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Old 10-22-2018, 05:27 PM   #31
Daseal
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Re: Trade Deadline Moves

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Originally Posted by NC_Skins View Post
Patriots gave up a 5th rounder for Josh Gordan. Why in the hell would anybody even waste a 3rd on a guy who's best attribute is being consistent about being inconsistent.
Cooper drops balls, no doubt - he's also had back to back 1000 yard seasons. Something none of our receivers are going to sniff and we haven't for a long time. When it comes to Gordon, he also has substance abuse issues and is one screw up from never playing again, he's older than Cooper, and was coming off not playing the past 3 seasons.

Let's look at our history of 3rd round picks (reverse chronological order):

Geron Christian
Fabian Monreau
Kendall Fuller
Matt Jones
Morgan Moses
Spencer Long
Jordan Reed

Outside Reed, Moses, and maybe Fuller (not evaluating Christian yet) - I'd take Amari over the rest. Even with inconsistency. That's why I'd be willing to give up a 3rd for a young player that has had impressive production even with a major, but fixable, flaw.

I think a 1st was too much, especially with the contract costs that will come with it so I'm glad the skins didn't try to pursue, but I don't think a 3rd for Cooper is crazy. I'd definitely take Cooper over Gordon. Rather have a guy that can be on the field to catch balls rather than a constantly suspended player. The Redskins locker room also isn't as strong as the Patriots.
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Old 10-22-2018, 05:48 PM   #32
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Re: Trade Deadline Moves

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Originally Posted by Daseal View Post
Cooper drops balls, no doubt - he's also had back to back 1000 yard seasons. Something none of our receivers are going to sniff and we haven't for a long time. When it comes to Gordon, he also has substance abuse issues and is one screw up from never playing again, he's older than Cooper, and was coming off not playing the past 3 seasons.

Let's look at our history of 3rd round picks (reverse chronological order):

Geron Christian
Fabian Monreau
Kendall Fuller
Matt Jones
Morgan Moses
Spencer Long
Jordan Reed

Outside Reed, Moses, and maybe Fuller (not evaluating Christian yet) - I'd take Amari over the rest. Even with inconsistency. That's why I'd be willing to give up a 3rd for a young player that has had impressive production even with a major, but fixable, flaw.

I think a 1st was too much, especially with the contract costs that will come with it so I'm glad the skins didn't try to pursue, but I don't think a 3rd for Cooper is crazy. I'd definitely take Cooper over Gordon. Rather have a guy that can be on the field to catch balls rather than a constantly suspended player. The Redskins locker room also isn't as strong as the Patriots.
Our 2nd Round picks have been less productive than our 3rds!
Going back 10 years:

2008: Thomas, Davis, Kelly
2011: Jarvis Jenkins
2013: Amerson
2014: Murphy
2015: Preston Smith
2016: Pussy ass bitch
2017: Anderson
2018: Guice

I have a lot of hope for Guice but our 2nd rounders have been cursed.
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Old 10-22-2018, 05:59 PM   #33
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Re: Trade Deadline Moves

I look at those lists (particularly recent) and see these guys:
Geron Christian (too early for judgement)
Fabian Monreau - starter
Kendall Fuller -starter
Matt Jones miss
Morgan Moses - starter
Spencer Long -still in league
Jordan Reed -starter
2014: Murphy still in league
2015: Preston Smith starter
2016: Pussy ass bitch IR yeah he is
2017: Anderson starter
2018: Guice IR, too early to tell

You guys are crazy if you think, in general, other gm's are far exceeding our FO in terms of draft picks.
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Old 10-22-2018, 06:05 PM   #34
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Re: Trade Deadline Moves

Sounds like Cowboys fans aren't very happy, but seems like this gives them a threat receiver they didn't have. His drops are a concern, but it's a risk/reward move.

Of course, I don't know what receivers are coming out in the draft, but we all know there are not many sure fire hits on WR's in the draft.
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Old 10-22-2018, 07:53 PM   #35
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Re: Trade Deadline Moves

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Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule View Post
I look at those lists (particularly recent) and see these guys:
Geron Christian (too early for judgement)
Fabian Monreau - starter
Kendall Fuller -starter
Matt Jones miss
Morgan Moses - starter
Spencer Long -still in league
Jordan Reed -starter
2014: Murphy still in league
2015: Preston Smith starter
2016: Pussy ass bitch IR yeah he is
2017: Anderson starter
2018: Guice IR, too early to tell

You guys are crazy if you think, in general, other gm's are far exceeding our FO in terms of draft picks.
This team has not benefited from the draft like the top half of the league.
Half those players you listed aren't even on our roster right now.

Preston Smith probably won't be a starter in the NFL next year unless the Redskins don't find a replacement.

Anderson isn't a starter. I would like to see more of him and he is improving but he isn't a starter. also most of us wanted Kamara with that pick.

Bruce has talked about building through the draft and taking care of our own players. Well... out of his 70+ players drafted while he's been here, only 12 or 13 are currently contributing to the team.

CRed, I'm not letting this one go.
Our drafts suck and I'm willing to have a televised deathmatch over this. We can go pick by pick grading players and what they are currently doing for THIS team.

I'll concede that this years draft looks good if you acknowledge that BA made a monumental screw up by letting Dallas have Pro-Bowler Demarcus Lawrence.
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Old 10-22-2018, 08:07 PM   #36
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Re: Trade Deadline Moves

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This team has not benefited from the draft like the top half of the league.
Half those players you listed aren't even on our roster right now.

