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Alex Smith’s Amazing Comeback(?)

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Old 02-12-2020, 01:16 PM   #16
BigHairedAristocrat
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Re: Alex Smith’s Amazing Comeback(?)

I'm sure this is mostly about Smith just being competitive and doing the best he can to recover and rehab with full and free access to an NFL teams facilities and staff. He likely knows he will never play again, but the more he does now to rehab to potentially help him return to football will only help him have as close to normal use of his leg for non-football activities for the rest of his life.

Additionally, he has to at least try to make it back and not be cleared in order for the skins to get the salary cap credit from an insurance policy the skins took out on him before signing the deal. If i recall, the policy pays around 12M (which can be credited to the cap) if Smith suffers a career-ending injury. That insurance company surely would find a way not to pay the claim if it appeared that Smith and the team didn't do everything in their power try to get him back to playing football.

We should all root for him as a human being, but it is almost certain that he will never play professional football again.
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Old 02-12-2020, 01:52 PM   #17
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Re: Alex Smith’s Amazing Comeback(?)

Ultimately though, whether he will actually succeed in playing football again is irrelevant for our personnel department this year. They’re stuck with his big cap number. As long as he’s trying to come back, we owe that money, and if we owe that money we might as well keep an open mind and see what he can do.

Hope for the best and prepare for the worst. We have to acquire another QB to be Haskins’s backup, either through FA or draft. And if it turns out Alex can actually play, great. But we have to plan as if he can’t and we’re stuck paying a shit ton for another PUP season.
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Old 02-12-2020, 02:27 PM   #18
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Re: Alex Smith’s Amazing Comeback(?)

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Originally Posted by SunnySide View Post
Not if he retires. He would most likely have to actually pay the Skins back some money.

According to the CBA, “any player who willfully fails to report, practice or play” due to poor conduct, incarceration, or voluntary retirement “may be required to forfeit signing bonus, roster bonus, option bonus and/or reporting bonus.”

Barry Sanders, Calvin Johnson, Borland ... they not only forfeited future guaranteed money but had to pay back prior already paid signing bonus money.
Those guys all retired not due to injury but concern for future injuries, so Alex Smith's situation is different. He has already made $202 million -- this is not at all about the money. (Parenthetically, he lives in my town and is building a house here; I'm sure it is already paid for.)
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Old 02-12-2020, 05:57 PM   #19
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Re: Alex Smith’s Amazing Comeback(?)

He needs to retire. It's over. He's lucky to be alive. He had a septic infection?? That is crazy. He has the rest of his life to live and should figure out the next phase.
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Old 02-12-2020, 06:34 PM   #20
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Re: Alex Smith’s Amazing Comeback(?)

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He needs to retire. It's over. He's lucky to be alive. He had a septic infection?? That is crazy. He has the rest of his life to live and should figure out the next phase.
Yeah I get the whole "prove them wrong" aspect but cmon man, this is ridiculous
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Old 02-12-2020, 06:56 PM   #21
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Re: Alex Smith’s Amazing Comeback(?)

Why would Alex retire and give up tens of millions of dollars, at the end of his career? He’s a super competitive and first-class player who is respected by fellow players, the coaches and the media. The Chiefs are still raving about him and how he helped Mahomes and the team’s culture.

Alex is doing the same positive things here for Haskin’s and the team that he did for the Chiefs. Look how much he helped Haskin’s last season to grow and mature. I’m guessing Alex Smith’s interesting association with Dan Snyder last season perhaps helped Snyder to mature as an owner. It maybe even assisted Snyder cut his dependence on Bruce Allen and made it easier to fire Allen.

So Alex Smith keeps trying to come back to football strength and perhaps may even workout in the OTA’s and TC.

Alex Smith was handed a crazy and ridiculous contract by Bruce Allen. Allen was frantic at that time to hire a competitive QB after the media criticism for how “Kurt” Cousins was managed by Bruce Allen. The Redskins are paying cap-wise now for Bruce Allen’s mismanagement and this contract, but the team is getting some unexpected benefits from Alex Smith now. Certainly Alex will continue to assist Haskin’s as he matures as a QB. His grit and toughness in this comeback story is an inspiration to the players and he will perhaps even continue to provide good advice to Snyder.




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Old 02-12-2020, 07:52 PM   #22
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Re: Alex Smith’s Amazing Comeback(?)

