The Ramsey Dilemma

JWsleep · 08-30-2004, 01:42 PM

And don't forget Samuels. I bet all the Samuels haters felt differently when he went down the other night...

But back to the thread, here. It seems to be to be really clear that Ramsey has the physical gifts, but hasn't learned to read pro-defenses. Two years under Spurrier's "system" didn't help. How do you learn to read pro-defenses? Practice with real pro coaches and real pro defenses (ie, Gibbs, Breaux, Williams, etc.). Have a good older QB to mentor you (ie, Brunell), and you get into real games when the pressure isn't extreme and the o-line can protect. All these things are now set up for Ramsey here in DC. Gibbs has asserted time and time again that Ramsey has a great future with the club. When has he ever lied?

So, what, exactly, is the "dilemma" here? Dilemmas are usually "damned if you do, damned if you don't." Here "do" means keeping and developing Ramsey. I don't see the problem. Seems like a good plan to me.

That Guy · 08-30-2004, 01:54 PM

thank you JWsleep

impatience is just really rampant over a preseason that's fairly meaningless right now... though i figure its that way every year...

its looking right now like there's only going to be 5-8 hard cuts this year for the final 53 man roster, and up to 8 of those cuts could end up on the PS...

i don't see how people are saying we should cut some of these guys.... ie, jacobs, 2nd rounder, ruined rookie year, and people are already yelling to toss him (and if that'd happened, we'd get no return on a 2nd round pick and he'd probably end up starting on another team within 2 years)...

firing half the starting line up because they're not peyton manning/ed reed/ray lewis is kinda dim-witted

please, just relax... its not like we really have any say in the matter anways.

Redskins_P · 08-30-2004, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JWsleep

Gibbs has asserted time and time again that Ramsey has a great future with the club. When has he ever lied? :

Well, according to KWII Gibbs lied to him. Just kidding guys.

MTK · 08-30-2004, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redskins_P

Matty, you know that Bowen has to go.

Next year maybe, but in the meantime who replaces him, Lott?? I'm not sure he'd be much better. He looked pretty shaky against the Rams.

sportscurmudgeon · 08-30-2004, 07:10 PM

I know that some folks here will not like this, but what the hay...

Patrick Ramsey has looked just short of incompetent so far this pre-season. It isn't that his timing is off or he is just missing his throws; he has looked awful. And that scares me a bit for this reason:

Ramsey showed in the past two years that he is a big tough kid with a big arm. That's it. That's all he showed. Don't tell me about his great scramble against the Jets. Don't tell me how he snatched victory from the jaws of defeat against whomever. He played in a goofy offensive system that asked him to take a pounding and make throws that only someone with a cannon for an arm would have a prayer of completing. That's what he showed.

Now he is in a system for the first time in his life where he has to use a part of his body other than his arm to be successful - - and so far it isn't working. He'd have to improve 200% to look confused out there. My guess is that he has never had to do anything at QB (at Tulane or with the Spurrier Skins) other than drop back and pull the trigger. That is NOT the system that Gibbs uses and in his minicamps and his QB camps and in his passing camps and in training camp, he has not gotten it. Yet...

There have been lots of guys with great arms - better than Ramsey's - who never managed to make it in the NFL because they never got the concept of the mental part of the game. The list is long but the name all of you will recognize immediately is Jeff George whose arm made Ramsey's look like a rag doll.

This is an important year for Patrick Ramsey and the best place for him to be is on the bench so he can try to understand what needs to be done and not try to learn it on the fly. Because if he does not improve a whole lot in the next season, he may not be "the future" for this team - even if Danny Boy is the one who "discovered him" and drafted him. This kid needs a lot of time on the vine - or the pine if you wish - to be able to play in this offensive system.

MTK · 08-30-2004, 07:15 PM

I don't disagree one bit SC. He definitely needs a year on the bench. In hindsight he was thrust into the mix way too early and Spurrier's back-asswards system did him no good.

I'm optimistic he'll still develop into a quality QB. Along with that strong arm he's got a good head on his shoulders and there's no doubting his toughness and devotion to learning the game.

