Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=Beemnseven;689355]^ I still think we're overplaying the idea of the 3-4. All they're talking about is incorporating it into their scheme, not a complete switch over.[/quote]

Thank you

Re: Mini camp news
 

Here's the advantages and disadvantages....

[QUOTE]
Advantage of the 3-4 Defense
The main advantage of the 3-4 defense is its linebackers and canopy effect they give to the line of scrimmage. Based 5 yards back from the play, linebackers can read the flow of the play and give pursuit. The defensive lineman are really there to take up blockers and clog the running lanes leaving the linebackers free to make the play.

The 3-4 defense also can confuse offenses as at different times a different linebacker can be lined up on the line of scrimmage to rush the passer. A number of blitz packages are also available to defensive coordinators as blitzes can come from any of the eight spots on in the defensive backfield.

Disadvantages of the 3-4 Defense
The 3-4 defense really is a personnel-based defense. If a team does not have the linebackers who have the speed and size needed or defensive linemen who cannot take up blockers , the 3-4 is very vulnerable. The result of these situations is teams playing a base 3-4 but through most of the game actually running a 4-3 defense with a linebacker used as the fourth down lineman.

The 3-4 defense is also susceptible to the inside rush. With just a nose guard to plug the middle, the inside rushing game many NFL teams use as a base offensive play. Teams running the 3-4 defense need to have a nose guard that can occupy 2 to 3 players on every down to free up the middle linebackers. In the league right now, finding a true nose guard like that is difficult because of the emphasis on speed play in the college ranks is producing fewer large bodies to be run stoppers.



Read more at Suite101: The Basics of the 3-4 Defense In Football: NFL Teams Are Moving to the Base Defense Because of Recent Success [url=http://how-to-play-football.suite101.com/article.cfm/the_basics_of_the_34_defense_in_football#ixzz0lNchiCkO]The Basics of the 3-4 Defense In Football: NFL Teams Are Moving to the Base Defense Because of Recent Success[/url]
[/QUOTE]

Otherwise, our HC wants to impliment it. nough said.

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=SmootSmack;689253]I honestly thought Rocky would be the first one to go this off-season[/quote]

Hey Smoot do you think that maybe Shanny will try to make a run @ Adalius Thomas ?? I totally forgot how bad things are between him and the Patriots and it looks like they will release him if they can't trade him. I know Rex Ryan wants him to the Jets but still Shanny and Bruce could probably convince him to come here if they wanted to and replace Rocky ?!? He was a beast back when he played for the Ravens.

[URL="http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/articles/2010/04/17/thomas_on_the_outside/?page=full"]Thomas on the outside - The Boston Globe[/URL]

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=SBXVII;689386]Here's the advantages and disadvantages....



Otherwise, our HC wants to impliment it. nough said.[/quote]

So, in essence it all boils down to having the proper personnel. Will we be able to acquire the players needed to run a 3-4 effectively or will we be basically experimenting until the players needed can be put in place?

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=Frost;689388]Hey Smoot do you think that maybe Shanny will try to make a run @ Adalius Thomas ?? I totally forgot how bad things are between him and the Patriots and it looks like they will release him if they can't trade him. I know Rex Ryan wants him to the Jets but still Shanny and Bruce could probably convince him to come here if they wanted to and replace Rocky ?!? He was a beast back when he played for the Ravens.

[URL="http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/articles/2010/04/17/thomas_on_the_outside/?page=full"]Thomas on the outside - The Boston Globe[/URL][/quote]

I suppose. Hadn't really thought about Thomas

Mike Sellers = Kratos?
 

[IMG]http://www.blogcdn.com/blog.redskins.com/media/2010/04/bmikeandmaake.jpg[/IMG][IMG]http://image3.examiner.com/images/blog/wysiwyg/image/kratos(3).jpg[/IMG]

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=Frost;689388]Hey Smoot do you think that maybe Shanny will try to make a run @ Adalius Thomas ?? I totally forgot how bad things are between him and the Patriots and it looks like they will release him if they can't trade him. I know Rex Ryan wants him to the Jets but still Shanny and Bruce could probably convince him to come here if they wanted to and replace Rocky ?!? He was a beast back when he played for the Ravens.

[URL="http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/articles/2010/04/17/thomas_on_the_outside/?page=full"]Thomas on the outside - The Boston Globe[/URL][/quote]


I would love that move. Thomas seems like a team guy with something to prove. Obviously, he fits the system.

Re: Mini camp news
 

AT just needs a change and I think if he ends up anywhere it's going to be w/ the Jets.

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;689425]I would love that move. Thomas seems like a team guy with something to prove. Obviously, he fits the system.[/quote]

Can Thomas play Inside Linebacker because I actually think we're well off at OLB with Wilson and Orakpo as well as Alexander to play back up.

