Skins/Giants post game thread

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

There was absolutely NOTHING wrong with the play calling today minus one series. You just have this illogical hate towards the Shanahan's and it shows.

Dont even want to go here but if you base your feelings on wins / losses than its actually the love thats illogical.


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[Skinzman]

Originally Posted by punch it in

Dont even want to go here but if you base your feelings on wins / losses than its actually the love thats illogical.


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He screwed up on the trying to "win now" in year 1. Even so, why would anyone expect the roster we had to be completely turned over and winning SB's in 3 years. When he was hired, I told myself that in year 3 is where we should start to see a turn around. Year 4 is when we are a playoff team. And so far, year 3, and that turnaround is looking like its happening. Get a secondary, and we are already a playoff team, so we are on course with what I expected.

I think the problem is that when you expect to take a horrible team with massive cap problems and expect 3 SB victories in the first 4 years. You are setting up yourself for disappointment.

I think everyone assumes that building a team in Madden franchise mode is the same as building a team in the NFL, so once they win a SB in Madden, they think they could pull off 3 SB's in 4 years in the NFL as a GM. And here in lies the biggest problem IMO.

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by jdc65

The Skins don't win games like this one today, they haven't in years, they find a way to lose these games. The Giants find ways to win these games, as most good teams do. They likely would have lost the Viking game if not for Griffin's spectacular run. Count the Tampa game as mostly a Griffin win as well.

It's time for brutal honesty, Shanahan's coaching record over the last 5 years is 29-41. Here he is 14-25. No way he is coaching any NFL team if not for the early Bronco years with John Elway. Any equity he had built up is gone now. I say that as a fan ecstatic when he was hired and even happier to have Kyle onboard as I thought he would follow as HC.

The defense and special teams are worse than when he arrived, and the entire offense is predicated on misdirection with Griffin's superior ability. It is unsustainable. For every good move they've made, I can point to 2 bad ones, probably 3.

RG could be a superstar, they have a handful of solid pieces to work around, and there is legitimate hope for the future. But in my opinion, Shanahan isn't going to take this team to the next step, and there is no logical reason for any fan to think so other than blind faith and desperate hope.

I'm predicting Haslett won't finish the season, and 5-6 wins means complete change which I am now all for. 7 or more wins will and should keep Mike here, I agree.

Rite on man. Just hope RG-3 and morris and the few others can carry this team a long way - cus i personally dont care why we win - just that we win.


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[punch it in]

I

Originally Posted by Mattyk

Seemed more like a fluke day than anything. Fumbles weren't a problem coming into today. Hopefully they shake it off and get on track.

Id have to agree with this. Very un - characteristic. We matched our season total today. Ugggh. They were all friggin unforced to. This wasnt osi comin around rex's blind side and swatting the ball away. These were just lack of focus.
Edit: most of them coming late in the game and its almost like the players were thinking the sane thing we were. Holy shit were really good and were gonna make a huge statement and the pressure got to em. I would think they will learn from that. So much of the game is mentally being able to accept that you belong on the damn field with whoever you are playing. That it is ok to win even if that goes against what people have come to expect when they are playing us.


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[punch it in]

Originally Posted by Skinzman

He screwed up on the trying to "win now" in year 1. Even so, why would anyone expect the roster we had to be completely turned over and winning SB's in 3 years. When he was hired, I told myself that in year 3 is where we should start to see a turn around. Year 4 is when we are a playoff team. And so far, year 3, and that turnaround is looking like its happening. Get a secondary, and we are already a playoff team, so we are on course with what I expected.

I think the problem is that when you expect to take a horrible team with massive cap problems and expect 3 SB victories in the first 4 years. You are setting up yourself for disappointment.

I think everyone assumes that building a team in Madden franchise mode is the same as building a team in the NFL, so once they win a SB in Madden, they think they could pull off 3 SB's in 4 years in the NFL as a GM. And here in lies the biggest problem IMO.

Lol. I dont play Madden but im pretty sure that video games have nothing to do with any problems with the Redskins.


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[Skinzman]

Originally Posted by punch it in

Lol. I dont play Madden but im pretty sure that video games have nothing to do with any problems with the Redskins.


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The game doesnt have anything to do with any problems of the Skins. It has to do with fans thinking they can take a perennial doormat and have them winning SB's in a year or two so why cant an NFL GM.

[NC_Skins]

Giants 27, Redskins 23: Ten Observations | WashingtonExaminer.com


Good read.

Let’s go right to the 77-yard touchdown pass. The knee-jerk reaction, clearly, is to blame defensive coordinator Jim Haslett. If you want to knock his schemes and the lack of pressure, go right ahead. If you want to question adjustments, go ahead. But it’s awfully difficult to blame him for the coverage mishap on this play. In fact, it’s misguided. A coordinator puts defenders in position and then it’s up to a player to do the rest. He assigned two players to stop the most dangerous target on the other team. Not a bad idea. In this case, corner Josh Wilson and safety Madieu Williams failed to execute a double team. Actually, Williams deserves more of the blame. It’s clear based on Wilson’s alignment at the snap he’s expecting – and needs – safety help over the top. Wilson is shaded inside and never looks at the quarterback. Williams, though, perhaps because of a receiver to the outside, was flat-footed. Here’s the thing: based on how Wilson was aligned, it’s easy to deduce there should have been no hesitation.


