Iran Supplying Weapons to Iraq?

[dmek25]

i am for what is best for the American people. and i do not want our government lying to me about their hidden agendas. to me, how we got to Iraq is sometimes the bigger story then what we are going to do now. bush should have taken care of bin laden, first and foremost. then he could have ventured into Iraq looking like a king. now he looks like a discombobulated fool

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Do you think backing out of Iraq would really un-embolden them??

No matter whether we stay or go, they're going to try to kill us. It's a war. Kill them, or kill us. It takes two sides to end a war. Just because we leave Iraq doesn't mean they'll stop the war.

I don't think there is an easy answer to that question. Just like pointing missles at Iran isn't an easy solution either.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by Buster

Are you kidding? Iraqis WEREN'T losing their families under Saddam? Wow. He killed about half a million of his OWN people under his rule. We've found mass graves with 3,000 or more people thrown into one hole, much like Nazi Germany's burial and murder methods. He used chemical weapons on his own people. He had rape rooms and torture chambers that he would pick random people to give a horrible death to for doing nothing more than walking by one of his palaces at the wrong time or for saying something he didn't like. His sons would rape random women and send a video of it to the hushand/father/etc. He'd kill fathers while their families were forced to watch. We've found videos that compiled the way he murdered his citizens, by cutting off limbs, to burning them, to throwing them off of buildings with weight attached to them. He was AS BAD as Hitler, Stalin or Mussolini...he was just stopped before his death toll reached the millions. He even sent oil to Jacques Chirac and the UN in exchange for money for food to supply his people with. Good man, right? No, he used their food money to stock up warehouse upon warehouse with weapons. We've secured and destroyed most of these, but when we were on the way in to attack him, he removed guards and left these warehouses wide open, which is how these "insurgents" got most of their weapons and ammo to use on our troops. (from Gen. Tommy Franks' book)

If you listen to our troops and NON-BIASED sources, the far majority of Iraqi people are happy that our troops removed Saddam. They're thankful and run to the streets to thank them. Of the 19 provinces in Iraq, 16 are operating with no problems...the violence we hear about every day is in just 3 areas, one being Baghdad. We've set up infracstructures they've never had before like running water and electricity throughout the country. For the first time ever, Iraqi girls and women can attend school. We've build hospitals.

There is a giant difference between the USA and a lot of other nations who get involved in wars. We go to war for 2 main reasons:
1. In retaliation or self-defense. (ex: Pearl Harbor, 09/11/01)
2. To free those living under dictators or corrupt governments.

We never attack anyone without them doing something to deserve or and without it being neccessary. Sometimes I think we're TOO diplomatic and waste precious time. An example of that would be with Osama bin Laden. He attacked us throughout the 90s on a near-annual basis. We should've sent him to see his 72 virgins after the first attack in 1993.

Removing my American status and looking at it, I still could not come to understand people who kill their own people or kill their neighbors just because they don't attend the same mosque as me or don't have the same skin color. I could not take the side of a country who attacks other nations without being attacked first, no matter what economic or social conditions are present in my country.

You can't negotiate with people who want you dead and actually have a verse in their Quran that says you can lie to any non-Muslim in order to trick them into trusting you so that you can kill them.

Their news media (and gaining control of OUR media) will try to get you to be sympathetic towards them, but while you're standing back feeling sorry for you, they'll sneak up behind you and blow you up. It's exactly what they want, our general public to feel sorry for them and for our media to affect our politics...to weaken our government's ability to defeat them.

You know its funny how we never hear anything postive that goes on over there and it must be for a reason (left wing media and make Bush look bad at any cost). I have talked to several people that have been over there and I also talk to my daughters boy friend who enlisted a year ago to go and fight (not sure if I would have done this). He calls from Iraq and its kind of weird talking to someone as they are there. He says alot of positive stuff happens day in and day out all over the place and most of the troops are ticked at the media for only reporting the bad. He also says that most think that all the negative press only encorages the insurgants that what their doing is working and if they keep it up the US people will grow tired and we will leave.

[Hog1]

Originally Posted by firstdown

You know its funny how we never hear anything postive that goes on over there and it must be for a reason (left wing media and make Bush look bad at any cost). I have talked to several people that have been over there and I also talk to my daughters boy friend who enlisted a year ago to go and fight (not sure if I would have done this). He calls from Iraq and its kind of weird talking to someone as they are there. He says alot of positive stuff happens day in and day out all over the place and most of the troops are ticked at the media for only reporting the bad. He also says that most think that all the negative press only encorages the insurgants that what their doing is working and if they keep it up the US people will grow tired and we will leave.

