McNabb says black QBs criticized more

[WillH]

Originally Posted by JWsleep

Here's what I'm pissed about--why no black kickers!

J/K, obviously. I agree that there is inherent racism throughout the US, though much of it below the surface. But it's getting better. These things take time.

As for Donovan's stats, etc.--my guess is that many teams in many cities would be happy to get McNabb even now, much less a few years ago. He's kicked our asses enough times for me to appreciate that he's a high quality NFL QB. He hasn't won a SB, so that's gonna dog him for his career unless he manages to do so.

Race is a tough thing, especially here in the US with our long history of race problems. So I think he was correct in his comment. But he no doubt didn't help his standing by making the comment, especially given the timing. But I respect McNabb, and so I give him the benefit of the doubt here. ANY comment about race is going to cause a firestorm. But not speaking up about it is probably worse--getting these things out in the open and debated will help, even if it takes a long time.

Yeah I agree racial issues need to be discussed to try and bridge the gap, but as hooskins said earlier, he didnt express himself articulately, he was concerned with only his own hardships, and wasnt able to backup his stance when pressed on it...I would have expected him to show more maturity then that. There are racial issues that are of much greater concern then a handful of ignorant people criticizing McNabb, or any black qb, and I wish he could have realized that, even after the fact and expressed that his hardships are nothing compared to say the situation in Jena.

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by WillH

Yeah I agree racial issues need to be discussed to try and bridge the gap, but as hooskins said earlier, he didnt express himself articulately, he was concerned with only his own hardships, and wasnt able to backup his stance when pressed on it...I would have expected him to show more maturity then that. There are racial issues that are of much greater concern then a handful of ignorant people criticizing McNabb, or any black qb, and I wish he could have realized that, even after the fact and expressed that his hardships are nothing compared to say the situation in Jena.

Like people who think there are no white people that can play basketball.

[jsarno]

For every Shaun King (who took his team to the NFC Championship game & was in the league less than 5 years) there are 2-3 Todd Collins

Not every player makes a good back up. King is a perfect example. King didn't deserve to be the starter, but somehow he was thrusted in that position and didn't perform well when he got there.
The difference between a king or a collins, is collins is willing to sit on the bench and do whatever it takes to coach and help the team...King sat on the bench and bitched that he was on the bench.
Those are massive differences if you ask me, yet both have similar talent.

[Longtimefan]

Michael Wilbon's colum in todays WashPost raised some interesting concepts relevant to McNabb's coments. He made reference to many of the young QB's, espically Vince Young who are basically too young to fully understand the true plight of the Black QB in pro football. Further, many of the people who write stories and ask questions that stir controversy about the matter are also much too young to really know about those who actually paved the way for guys like Young, Campbell, Vick and other young african american QB's. The young one's today have prospered as a result of the trailblazers of yesteryear who paved the way for them to be where they are today.

When the question was put to Jason Campbell about McNabb's remarks, his answer was measured, and he chose his words carefully in crafting a response.

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by Longtimefan

When the question was put to Jason Campbell about McNabb's remarks, his answer was measured, and he chose his words carefully in crafting a response.

Absolutely. I was very impressed with Campbell's demeanor and the words he chose. He has very good poise on and off the field.

I knew the kid had talent, but he is impressing me double fold seemingly every week. We finally have the QB we've been looking for!

[SkinsFanSince91]

I believe McNabb is right in his observation, but we have been thru this before with Rush Limbaugh. Everyone knows that black people undergo scrutiny whether they like it or not, but he continues to utter that sentiment.

So, in my opinion, he feels he must say it over again so that people are reminded that it still exists, or he does it because its a shield.

We wont know unless we ask him

[jsarno]

oops, I forgot a white qb that is criticized worse than McNabb...Rex Grossman.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

I don't think that many coaches consciously or unconsciously discriminate against white basketball players or black quarterbacks. I think that 99.9% of teams, particularly pro teams, but their best players out on the field or at the very least attempt to do so without regard to race. That said, I find it surprising that people don't think that there are some people, however few and far between, who do indeed harbor stereotypes about race and sports and allow such stereotypes to, intentionally or not, affect who they put on the field.

In any event, please make every attempt to discuss this topic with civility. If you cannot do so, please do not post. This is not in response to any one post, nor is it directed towards any single person; it is directed towards everyone.