1. All this talk about Alex Smith was paid an insane contract is nonsense. He was paid the going rate for a NFL caliber starting quarterback at the time. You can put a lot of things on Bruce Allen, but this isn't one of them. It's standard practice to trade for a guy and then give up a long term extension to complete the deal, otherwise the player might not agree to the trade.

2. I'm not saying Alex Smith is doing this for the wrong reasons, his track record as a team player goes back to when Kaepernick was on the 49ers. He will absolutely be an asset for Haskins to have around. And I'm not disputing his mindset right now is "I want to go as hard as I can for as long as I can, and be the first quarterback to come back from an injury this severe."

3. I think it's a perfect storm of circumstance, we knew after he went down that we had to hold onto him for at least 2 years because of the cap implications. This gives him 2 years minimum to rehab his leg and hopefully worst case scenario be able to step away from the game with no long-term complications. Best case scenario he comes back from the brink of having his leg cut off and plays football again, whether as a backup or starter. But even in his best case scenario he would only be competing for a starting spot on a team, most likely as a bridge to the next long-term qb of a franchise. So he has the motivation to do this, and he has the comfort of knowing his cap hit means he's here until next offseason at a minimum. But realistically, even if he does come back and prove he belongs on the 53, it hopefully won't be as a starter here because that would mean Haskins is a bust. I personally hope Haskins seizes this opportunity and removes all doubt whatsoever that he can be a stud qb in this league. And even if he doesn't, I consider it highly unlikely the Redskins would go into next offseason thinking Alex Smith deserves the starting job again. Alex Smith will either retire next offseason or the Redskins will release him and he will battle on another squad for a starting or reserve job.
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Old 02-13-2020, 10:43 AM   #23
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Re: Alex Smith’s Amazing Comeback(?)

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Originally Posted by mooby View Post
1. All this talk about Alex Smith was paid an insane contract is nonsense. He was paid the going rate for a NFL caliber starting quarterback at the time. You can put a lot of things on Bruce Allen, but this isn't one of them. It's standard practice to trade for a guy and then give up a long term extension to complete the deal, otherwise the player might not agree to the trade.

2. I'm not saying Alex Smith is doing this for the wrong reasons, his track record as a team player goes back to when Kaepernick was on the 49ers. He will absolutely be an asset for Haskins to have around. And I'm not disputing his mindset right now is "I want to go as hard as I can for as long as I can, and be the first quarterback to come back from an injury this severe."

3. I think it's a perfect storm of circumstance, we knew after he went down that we had to hold onto him for at least 2 years because of the cap implications. This gives him 2 years minimum to rehab his leg and hopefully worst case scenario be able to step away from the game with no long-term complications. Best case scenario he comes back from the brink of having his leg cut off and plays football again, whether as a backup or starter. But even in his best case scenario he would only be competing for a starting spot on a team, most likely as a bridge to the next long-term qb of a franchise. So he has the motivation to do this, and he has the comfort of knowing his cap hit means he's here until next offseason at a minimum. But realistically, even if he does come back and prove he belongs on the 53, it hopefully won't be as a starter here because that would mean Haskins is a bust. I personally hope Haskins seizes this opportunity and removes all doubt whatsoever that he can be a stud qb in this league. And even if he doesn't, I consider it highly unlikely the Redskins would go into next offseason thinking Alex Smith deserves the starting job again. Alex Smith will either retire next offseason or the Redskins will release him and he will battle on another squad for a starting or reserve job.
A lot of people that complain about the Smith's contract, need to realize that no one saw this type of freak/fluke injury happening. Yes, old QBs are more likely to get injured, but these type of freak injuries happen by chance and could happen to anyone (see Teddy B.'s injury).

And the funny thing is that this offseason we may be seeing two old QBs get paid big time (Brady and Rivers).
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Old 02-13-2020, 12:55 PM   #24
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Re: Alex Smith’s Amazing Comeback(?)

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1. All this talk about Alex Smith was paid an insane contract is nonsense.
I think the criticism from some fans (me included) was that Bruce:

- didnt offer Cousins (28 yrs old?) fair guaranteed money to sign him long term
- didnt trade him (bc he sd a deal would get done) and only got the comp pick
- traded a 3R plus Kendal Fuller for Alex Smith (33-34 yrs old/)
- then gave essentially 71M guaranteed to Alex Smith for essentially 3 years

Its not revisionist history imo, I remember a majority of fans were not happy with the trade or the contract Bruce gave to Alex.
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Old 02-13-2020, 01:13 PM   #25
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Re: Alex Smith’s Amazing Comeback(?)