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;689448]

Can Thomas play Inside Linebacker because I actually think we're well off at OLB with Wilson and Orakpo as well as Alexander to play back up.[/quote]


Naww, we're not well off at OLB. If we can get Thomas, we need to make that happen.

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;689315]Laron looks like a comic book character! Obviously he hasn't been sitting on his ass like most of the people who want to dump him for a bag of peanuts...[/quote]

Well if the peanuts can atleast cover a WR and they come cheap I'm on board. ;)

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=Longtimefan;689394]So, in essence it all boils down to having the proper personnel. Will we be able to acquire the players needed to run a 3-4 effectively or will we be basically experimenting until the players needed can be put in place?[/quote]

I understand you concern but the same thing could be said of the OL.

I think it all depends on like everyone else is saying are we soley running the 3-4? If we were then we might be screwed. If we are going to slowly grow into a 3-4 through the yrs but start off with some semblence of a 4-3 / 3-4 hybrid and incorporate other scheme's then I think we will be fine. There is no doubt we have talented guys. The doubt is them understanding their roll or lanes or coverage.

Re: Mini camp news
 

It's going to be interesting to see what the offensive line finally looks like. Joe Bugel was a great guy and I hate to badmouth him, but we needed another person in that role. He was good in the '80's, but somehow he just couldn't connect with the linemen of today's generation. Stephon Heyer should be a monster on the line. So I have to ask if it's just the coaching...

I don't know about Rocky...maybe Shanahan doesn't even want him.

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;689448]Can Thomas play Inside Linebacker because I actually think we're well off at OLB with Wilson and Orakpo as well as Alexander to play back up.[/quote]

Can Thomas play ILB, yeah he could, but in his first year with new england, Belichick moved him from ILB to OLB, which is what Baltimore used AT as. Baltimores LB's used to be Suggs, Scott, Lewis, Thomas...That's a pretty damn good core group of LB's.

Re: Mini camp news
 

Redskins general manager Bruce Allen said on Saturday that he was “very satisfied” with player attendance at this weekend’s mini-camp
Allen acknowledged that Albert Haynesworth was not in attendance at the mini-camp, [B][I]b[/I][/B][B][I]ut he said that was not a concern[/I][/B].

“[B][I]It’s voluntary,” Allen[/I][/B] said.[url=http://www.redskins.com/gen/articles/Allen_Encouraged_With_First_Mini_Camp_112974.jsp]Allen Encouraged With First Mini-Camp[/url]

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=SBXVII;689473]I understand you concern but the same thing could be said of the OL.

I think it all depends on like everyone else is saying are we soley running the 3-4? If we were then we might be screwed. If we are going to slowly grow into a 3-4 through the yrs but start off with some semblence of a 4-3 / 3-4 hybrid and incorporate other scheme's then I think we will be fine. There is no doubt we have talented guys. The doubt is them understanding their roll or lanes or coverage.[/quote]

When you talk about moving DT's & DE's to the LB position, that's the beginning of an experiment and you have no idea how it's going to play out. Naturally you hope it works out for the best, but that's a huge learning curve for even the most experienced player. If that was ever a plan they had actually considered implementing, I hope they scrap it unless it includes no more than one player.

Re: Mini camp news
 

This whole 3-4 thing has all the makings of the Adam Archuletta fiasco times 3, and the Landry to Free Safety move. Putting players out of their normal learned position to fit a scheme is a recipe for disaster in my opinion. Some guys can take to it and excel, but far too many get lost and become liabilities.

Whatever happened to: "We will put our players in the best position, to utilize their talents, to make plays. We will not play a 4-3 or a 3-4 defense, we will play a Redskin Defense."

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=jdc65;689501]This whole 3-4 thing has all the makings of the Adam Archuletta fiasco times 3, and the Landry to Free Safety move. Putting players out of their normal learned position to fit a scheme is a recipe for disaster in my opinion. Some guys can take to it and excel, but far too many get lost and become liabilities.

Whatever happened to: "We will put our players in the best position, to utilize their talents, to make plays. We will not play a 4-3 or a 3-4 defense, we will play a Redskin Defense."[/quote]
The Packers did the same thing and it worked really well. They lost some players like Aaron Kampman, but there defense was much better.

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=jdc65;689501]This whole 3-4 thing has all the makings of the Adam Archuletta fiasco times 3, and the Landry to Free Safety move. Putting players out of their normal learned position to fit a scheme is a recipe for disaster in my opinion. Some guys can take to it and excel, but far too many get lost and become liabilities.

