most of you may not agree with me....(I'd love Vick's talent too)...but after much thought...I think the NFL should be much stricter with violent offenders than any other sport due to the violent nature of the game.
No ex convicts should ever be able to play the game again.....period.

[DM72]

Originally Posted by skinsnut

No ex convicts should ever be able to play the game again.....period.

Be careful. There's guys that have done worse than what Vick did that still played.

[TheSmurfs22]

Originally Posted by skinsnut

I don't think he should be a caregiver of any type....that includes people too.
This guy has a very violent background...the fact that they even let him play again is remarkable to me. The worst case scenario in coming back to the NFL was not that he would fail....it's that he would perform well and become a hero figure to the kids.
The NFL has too much of that already....think of a famous Raven and an ex buffalo bill RB off the top of my head.

Is the NFL so desperate for ratings that they needed to allow this guy on the field again?
What about all the wife beaters, etc?
What is the NFL saying....that it is ok to be violent, as long as you pay your dues you can come back?.....what kind of image is that.
Like it or not...NFL players become superstars and become role models to our kids who idolize them....if they learn their background, it normalizes the behavior.

I know most of you may not agree with me....(I'd love Vick's talent too)...but after much thought...I think the NFL should be much stricter with violent offenders than any other sport due to the violent nature of the game.
No ex convicts should ever be able to play the game again.....period.

~~~~~~
I agree with you Skinsnut. Yeah he did his time, but what is this message we are sending to kids? As a teacher I hear kids talk about Vick and they see nothing wrong with what he did. There was a great article in the Post a couple of weeks ago about Vick and how the media and NFL have pretty much glossed over this. It also brought up an interesting point that if it Vick been a lineman or less high profile position that Vick probably would have been banned for good.

[SolidSnake84]

Originally Posted by skinsnut

I don't think he should be a caregiver of any type....that includes people too.
This guy has a very violent background...the fact that they even let him play again is remarkable to me. The worst case scenario in coming back to the NFL was not that he would fail....it's that he would perform well and become a hero figure to the kids.
The NFL has too much of that already....think of a famous Raven and an ex buffalo bill RB off the top of my head.

Is the NFL so desperate for ratings that they needed to allow this guy on the field again?
What about all the wife beaters, etc?
What is the NFL saying....that it is ok to be violent, as long as you pay your dues you can come back?.....what kind of image is that.
Like it or not...NFL players become superstars and become role models to our kids who idolize them....if they learn their background, it normalizes the behavior.

I know most of you may not agree with me....(I'd love Vick's talent too)...but after much thought...I think the NFL should be much stricter with violent offenders than any other sport due to the violent nature of the game.
No ex convicts should ever be able to play the game again.....period.

I dont think it is so much the stance of the NFL as much as it is the belief in the United States of America, and maybe the justice system. The fact is this country is one where you can get a second chance. That's the beauty of america. I'm patriotic. What I'm saying is that you can break the law, be punished, and if you have been truly rehabilitated, then you will leave prison and embrace your second chance at freedom and living a lawful life. Many people squander their second chance, but I love the USA because we are given a second chance.

In some countries, there is no second chance. And it is obvious that Vick has been truly rehabilitated, he is sorry for what he's done, paid his punishment, and now wants to live his life and continue doing what he loves (NFL Football).

[Coff]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

I dont think it is so much the stance of the NFL as much as it is the belief in the United States of America, and maybe the justice system. The fact is this country is one where you can get a second chance. That's the beauty of america. I'm patriotic. What I'm saying is that you can break the law, be punished, and if you have been truly rehabilitated, then you will leave prison and embrace your second chance at freedom and living a lawful life. Many people squander their second chance, but I love the USA because we are given a second chance.

I don't think it's really that uncommon in the rest of the world for people to go to prison for a certain period of time and then be released. In other words, I'm no so sure that's an American thing. Some might point out that it's the opposite since we incarcerate a higher percentage of our citizens than any country on earth, but that's not really pertinent in a discussion about second chances.

