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05-26-2011, 04:16 PM | #16 |
Living Legend
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Re: Game Tape: Ryan Torain
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05-26-2011, 04:22 PM | #17 | |
Playmaker
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Posts: 3,323
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Re: Game Tape: Ryan Torain
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I think Torrain's vision and his ability as a runner are better then you give him credit for. I'm not saying he's a special back because he's not; but he's decent. He likes to keep the play frontside he's not looking to cutback, which limits the explosive runs he can make (on his own) in this scheme. I also think Torrain is right not to look for the cutback because he doesn't cutback very well, which might be because of his upright running style and stiff hips. He also lacks the top end speed to exploit the huge holes when then happen. Torrain's best ability is that for some reason he's hard to bring down, he doesn't have wiggle nor does it look like he's running hard, but he's tough to bring down. Torrain success as a runner comes from trusting/being dependent on the OL and his ability to stay up. And at a 4.5 ypc carry clip he's not a bad back. I like Keiland more then Torrain also, but Keiland is a young back who needs playing time (that he didn't get) to build confidence. Where Torrain lacks the ability and is right not to make aggressive cutback moves I think Keiland does have the ability but lacks the confidence that comes with experience to make those risky cutbacks. Therefore Kei often runs with the aim of picking up whatever yards are there at the POA much like Torrain. But, I think Keiland has the potential to be more then a frontside runner. |
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05-26-2011, 04:23 PM | #18 |
Playmaker
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,323
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Re: Game Tape: Ryan Torain
Dirt-
Are you taking requests? Could you cut up Keiland Williams stuff from the Titans game? BTW-You are my hero. |
05-26-2011, 05:19 PM | #19 | |
Living Legend
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Evanston, IL
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Re: Game Tape: Ryan Torain
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RBs get their value (well, rushing value, blocking/receiving are such underrated skills for RBs) in one of two ways, they must either consistently get positive yards that are also valuable, or they must provide the "shock" play, usually a long TD run, at a better than average rate. I struggle to put Torain in one of these two categories because he doesn't neatly fit. Torain provides "shock" plays to a starving offense, which is why I believe some overvalue him in an offense like the Redskins. When Torain gets loose on the edge and moves beyond the linebackers and into the secondary with long strides, the Redskins move down the field fairly quickly. Torain has a knack for bunching his 17 yard gains together and moving the offense down the field. In the red zone, he's an average player. His skill set doesn't diminish in the red zones: his TDs scored are pretty proportional to all of his value statistics. On the other hand, Torain would probably be better classified as a running back who gets his value from consistently getting positive yards. When the Redskins move down the field on the back of their running game, it's usually because Torain is stringing together a bunch of plays. So Torain gets and deserves the credit for these drives. But if we increase the sample to include all Redskins drives in the ten games Torain was active for, the offensive production doesn't look like it has a 4.5 YPC running back touching the football 17 times per game. Mostly because if we think of Torain as a 4.5 YPC back, we miss the boom or bust nature of his runs. Ryan Torain lost yards on 28 of his 164 (17%) carries. Clinton Portis, who was deemed too old and ineffective to earn a roster spot next year, lost yards on 6 of his 54 (9%) carries behind the same (arguably worse because it was earlier in the season) OL. So it's not the OL that's causing Torain to lose yards so frequently. It might be Cooley and Sellers, but the reason I believe that those two are blowing so many blocks that causes Torain to be TFL is because he never cuts it up inside the tight end, so he's putting those players in a no win situation on blocking...a situation that Cooley and Fred Davis are actually winning way more likely than they should. Like I said above, YPC is always going to overstate Torain's effectiveness on runs, but if he either stops losing yards so frequently or learns to take the ball to the house from 40+ yards out, you'll see that YPC extend over 5.0 and he'll be a positive value runner at that point. Right now, I think he's slightly negative in terms of value as a runner, although he's an above average pass blocker and he adds something to the passing attack as a receiver.
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according to a source with knowledge of the situation. |
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05-26-2011, 05:50 PM | #20 | |
Naega jeil jal naga
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Atlanta, Georgia From: Silver Spring, Maryland
Age: 38
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Re: Game Tape: Ryan Torain
Quote:
Actually the funny thing is InsaneBoost deserves a lot of the credit as he provided the raw material for virtually every single video I've posted the past week. Kind of hope he starts posting here again so I can thank him.