Whatever happened to: "We will put our players in the best position, to utilize their talents, to make plays. We will not play a 4-3 or a 3-4 defense, we will play a Redskin Defense."[/quote]

The Landry to FS move though did work. It didn't start to go downhill until Blache became the D-Coordinator. If Haslet can use Landry in the same way GW did as a center fielder in an aggresive scheme then I would be very hesitant to move Landry.

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=jdc65;689501]This whole 3-4 thing has all the makings of the Adam Archuletta fiasco times 3, and the Landry to Free Safety move. Putting players out of their normal learned position to fit a scheme is a recipe for disaster in my opinion. Some guys can take to it and excel, but far too many get lost and become liabilities.

[B]Whatever happened to: "We will put our players in the best position, to utilize their talents, to make plays. We will not play a 4-3 or a 3-4 defense, we will play a Redskin Defense.[/B]"[/quote]

nothing has happened to it, the season hasn't even started yet.

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;689505]The Landry to FS move though did work. It didn't start to go downhill until Blache became the D-Coordinator. If Haslet can use Landry in the same way GW did as a center fielder in an aggresive scheme then I would be very hesitant to move Landry.[/quote]

I agree with you Dirt. After Sean died Landry moved to the FS position, and in GW's last game as D Coordinator ( playoff game in Seattle ) Landry had 2 interceptions. Once Blache came into power LL has been used improperly and out of position.

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=JLee9718;689483]It's going to be interesting to see what the offensive line finally looks like. Joe Bugel was a great guy and I hate to badmouth him, but we needed another person in that role. He was good in the '80's, but somehow he just couldn't connect with the linemen of today's generation. Stephon Heyer should be a monster on the line. So I have to ask if it's just the coaching...

I don't know about Rocky...maybe Shanahan doesn't even want him.[/quote]

I am amused at some of your comments made here. How odd that Joe Bugel was a good coach when the GIBBS Skins were making the playoffs but as soon as Campbell and Zorn take over, Bugel developed Alzheimers.
ha, ha, ha, ha, ha ,ha this stuff is good comedy material from you guys.

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=Beemnseven;689355]^ I still think we're overplaying the idea of the 3-4. All they're talking about is incorporating it into their scheme, not a complete switch over.[/quote]
I think that the plan is to have it switched sooner than later. Apparently the upcoming LBs and DL we've talked to have been told we're running 3-4. I think that it will be the primary formation, though I'm sure we'll move Orakpo and crew to the line plenty

Re: Mini camp news
 

I know it is early, but comments from players and 'anonymous sources' indicate it will be a 3-4 defense. Judging by Haynesworth and McIntosh holdouts and comments and 2nd hand Carter rumors, the D will be scheme based, not player based. In other words, a Blache defense, only 3-4. There is a function for every position in the scheme, perform that function, and don't go outside those parameters. Haslett has a rep for not being player friendly.

I like the 3-4, and think that is where the NFL is going, but forcing it is detrimental in my opinion. Also, Haslett is not the innovative game-planner and game-caller that I was hoping for. I have serious reservations about the direction we are heading defensively.

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=JLee9718;689483]It's going to be interesting to see what the offensive line finally looks like. Joe Bugel was a great guy and I hate to badmouth him, but we needed another person in that role. He was good in the '80's, but somehow he just couldn't connect with the linemen of today's generation. Stephon Heyer should be a monster on the line. So I have to ask if it's just the coaching...

I don't know about Rocky...maybe Shanahan doesn't even want him.[/quote]


Dude, I will freely admit that I am overly nostalgic but Stephon Heyer is not a monster, he probably shouldn't be on the team. He doesn't know the snap count and he is, has been and will be a turnstile. I know he is a hard worker and I even think he deserves a roster spot but he is a backup not a monster.

Bugel took year after year of lines ignored in the draft and made them respectable. I would even guess that the FO cut Bridges and asked Bugel to turn Chicken s--- into salad with Batiste, montgomery, Williams, heyer and whatever other square pegs were pushed into round holes last year.

Do not forget that our offense didn't look like an NFL one until Zorn was castrated.

Re: Mini camp news
 

Portis has been cleared to practice.

[url=http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5106225]Washington Redskins' Clinton Portis cleared to play after concussion - ESPN[/url]

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=jdc65;689571]I know it is early, but comments from players and 'anonymous sources' indicate it will be a 3-4 defense. Judging by Haynesworth and McIntosh holdouts and comments and 2nd hand Carter rumors, the D will be scheme based, not player based. In other words, a Blache defense, only 3-4. There is a function for every position in the scheme, perform that function, and don't go outside those parameters. Haslett has a rep for not being player friendly.