Give him some time to pick things up and I really expect him to push hard for the starting job next year.

08-30-2004, 01:42 PM	#46
JWsleep Propane and propane accessories Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Houston, TX Age: 55 Posts: 4,702	And don't forget Samuels. I bet all the Samuels haters felt differently when he went down the other night... But back to the thread, here. It seems to be to be really clear that Ramsey has the physical gifts, but hasn't learned to read pro-defenses. Two years under Spurrier's "system" didn't help. How do you learn to read pro-defenses? Practice with real pro coaches and real pro defenses (ie, Gibbs, Breaux, Williams, etc.). Have a good older QB to mentor you (ie, Brunell), and you get into real games when the pressure isn't extreme and the o-line can protect. All these things are now set up for Ramsey here in DC. Gibbs has asserted time and time again that Ramsey has a great future with the club. When has he ever lied? So, what, exactly, is the "dilemma" here? Dilemmas are usually "damned if you do, damned if you don't." Here "do" means keeping and developing Ramsey. I don't see the problem. Seems like a good plan to me. __________________ Hail from Houston!

08-30-2004, 01:54 PM	#47
That Guy Living Legend Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: VA Age: 41 Posts: 17,492	thank you JWsleep impatience is just really rampant over a preseason that's fairly meaningless right now... though i figure its that way every year... its looking right now like there's only going to be 5-8 hard cuts this year for the final 53 man roster, and up to 8 of those cuts could end up on the PS... i don't see how people are saying we should cut some of these guys.... ie, jacobs, 2nd rounder, ruined rookie year, and people are already yelling to toss him (and if that'd happened, we'd get no return on a 2nd round pick and he'd probably end up starting on another team within 2 years)... firing half the starting line up because they're not peyton manning/ed reed/ray lewis is kinda dim-witted please, just relax... its not like we really have any say in the matter anways.

08-30-2004, 07:10 PM	#50
sportscurmudgeon Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 3,159	I know that some folks here will not like this, but what the hay... Patrick Ramsey has looked just short of incompetent so far this pre-season. It isn't that his timing is off or he is just missing his throws; he has looked awful. And that scares me a bit for this reason: Ramsey showed in the past two years that he is a big tough kid with a big arm. That's it. That's all he showed. Don't tell me about his great scramble against the Jets. Don't tell me how he snatched victory from the jaws of defeat against whomever. He played in a goofy offensive system that asked him to take a pounding and make throws that only someone with a cannon for an arm would have a prayer of completing. That's what he showed. Now he is in a system for the first time in his life where he has to use a part of his body other than his arm to be successful - - and so far it isn't working. He'd have to improve 200% to look confused out there. My guess is that he has never had to do anything at QB (at Tulane or with the Spurrier Skins) other than drop back and pull the trigger. That is NOT the system that Gibbs uses and in his minicamps and his QB camps and in his passing camps and in training camp, he has not gotten it. Yet... There have been lots of guys with great arms - better than Ramsey's - who never managed to make it in the NFL because they never got the concept of the mental part of the game. The list is long but the name all of you will recognize immediately is Jeff George whose arm made Ramsey's look like a rag doll. This is an important year for Patrick Ramsey and the best place for him to be is on the bench so he can try to understand what needs to be done and not try to learn it on the fly. Because if he does not improve a whole lot in the next season, he may not be "the future" for this team - even if Danny Boy is the one who "discovered him" and drafted him. This kid needs a lot of time on the vine - or the pine if you wish - to be able to play in this offensive system.

08-30-2004, 07:15 PM	#51
MTK \m/ Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: NY Age: 51 Posts: 99,363	I don't disagree one bit SC. He definitely needs a year on the bench. In hindsight he was thrust into the mix way too early and Spurrier's back-asswards system did him no good. I'm optimistic he'll still develop into a quality QB. Along with that strong arm he's got a good head on his shoulders and there's no doubting his toughness and devotion to learning the game. Give him some time to pick things up and I really expect him to push hard for the starting job next year.

The Ramsey Dilemma

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