The first 90 seconds against Tyson are probably just as challenging as coming back from this leg.

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Old 02-13-2020, 01:32 PM   #26
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Alex Smith’s Amazing Comeback(?)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mooby View Post
1. All this talk about Alex Smith was paid an insane contract is nonsense. He was paid the going rate for a NFL caliber starting quarterback at the time. You can put a lot of things on Bruce Allen, but this isn't one of them. It's standard practice to trade for a guy and then give up a long term extension to complete the deal, otherwise the player might not agree to the trade.



2. I'm not saying Alex Smith is doing this for the wrong reasons, his track record as a team player goes back to when Kaepernick was on the 49ers. He will absolutely be an asset for Haskins to have around. And I'm not disputing his mindset right now is "I want to go as hard as I can for as long as I can, and be the first quarterback to come back from an injury this severe."



3. I think it's a perfect storm of circumstance, we knew after he went down that we had to hold onto him for at least 2 years because of the cap implications. This gives him 2 years minimum to rehab his leg and hopefully worst case scenario be able to step away from the game with no long-term complications. Best case scenario he comes back from the brink of having his leg cut off and plays football again, whether as a backup or starter. But even in his best case scenario he would only be competing for a starting spot on a team, most likely as a bridge to the next long-term qb of a franchise. So he has the motivation to do this, and he has the comfort of knowing his cap hit means he's here until next offseason at a minimum. But realistically, even if he does come back and prove he belongs on the 53, it hopefully won't be as a starter here because that would mean Haskins is a bust. I personally hope Haskins seizes this opportunity and removes all doubt whatsoever that he can be a stud qb in this league. And even if he doesn't, I consider it highly unlikely the Redskins would go into next offseason thinking Alex Smith deserves the starting job again. Alex Smith will either retire next offseason or the Redskins will release him and he will battle on another squad for a starting or reserve job.


Mooby, you know after really looking at Alex Smith’s last three years, I have to admit that you are mostly RIGHT about his contract. His contract was in line with other QB contracts in 2017.Alex had the following PFF rankings versus other QB in the NFL from 2016-2018:

2016: 21 out of 32
2017: 7 out of 32
2018 (until injury): 22 out of 32. It was noted in 2018, that his long pass attempts and TDs were in the BOTTOM THREE in the NFL. In other words, Alex was throwing lots of short, but safe, passes - even when the team was losing.

It is easy to look at Alex Smith’s excellent ranking in 2017 and see why Bruce Allen became enamored with him. But how much of it was Alex Smith and how much of it was the Chiefs ascension to a superior offense?
That’s what Bruce Smith was paid to do as GM - try to predict how Alex would do with the Redskin’s offense, not with a excellent Chief’s offense.

Bruce paid for Alex based on his superior performance in 2017, on a very, very good team. In my opinion, Bruce was running scared and wanted to hook an exciting NAME in the off-season, which was his modus for his decade as the GM. Big splash in the off-season - “winning off the field”, and win just enough games in the season to be able to say, “we’re close”. Close to what??. Back in 2016-2017, the press had pummeled Allen for the Cousin’s drama and so he traded Kendall Fuller to the Chiefs for Alex - a player they were going to release anyway. Could he have got Alex cheaper? Probably, but Bruce didn’t care about that. He was desperate to get a name for the next season. In 2018, the Redskins had a good record out of the gate (6-2) but I think Defensive coordinators had figured out how Alex was playing and were countering that when he was hurt.

Another factor is age. Although we have seen phenomenal QB like Tom Brady play into his 40’s, many other QB see a decline at Alex’s age. Also, Alex was let go by two separate teams. That’s telling you something - they didn’t want him as their #1 QB. Obviously, when you have a QB of Mahome’s caliber, you can’t hold him down.
But teams didn’t know which Alex Smith was going to show up - the below average QB of 2016, 2018 or the smoking QB of 2017.

Obviously, there was no way to predict the injury he had. But Bruce Allen knew our OL was shaky, so he should have been looking for a younger QB who could take hits and/or could scramble.

I think Bruce overpaid for Alex Smith a little, but Mooby you are right - it was in tune with
with the QB salaries for his level in his excellent 2017 season. The mistake was with Bruce Allen not drafting a QB while Cousin’s was under a franchise contract. When they couldn’t hold Cousin any longer, Bruce had to pay top dollar for the biggest QB name available- regardless of age or whether he fit our team or not.


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Old 02-13-2020, 08:28 PM   #27
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Re: Alex Smith’s Amazing Comeback(?)