Regardless, in terms of rehabilitation, I think the problem most people have with it is that it's BS. It's not so much that people think Vick will do it again; but not doing it again doesn't constitute "rehabilitation." The fact is that most people on this planet would be literally incapable of enacting the cruelty upon animals that Vick enacted. The man exists on a different moral plane than the rest of us. Such morality can't be dictated through imprisoment. The idea of rehabilitation, in other words, is kind of a farce.

That being said, he has served his punishment and should be legally entitled to the same things as everyone else.

[BaltimoreSkins]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

I dont think it is so much the stance of the NFL as much as it is the belief in the United States of America, and maybe the justice system. The fact is this country is one where you can get a second chance. That's the beauty of america. I'm patriotic. What I'm saying is that you can break the law, be punished, and if you have been truly rehabilitated, then you will leave prison and embrace your second chance at freedom and living a lawful life. Many people squander their second chance, but I love the USA because we are given a second chance.

In some countries, there is no second chance. And it is obvious that Vick has been truly rehabilitated, he is sorry for what he's done, paid his punishment, and now wants to live his life and continue doing what he loves (NFL Football).

I disagree with this statement. Vick is not rehabilitated. Prison is continually filled with repeat offenders who were once "rehabilitated" Why are they back? People don't want to hire ex cons. Ex cons are also barred from holding certain jobs period. Why was Vick able to make more of his second chance? He has genetically superior talents that other ex cons lack. He is intelligent enough to realize he has been given a second chance and will try not to screw it up. But rehabilitated? no way. You wouldn't allow a hand gun offender to go and purchase a gun, or a person who has been convicted of child abuse wouldn't be allowed to adopt a child. Very similar situation.

[SirClintonPortis]

Originally Posted by BaltimoreSkins

I disagree with this statement. Vick is not rehabilitated. Prison is continually filled with repeat offenders who were once "rehabilitated" Why are they back? People don't want to hire ex cons. Ex cons are also barred from holding certain jobs period. Why was Vick able to make more of his second chance? He has genetically superior talents that other ex cons lack. He is intelligent enough to realize he has been given a second chance and will try not to screw it up. But rehabilitated? no way. You wouldn't allow a hand gun offender to go and purchase a gun, or a person who has been convicted of child abuse wouldn't be allowed to adopt a child. Very similar situation.

So it's assured he's gonna start up another one of those dogfighting rings and once he pays off his creditors, there's going to be Bad Newz Kennelz 2.0. Gotcha. Because that's what he has to "rehab" out of his system.

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by SirClintonPortis

So it's assured he's gonna start up another one of those dogfighting rings and once he pays off his creditors, there's going to be Bad Newz Kennelz 2.0. Gotcha. Because that's what he has to "rehab" out of his system.

Generally, real rehabilitation requires more than merely "doing your time". It means exhibiting a change of heart over a long period of time such that people can reasonably and credibly trust that you will not relapse into the problem behavior. IMO, other than for long term prisoners, rehabilitation doesn't really even begin until a person reenters society. Only then can the individual begin to compile the evidence that they have had a true change of heart.

To me, that's the key for Vick. Let's see how he does after the fame and glory go away. Is he still concerned about doing the right thing? Does he maintain his good works? Only after an extended period of time can we tell if Vick has truly rehabilitated himself and agreed to conform to societal norms.

BTW - As others have stated, excellent post skinsnut. I particularly agree with point No. 3, and, also, with the NFL's hypocrisy when it comes to violent behavior.

[DynamiteRave]

I don't think there's anything wrong with him owning a dog at this point in his life. Comparing a man who ran a dogfighting ring to a pedophile is... Wow. Just a really really not great example in my opinion. A pedophile tends to be someone who has no control over his actions and cannot be rehabilitated. (At least I don't think so. Once a child molester, always a child molester). They often don't know what they're doing is wrong, although some do... and pedophiles have a high recidivism rate, meaning more than likely, they're going to end up reoffending at some point in their life.

In this case, Vick KNEW what he was doing was wrong, he has control over his actions, he served his time, did his community service and at this point in his career after being given a second chance and sitting at a potential Super Bowl appearance... He'd be a straight imbecile to screw himself up again. If anything I can understand Vick being banned from owning dogs historically bred to protect/fight (Pits or bully breeds, Rottweilers, Dobermans, etc) but I mean if the dude wanted... I dunno a golden retriever.. For example... Then he may be the first man to set up a golden retriever dogfighting ring, in the history of dog fighting.