[Darrell_Green_28]

lets cut the racist crap out. its bad enough it still exists. theres a lot of things i could say but prefer not to stoop that low. there are good blacks, whites, yellows, greens, etc... as well as there a bad blacks , whites , yellows, greens, etc.. jeesh lets get over it. i dont agree with anyone pulling the racist thing out just to use it as an excuse. leave that shit in the past.

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by Darrell_Green_28

lets cut the racist crap out. its bad enough it still exists. theres a lot of things i could say but prefer not to stoop that low. there are good blacks, whites, yellows, greens, etc... as well as there a bad blacks , whites , yellows, greens, etc.. jeesh lets get over it. i dont agree with anyone pulling the racist thing out just to use it as an excuse. leave that shit in the past.

I agree...good post.

[WillH]

Sorry, I may have been out of line. I will give up on this topic after this post because obviously Im a bit touchy on this subject. It just bothers me that there is still such blatant ignorance in this country, from both sides of the spectrum. It is a very strong desire of mine to see progress made in bridging the racial divide, but it seems there are so many people intent on keeping it the way it is. McNabb has seen alot of it. He has gotten it from both sides of the spectrum, from both whites and blacks, so I see what he is talking about. But I would have been much more impressed if he hadn't made himself out to be a victim (I already thought he was a victim in prior incidences, I didn't need to hear him complain), and had said that it was something that he regretted to have to encounter because of what it meant about that state of America. Rather he seemed to care more about what it meant for himself and his own career. Maybe there are some biases in sports that need to be resolved, but it seems to me that professional sports is a pretty good gig despite the criticism you are undoubtedly going to receive. Complaining about this crap is just not what is important in racial relations. I think it is more important to address the fact that white and black people seem to still be hell bent on distancing themselves from one another. In Jena, LA a tree was planted by two young men, one white and one black, as a symbol of unity. Many years later a group of white students and a group of black students fought over which group got to sit under the tree, this fight degraded into blatant hateful acts of racism. The tree was taken down. That is so sad to me. Rather then learning to hangout together and share the tree that their ancestors planted as a symbol of unity, they let the dream die. This dream IS dieing. There may be progress in racial equality, and some progress has been made in racial relations, but we still feel a need to segregate ourselves from one another. These are the things we should be concerned about. And frankly comments that engender ideas of divisiveness are a step in the wrong direction. And in some ways I think McNabb (and others) have leaned in that direction. The direction taken in racial relations should be toward bringing us closer together not towards pointing fingers at one another and creating more of a gap. Maybe what Mcnabb said wasn't blatantly wrong or damaging to anything other then his own career and public image, but it definitely wasn't in the vein of what the early civil rights activists were trying to accomplish. Therefore, I have lost a little respect for him (As I used to hold him in high regard). As for this thread, I spent way too much energy and emotion discussing something so trivial, but I guess it is because I hold race relations as of incredible importance, and to see others miss the point so badly makes me feel compelled to interject. I hope I haven't offended anyone, and I am sorry for getting all up in arms (sorry especially to you jsarno, it wasn't my place to judge, though I think you are completely misguided), sometimes passion can make us act like asses.

[SUNRA]

Donovan McNabb should be applauded for his courage to answer a question honestly posed to him by James Brown. As a fan of the Washington Redskins for over 30 years I applaud Joe Gibbs for recognizing the potential in Jason Campbell,but were it not for James Harris, Warren Moon, Doug Williams and Donovan McNabb, Jason Campbell or Vince Young could not stand up today in an interview and say they haven't experienced the same scrutiny that McNabb spoke of. What pisses me off with this so-called objective media is that they put a microphone in front of Jason Campbell a player who hasn't played an entire season and certainly has not felt the scorn of his fans yet. So it was a divide and conquer tactic to get one black person to refute another black persons experience because in the media's viewpoint, one monolithic view represents all black QB'S view ie..Jesse Jackson. Only Black people in general are given one spokesman to speak for them while other people speak for themselves. Some people will never understand the complexities of racism and white supremacy because it is subconcsciously taught to them in church, school , religion and even sports. Based on some of the comments I have read on this thread, there is enough ignorance to go around.