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Originally Posted by SunnySide View Post
I think the criticism from some fans (me included) was that Bruce:

- didnt offer Cousins (28 yrs old?) fair guaranteed money to sign him long term
- didnt trade him (bc he sd a deal would get done) and only got the comp pick
- traded a 3R plus Kendal Fuller for Alex Smith (33-34 yrs old/)
- then gave essentially 71M guaranteed to Alex Smith for essentially 3 years

Its not revisionist history imo, I remember a majority of fans were not happy with the trade or the contract Bruce gave to Alex.
Bruce absolutely fucked up the Kirk situation and I have no problem blaming him for that. As soon as Bruce decided Kirk wasn't worth the going rate for a starting qb at the time he should've moved on to plan B, which would be figuring out his replacement and maximizing the return on Kirk. Instead he kept tagging him until it no longer became viable, then let him go for a 3rd round comp pick. You can't convince me there wasn't an NFL team that wouldn't give up a higher pick for Kirk if Bruce put him on the block. But Bruce's arrogance (or whatever you want to call it) got in the way.

I wasn't happy about giving up Fuller, I wasn't happy about letting Kirk go the way he did, and I wasn't happy exchanging Kirk for Alex Smith. But the contract Smith got isn't the problem here. We got burnt because of the flukiest of fluke injuries, qb's get sacked all the time without their bone breaking through the skin. Shit sucks but best case scenario this time next year we're talking about how to help our franchise qb named Haskins keep improving and Alex Smith is going to retire or compete somewhere else. I like Smith and think he has plenty to offer as a mentor, but do I want him being a primary backup as a qb in his late 30's who hasn't played in 2+ years? No.
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Old 02-13-2020, 08:40 PM   #28
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Re: Alex Smith’s Amazing Comeback(?)

I believe that the best decision is to let Smith continue his recovery before making any drastic moves with him. Let him mentor Haskins until Smith is once again a contender (if he decides to) for the QB spot, and then have them "battle" it out and then pray that nothing terrible happens again.
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Old 02-13-2020, 09:04 PM   #29
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Re: Alex Smith’s Amazing Comeback(?)

Smith will never play another snap, but wont retire until this guaranteed money isnt coming in. To think otherwise is ridiculous. Hind sight is always 20/20...the contract seemed a bit much just because of the guaranteed money....but a team that needs a qb will do that. The injury was unforeseen, and the only real reason anyone is upset about the contract (now). We knew it would handcuff us, but we expected to have a game manager that we could start building other parts of the roster up. Obviously we were drafting heavily on the defensive side. I believe this was all part of a plan. The injury throws the whole equation off. But to think that Smith is going to play again is absurd. I agree with sunny. Both sides are doing exactly what they have to right now in this situation. Retiring on his side would be nonsensical, and cutting him would be nonsensical. You can really tell it's the slow part of the season with threads like this.
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Old 02-14-2020, 07:11 PM   #30
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Re: Alex Smith’s Amazing Comeback(?)

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Smith will never play another snap, but wont retire until this guaranteed money isnt coming in. To think otherwise is ridiculous. Hind sight is always 20/20...the contract seemed a bit much just because of the guaranteed money....but a team that needs a qb will do that. The injury was unforeseen, and the only real reason anyone is upset about the contract (now). We knew it would handcuff us, but we expected to have a game manager that we could start building other parts of the roster up. Obviously we were drafting heavily on the defensive side. I believe this was all part of a plan. The injury throws the whole equation off. But to think that Smith is going to play again is absurd. I agree with sunny. Both sides are doing exactly what they have to right now in this situation. Retiring on his side would be nonsensical, and cutting him would be nonsensical. You can really tell it's the slow part of the season with threads like this.
I don't mean any disrespect to you, but what makes you know for certain that Smith never plays again? Cooley talks about him all the time and has said several times that he does believe that Alex Smith will be playing somewhere this coming season.

I think his comeback from where he went from nearly losing his leg, to nearly dying from infection, to get back to being able to walk without a cane, and then from there, go back to working out on a football field again, running, throwing, dropping back etc., is nothing short of miraculous. He for sure has a warriors' heart and for someone to not give the man a fair chance to tryout / workout would be cruel when you think of how much Alex wants it himself, and how far he has came. If Alex is aware of all of the risks which i'm sure he is, it's his life if he wants to do it. If he gets a fair medical evaluation and someone signs off on him, i think he deserves the chance.
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