Preston Smith probably won't be a starter in the NFL next year unless the Redskins don't find a replacement.

Anderson isn't a starter. I would like to see more of him and he is improving but he isn't a starter. also most of us wanted Kamara with that pick.

Bruce has talked about building through the draft and taking care of our own players. Well... out of his 70+ players drafted while he's been here, only 12 or 13 are currently contributing to the team.

CRed, I'm not letting this one go.
Our drafts suck and I'm willing to have a televised deathmatch over this. We can go pick by pick grading players and what they are currently doing for THIS team.

I'll concede that this years draft looks good if you acknowledge that BA made a monumental screw up by letting Dallas have Pro-Bowler Demarcus Lawrence.
I will concede that if you concede either Elliot wasnt worth the 4th overall pick or cooper isnt worth next years number one or that dak isnt a franchise. Or that every team hits and misses on picks.

You dismiss quality starters on this current team and pine for that one or two special players that 31 other gms passed atleast once on. Our FO has a solid foundation on this team and effectively moves around during the draft to gain more picks and players they want. Our defensive depth is particularly good, consider we let 2 quality corners go one in a trade and one to avoid the big payday he wanted and we plugged young rookie talent in with little or no dropoff.

You may not like the players but out of those two lists and excluding ones from before BA FO they are all starter quality players other then one headcase and one running back

Last edited by CRedskinsRule; 10-22-2018 at 08:27 PM.
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Old 10-22-2018, 09:18 PM   #37
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Re: Trade Deadline Moves

Preston Smith wouldn’t start elsewhere?? Is this for real?
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Old 10-22-2018, 10:15 PM   #38
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Re: Trade Deadline Moves

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Preston Smith wouldn’t start elsewhere?? Is this for real?
Yeah that threw me off as well...

P. Smith will most definitely be a starter next year, wherever he is, and most likely a highly paid one.
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Old 10-23-2018, 12:14 AM   #39
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Re: Trade Deadline Moves

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Yeah that threw me off as well...

P. Smith will most definitely be a starter next year, wherever he is, and most likely a highly paid one.
Really, Smith disappears in about half of the games.

https://www.pro-football-reference.c...S/SmitPr00.htm
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Old 10-23-2018, 09:15 AM   #40
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Re: Trade Deadline Moves

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Preston Smith probably won't be a starter in the NFL next year unless the Redskins don't find a replacement.
Did you forget what Trent Murphy got in FA?
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Old 10-23-2018, 10:00 AM   #41
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Re: Trade Deadline Moves

Preston played really well against the Boys...Im hoping this trends up, we need him.
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Old 10-23-2018, 10:06 AM   #42
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Re: Trade Deadline Moves

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Did you forget what Trent Murphy got in FA?
by their logic, if we didn't keep him it doesn't matter, and if the player wasn't so great that we were willing to pay any price for a second contract for a 2nd or 3rd rounder than the FO missed on that pick.
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Old 10-23-2018, 10:10 AM   #43
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Re: Trade Deadline Moves

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Some people never learn. It's not a good trade at all. The guy can't catch and will want a new deal. As Matty mentioned, just draft Ridley or be patient and wait until the 19 draft. Cowboys aren't going anywhere anyway w/ Dak under center.
Had some time to roast on this. It is not great, probably still not good either, but not as bad as I thought. I figure this trade is not so much to do with Cooper, but with Prescott.

I did the math after Witten and Bryant departed in the off-season. In the previous 3 years before they left, Bryant and Witten accounted for 40% of the total passing yardage for 3 seasons. 1 with Romo, 2 with Prescott. So the front office took A LOT away from Dak. They realize they may have taken too much away.

Prescott is a 4th rounder from the 2016 draft and under the standard 4 year rookie deal. But as a 4th rounder, there is no 5th year option. In other words, he is a Free Agent in 2020. So this season is 'his' year. If he is going to get that 'Franchise QB contract' with Dallas, it will be in the off-season. Or he does not get one. Plays 2019-2020 under the last year of his rookie deal and is a UFA in 2020.

For 2018 and 2019, Cooper is set to make $700,000 for 2018 and $13.9 million in the 2019 season. Dallas inherits that deal with the trade.

So Dallas is really paying half of that $700,000 for the remainder of 2018 season to see if Dak is the guy. It is a $350,000 investment to see if you are going to gamble on Prescott as your franchise QB after this year with a $50 PLUS million dollar contract extension.

Either way, Cooper will get a contract extension in the off season. That will erase the $13.9 owed in 2019 from his previous contract and spread that extension over 5 years. So Dallas is really only in the hole $350,000 this year because half of the season he spent in Oakland.

Not worried as much now. Except if Dak ain't it (which I am convinced he is NOT), we do not have a 1st rounder in 2019 to draft a QB.

A little perspective on Coopers age. Amari Cooper is 24. This December, Calvin Ridley (the guy I wanted in the 1st round this year) Calvin Ridley turns 24. So if Dallas signs Cooper to a 5 year extension, that takes him to age 30....not bad.
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Old 10-23-2018, 10:27 AM   #44
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Re: Trade Deadline Moves

The whole problem I see with Amari Cooper, the steady trend down. Cooper is gonna want 50 mill guaranteed in an extension. Forget Dak, are you OK giving that extension to Cooper? Start there
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Old 10-23-2018, 10:29 AM   #45
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Re: Trade Deadline Moves

I do think this trade will benefit Dak. In giving him options and opening up the secondary more. Of course he has to prove he can make more accurate passes for this to pay off.
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