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by SUNRA

Donovan McNabb should be applauded for his courage to answer a question honestly posed to him by James Brown. As a fan of the Washington Redskins for over 30 years I applaud Joe Gibbs for recognizing the potential in Jason Campbell,but were it not for James Harris, Warren Moon, Doug Williams and Donovan McNabb, Jason Campbell or Vince Young could not stand up today in an interview and say they haven't experienced the same scrutiny that McNabb spoke of. What pisses me off with this so-called objective media is that they put a microphone in front of Jason Campbell a player who hasn't played an entire season and certainly has not felt the scorn of his fans yet. So it was a divide and conquer tactic to get one black person to refute another black persons experience because in the media's viewpoint, one monolithic view represents all black QB'S view ie..Jesse Jackson. Only Black people in general are given one spokesman to speak for them while other people speak for themselves. Some people will never understand the complexities of racism and white supremacy because it is subconcsciously taught to them in church, school , religion and even sports. Based on some of the comments I have read on this thread, there is enough ignorance to go around.

Come on dude, there is just as much racism in the black community as there is in the white, if not more. And it's taught to black people every day just as you pointed out. Let's not make this another "it's the white person's fault". Don't think I am accurrate? If you are black, ask yourself how many white players jersey's you have, and how many black players jersey's you have. I have 4 white players, and 18 black players. How many times do you see a black person with a white players jersey on their back? Sure it happens, but not very often. Why is it most white people can see a player as a player regardless of color, but a lot of black people have to make the separation of race? Why not just see it as the human race (as corny as that sounds). When I saw Pedro Martinez on the mound, I didn't see a guy from the dominican republic, I saw a member of the Red Sox going after a world series ring. When I see Jason Campbell lead us to victory, I don't see a black QB, I see a redskins QB who is trying to win us a game.

I understand the world is not ready to hear about the fact that racism is more alive in the minds of a lot of black people...and for the record, I know a lot of black people here that are classy and wonderful, and have not seen racism in them...I am speaking in generics, and this topic gets very dicey. My intent is not to offend...and I will likely refrain from further topic on this because this could get very ugly and I don't want that. I enjoy most of the people on this site, and enjoy the views, and I wish to keep it that way.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by jsarno

Come on dude, there is just as much racism in the black community as there is in the white, if not more. And it's taught to black people every day just as you pointed out. Let's not make this another "it's the white person's fault". Don't think I am accurrate? If you are black, ask yourself how many white players jersey's you have, and how many black players jersey's you have. I have 4 white players, and 18 black players. How many times do you see a black person with a white players jersey on their back? Sure it happens, but not very often. Why is it most white people can see a player as a player regardless of color, but a lot of black people have to make the separation of race? Why not just see it as the human race (as corny as that sounds). When I saw Pedro Martinez on the mound, I didn't see a guy from the dominican republic, I saw a member of the Red Sox going after a world series ring. When I see Jason Campbell lead us to victory, I don't see a black QB, I see a redskins QB who is trying to win us a game.

I understand the world is not ready to hear about the fact that racism is more alive in the minds of a lot of black people...and for the record, I know a lot of black people here that are classy and wonderful, and have not seen racism in them...I am speaking in generics, and this topic gets very dicey. My intent is not to offend...and I will likely refrain from further topic on this because this could get very ugly and I don't want that. I enjoy most of the people on this site, and enjoy the views, and I wish to keep it that way.

The irony in the above passage (i.e., black people are more racist than white people) is quite amazing.

And, I still do not understand how you applaud people for saying "why can't we quit this race card sh*t" when it comes to black QBs, but then pull a race card when it comes to whites in the NBA. Even though you chastise blacks for supposedly seeing color in NFL players, you obviously see color in NBA players.

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

The irony in the above passage (i.e., black people are more racist than white people) is quite amazing.

Funny how that is how you saw that instead of seeing that racism is not just in the hearts of white people. You seem to be completely missing many points, and that is unlike what I have encountered with you in previous threads. I can only assume it's due to the fact that this is a sensitive subject for you.

And, I still do not understand how you applaud people for saying "why can't we quit this race card sh*t" when it comes to black QBs, but then pull a race card when it comes to whites in the NBA. Even though you chastise blacks for supposedly seeing color in NFL players, you obviously see color in NBA players.

This whole NBA thing started from the McNabb thing. The whole point was, how can you see racism in the QB front, but not in the NBA?
Fact is, after this conversation, I will go back to fogetting about it, cause I'm not a big fan of basketball. But if you are trying to make an assertion of racism where there is not, why not look where it actually is?
Sometimes you need to follow along with the conversation, not jump around.