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05-26-2011, 08:38 PM | #21 |
The Starter
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Norfolk, Va (OV)
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Re: Game Tape: Ryan Torain
I'm loving these. I was so disappointed in last season, I stopped watching after awhile. Other things contributed too. Thanks Dirt' and 'Boost.
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'Any NFL team will win with RG3. Imagine how exciting it will be watching him do it.' |
05-26-2011, 10:26 PM | #22 | ||
Playmaker
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,323
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Re: Game Tape: Ryan Torain
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he's the man for his time'n place, he fits right in there--and that's Quote:
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05-27-2011, 12:53 AM | #23 |
Naega jeil jal naga
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Atlanta, Georgia From: Silver Spring, Maryland
Age: 38
Posts: 14,750
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Re: Game Tape: Ryan Torain
Para 30gut-san.
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05-27-2011, 08:27 AM | #24 |
The Starter
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Charlotte NC
Age: 49
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Re: Game Tape: Ryan Torain
I personally love the way he played last year. He ran tough, made right thought we'd draft more Oline or possible corners. I hope they allow Torain to keep the job. He did a really good job last year when healthy. Hopefully he can stay healthy.
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05-27-2011, 07:29 PM | #25 |
Playmaker
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,323
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Re: Game Tape: Ryan Torain
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05-27-2011, 09:10 PM | #26 |
Naega jeil jal naga
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Atlanta, Georgia From: Silver Spring, Maryland
Age: 38
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Re: Game Tape: Ryan Torain
No problem. Actually I was able to put it together in 15 minutes by using the game book off NFL.com which showed me the exact points where Keiland touched the ball. So rather then having to watch every single offensive snap I was able to just scroll to the seconds leading up to the snap. Hell of a time saver.
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"It's nice to be important, but its more important to be nice." - Scooter "I feel like Dirtbag has been slowly and methodically trolling the board for a month or so now." - FRPLG |
05-27-2011, 09:10 PM | #27 |
Gamebreaker
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 14,243
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Re: Game Tape: Ryan Torain
Thanks again Dirtbag!! Hard to judge him against these teams as I imagine anybody will look like a pro-bowler going up against those guys. That said, I'll make some my observations on him.
Positives: 1) Runs hard 2) Not easy to bring down Negatives: 1) Has absolutely no game breaking speed 2) Seems to slow down to a halt for some cuts and jukes 3) Limited vision. Some of his cuts went the wrong way. All in all, I like Ryan Torain and I'd rather have him in the backfield than Portis. However, I think Torain is at best a backup, and I have a feeling Helu is going to be starting if/when the season ever gets underway. That is on the condition that Helu actually absorbs Shanny's offense and understands what to do. (unlike a D. Thomas) |
05-27-2011, 11:49 PM | #28 |
Playmaker
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Martinsburg, WV
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Re: Game Tape: Ryan Torain
I thought K. Williams looked below average at best on that film. Maybe I was looking at it wrong.
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05-28-2011, 05:44 AM | #29 |
Naega jeil jal naga
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Atlanta, Georgia From: Silver Spring, Maryland
Age: 38
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Re: Game Tape: Ryan Torain
If you have request please let me know. Doesn't mean I'll put together the video right away but I'll certainly try to get to it. Brian Orakpo, MeAngelo (not so much an insult as much as I love the way it rolls off the tongue), Los, Cooley, Moss, and McNabb are among the other players I've considered highlighting. Both Dallas games, Indy, New York Week 17, Houston, Tennessee, and Tampa are the easiest games for me to put together right now.
Speaking of short videos check out Anthony Armstrong Weeks 14-17. Lol, now I'm reminded why I hate receivers. Fletcher, Landry, Torain, Williams, and Grossman have all produced one game videos no shorter then 6 minutes. Armstrong on the other hand I can fit 4 weeks worth of games in one video.
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"It's nice to be important, but its more important to be nice." - Scooter "I feel like Dirtbag has been slowly and methodically trolling the board for a month or so now." - FRPLG |
05-31-2011, 02:21 AM | #30 |
Naega jeil jal naga
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Atlanta, Georgia From: Silver Spring, Maryland
Age: 38
Posts: 14,750
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Re: Game Tape: Ryan Torain
Ryan Torain vs Bears without sound can be found here. Seems to flow better though without sound as I was allowed to focus simply on getting the right shots rather then making sure I included relevant commentary.
Santana Moss Week 16 and 17 video will be available by the time most of you read this.
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