It's amazing the power our media has. Once you get behind the scenes a little, the picture changes.

[dmek25]

does anyone really believe anything this administration says?

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by dmek25

does anyone really believe anything this administration says?

I guess you going back to WMD's?

[dmek25]

the link between Al quada and Saddam Hussein? the list goes on and on

[724Skinsfan]

Originally Posted by dmek25

does anyone really believe anything this administration says?

I may not believe word for word what any administration says but I generally feel that the overall message is basically truthful. When you see that a particular person is a threat or even has a potential to threaten you, you will be inclined to generate whatever support you can to prevent that person from harming you. If it means stretching and even regrettably fabricating data to increase the support, I guess I'm all for it. I have no idea what motivations, if any, Hussein had that were going to intentionally harm the US. I trust our governnment regardless if it's Clinton or Bush or whoever to deal with it as they deem necessary. If they play by the rules and win, YAY. If they have to distort or twist the rosy colored lenses abit, oh well. The job got done or is getting done and that's all I'm concerned with.

As far as the media only representing one side of the situation over there, well DUH! No one reads the papers or watches CNN for "feel good stories". If they do, it's just for a momentary change of pace.

[Hog1]

Nobody never's, and nobody alway's.
Bush is getting bad deal with the media. He's nobody's hero, but regardless of what he does, he's done. He cannot win with the media. If the US troops had found WMD, he would be a hero, and the war in Iraq would be just. If the TRUTH were actually known, I am confident that Sadaam took care of business with the months advance warning we gave him, and stashed his stuff. Unfortunately for truth, justice, and he American way, the media control opinion, but it won't ever be played out like that. The media knows little about truth, just drama.
As you were saying in an earlier post Dmec, you don't approve of hidden agenda's. Our Govt is all about hidden agenda's. IMO that does not make them evil. The American public has become a joke. We care more about American Idol, than the fate of our world. Don't have time to save my world...........gotta' see who's the father of Anna Nicole's kid.

Yea, Yea, Yea, I woke up on the wrong side of the rock

[GhettoDogAllStars]

Originally Posted by Buster

We go to war for 2 main reasons:
1. In retaliation or self-defense. (ex: Pearl Harbor, 09/11/01)
2. To free those living under dictators or corrupt governments.

We go to war for 1 reason: to ensure our domination over the rest of the world. To ensure that we remain the ONLY superpower. We don't go to war for anyone but ourselves -- and that is the way it should be, barring genocide.

Originally Posted by Buster

I could not take the side of a country who attacks other nations without being attacked first, no matter what economic or social conditions are present in my country.

America attacked Iraq without being attacked first. I think you probably meant to word that differently. I think I understand what you mean.

[GhettoDogAllStars]

The big issue that isn't being discussed is Israel. That is the primary reason why terrorists hate us. Not because of our way of life -- because we support Israel, and Israel dominates the region.

[Hog1]

I would definately be in some agreement with you. Are saying that is a good thing, or a bad thing?

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by dmek25

the link between Al quada and Saddam Hussein? the list goes on and on

The link was made between the two its how much they worked together if they did at all is what is not known. WMD's was thought by most major nations, UN, Congress, Bill Clinton, so I guess they all lied to us. I like how the Democrates in congress said the same thing and had access to the same information but now blame it all on the Bush administration.

[dmek25]

hog1 good post. i am the type of person that would rather hear nothing, then hear a bunch of lies. most of the American public cant handle the truth( sound familiar?) but instead of lying, how about just keeping quiet, not lying and trying to trick people?

[dmek25]

Originally Posted by firstdown

The link was made between the two its how much they worked together if they did at all is what is not known. WMD's was thought by most major nations, UN, Congress, Bill Clinton, so I guess they all lied to us. I like how the Democrates in congress said the same thing and had access to the same information but now blame it all on the Bush administration.

i think its hysterical that everything that is wrong with America is always, somehow bill Clinton's fault. and the demos had the same info, but the difference is now that they realize they were wrong, they are trying to fix it. not being a cement head, like bush, and refusing to take blame, admitting mistakes, and trying to fix the problem