On this play, it’s an easy read for the receiver. With Wilson inside and Williams shaded to the outside, Victor Cruz runs a straight go-route. As Wilson said, Cruz hadn’t done much of anything before this catch – six catches for 54 yards. It wasn’t just Wilson covering him; Wilson would shadow him for a series but other times Wilson would show up and then drop into deep middle in a cover-3 look. But back to Haslett. Obviously the defense hasn’t produced enough under Haslett. They allow too many big plays. However, this one falls on the players, Williams in particular. If you don’t like Williams starting, that’s another matter. The Redskins did not have the best plan at safety, hoping Tanard Jackson – who had multiple drug suspensions before he signed – would be their starter. But Williams is the guy; the alternatives are few. Williams is a steady guy, but lacks speed. That’s been evident in other games and it impacts the coverage. I just don’t think the corners trust the safeties all that much right now to be where they need to be and at the right time.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

Giants 27, Redskins 23: Ten Observations | WashingtonExaminer.com


Good read.

Keim hits the nail on the head. It was a clearly a blown coverage. That's on the players, not Haslett.

[imaskin4life]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

Keim hits the nail on the head. It was a clearly a blown coverage. That's on the players, not Haslett.

I agree its on the players execution more so than haslett but im not sure I like my safety in man coverage with ANY of their receivers (especially cruz) other than the TE or HB/FB - even if its a double team situation. I want my safety waaaay back playing the safety position not letting any one behind him. But thats just me.

[CultBrennan59]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

Keim hits the nail on the head. It was a clearly a blown coverage. That's on the players, not Haslett.

Yep thats why I was blaming our sh!tty secondary and not our DC for this one. Now if he had called cover 0...

[jdc65]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

Keim hits the nail on the head. It was a clearly a blown coverage. That's on the players, not Haslett.

The next logical question to follow that up is why are said players, who have consistantly blown coverages, in the game at a critical juncture in those assignments? Why also was there no bump on the line in tight man coverage? Why give the speedster a free start when he is the fastest guy on the field and the primary threat?

Especially when everyone knew the secondary was a glaring weakness from day #1. Really year #1. Two 7th round draft picks made the final roster in the backfield that was supposedly so deep. Why was Josh Morgan signed at such a high price after they already signed Garcon, and obvious critical weaknesses still remained?

Circle the wagon time. Worst loss of the increasingly inadequate Shanahan tenure and possibly untenably divisive. It will be very interesting to see how they respond next week in what is now an absolute must win game. Football is a production game. Moral victories mean squat.

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by Skinzman

The game doesnt have anything to do with any problems of the Skins. It has to do with fans thinking they can take a perennial doormat and have them winning SB's in a year or two so why cant an NFL GM.

There is a big difference between wanting to win more than five games and be somewhat relevant and wanting to win superbowls. I dont think i have ever seen or heard one post or person calling for heads because we arent winning superbowls. Alot of teams do go from doormats to relevant in less than five years. I think alot of people wonder about Shanny because of his last several yeara in Denver. Which i dont believe you can overlook. I mean the "apologists" always want to talk about the two superbowls. Than there is this empty space in their opinion of Shanny. Like he won two superbowls and than packed his bags and came to rescue the horrid redskins that were set back years due to Vinnie. Nobody -even the "haters" will deny that Shanny inherited a mess. However there were several years of Mike Shanahans coaching career in Denver that were -well - not good. He did not win two superbowls, hop on a plane, land in Washington, and start digging us out of a hole. Thats a nice fairytale way to look at it but it is not reality.


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[Skinzman]

Originally Posted by punch it in

There is a big difference between wanting to win more than five games and be somewhat relevant and wanting to win superbowls. I dont think i have ever seen or heard one post or person calling for heads because we arent winning superbowls. Alot of teams do go from doormats to relevant in less than five years. I think alot of people wonder about Shanny because of his last several yeara in Denver. Which i dont believe you can overlook. I mean the "apologists" always want to talk about the two superbowls. Than there is this empty space in their opinion of Shanny. Like he won two superbowls and than packed his bags and came to rescue the horrid redskins that were set back years due to Vinnie. Nobody -even the "haters" will deny that Shanny inherited a mess. However there were several years of Mike Shanahans coaching career in Denver that were -well - not good. He did not win two superbowls, hop on a plane, land in Washington, and start digging us out of a hole. Thats a nice fairytale way to look at it but it is not reality.


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He had 2 losing seasons in 14 years there. One of those followed Elways retirement, which was his worst season there at 6-10. Are we going to say Belichick sucks because he didnt succeed in Cleveland? As you say, it must be accounted for.

Ive already said why im being patient, because I said from the day he was hired that it will take 3 years before the Skins show much, and 4 years before they are playoff contenders. That timetable is still there. I dont care what the record was the first two years because I never expected to win with what we had.

Everyone says that we had a terrible team. Admits it was always going to take time. Yet are complaining that we didnt make the playoffs twice in his first two years. That is irrational to me. This team is playing pretty good and is a secondary away from competing with the top teams for the playoffs. To think that we are still a 10 year rebuild away is ridiculous.

No one said that he he won two super bowls and then headed here. That is you coming up with that on your own.

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

Keim hits the nail on the head. It was a clearly a blown coverage. That's on the players, not Haslett.

Well he also says he has poor schemes, adjustments, and pressure. Whats lumping one more play into that bucket full of crap gonna hurt? Lol.


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[Ruhskins]

A quick game note, what's up with Hank playing soft? He had some good catches, but he could have easily caught that deep ball from RG3 if he makes a dive for the ball. Also in another catch he could've easily gotten a 1st if he had been a bit tougher, use his size advantage and dive for the first. I'd like to see him play a bit tougher.