I like the 3-4, and think that is where the NFL is going, but forcing it is detrimental in my opinion. Also, Haslett is not the innovative game-planner and game-caller that I was hoping for. I have serious reservations about the direction we are heading defensively.[/quote]

I agree. I have really liked what a couple people have mentioned. Play the defense as a 4-3 this year, use the picks and free agents to get our mediocre offense up to speed and then begin the 3-4 shift next year if that is the way Shanny wants to go. I think its absolutely crazy to want to try and remake both sides of the ball with limited picks and a bad free ageny pool due to the CBA being gone. I realize Shanny is trying to put his stamp on everything but it seems like all he is doing is creating havoc and pissing players off and getting them to want to go somewhere else. I hope this is all apart of this "long term plan" I keep hearing about....

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;689328][quote=Longtimefan;689312]

We will get decent compensation for JC and AH. No first rounders but maybe a 2nd rounder or two for each. That to me isn't to shabby. AH was the dumbest acquisition that Snyder has ever done for the money he paid out. Even the Bruce Smith deal wasn't half as bad as that. It makes me wonder if the McNabb deal is going to be worth it.[/quote]

hahaha you are high off your ass if you think we are getting a "2nd rounder or two for each". We'll be lucky to get anything higher than a 5th for JC and even a 3rd for AH is better than what we've been hearing let alone multiple 2nd rounders

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;689505]The Landry to FS move though did work. It didn't start to go downhill until Blache became the D-Coordinator. If Haslet can use Landry in the same way GW did as a center fielder in an aggresive scheme then I would be very hesitant to move Landry.[/quote]

I wouldn't say Landry's move worked. I don't care that Landry was or was not a FS in college. He's better suited for the SS spot. When we had ST and Landry as SS the team played lights out. After losing ST and forcing Landry to make the move to FS we have had problems. Namely Landry can't cover sideline to sideline. We need someone quicker and more agile. Secondly we need someone who won't bite on a double move.

I'd pick up a FS somewhere FA or draft, perhaps late, and move Landry back to SS or trade Landry for picks and keep Doughty and Horton as SS.

Re: Mini camp news
 

pics from yesterday via [URL="http://blog.redskins.com/2010/04/17/minicamp-day-2-in-photo-form/"]Matt Terl's blog[/URL]

[IMG]http://redskinsblog.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/09-shanahandevin.jpghttp://redskinsblog.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/09-shanahandevin.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://redskinsblog.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/08-mcnabbscrambles.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://redskinsblog.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/01-running.jpg[/IMG]

Re: Mini camp news
 

[IMG]http://redskinsblog.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/09-shanahandevin.jpg[/IMG]

Re: Mini camp news
 

I was watching that mini-camp video posted on ESPN.com. They mentioned that Devin Thomas dropped a long ball by McNabb. I don't know why everyone is so high on him. He reminds me of Rob Gardner 2.0.

Re: Mini camp news
 

DT has better hands than Gardner, no question.

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=Mattyk;689665]DT has better hands than Gardner, no question.[/quote]

Seriously. One drop in a mini camp and he's Rod Gardner? Nah. I think DT will really blossom this year. He came on so strong last year down the stretch before that ankle sprain. He's entering that 3rd year where a lot of young WR's take that next step up. Throw in a McNabb and a proven offense, and I think he's got a legit chance to be our #1 all year.

Wouldn't that make you so happy, GTripp? :)

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=rbanerjee23;689601]

hahaha you are high off your ass if you think we are getting a "2nd rounder or two for each". We'll be lucky to get anything higher than a 5th for JC and even a 3rd for AH is better than what we've been hearing let alone multiple 2nd rounders[/quote]

if we trade ah for draft picks and get anything short of a 1st rounder or a 2nd and another round we will be getting a terrible deal, who ever gets ah is getting him at half price we aleady paid him around 30 mil out of around 42, if we trade him for a 3rd alone that would be one of the most insane trades in the history of the nfl imo

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=Kalisto2010;689660]I was watching that mini-camp video posted on ESPN.com. They mentioned that Devin Thomas dropped a long ball by McNabb. I don't know why everyone is so high on him. He reminds me of Rob Gardner 2.0.[/quote]

it's freakin mini camp. jeez.

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=GMScud;689666]Seriously. One drop in a mini camp and he's Rod Gardner? Nah. I think DT will really blossom this year. He came on so strong last year down the stretch before that ankle sprain. He's entering that 3rd year where a lot of young WR's take that next step up. [B]Throw in a McNabb and a proven offense[/B], and I think he's got a legit chance to be our #1 all year.

Wouldn't that make you so happy, GTripp? :)[/quote]

seriously, no knock on jc, but he isn't mcnabb. mcnabb is a proven leader and pro bowler who can make receivers that aren't very good look good. i think dt is poised to have a break out year, i just don't have the same feeling about kelly, he just seems to have to much keyshawn in him for my liking but time will tell. and not to mention we should be able to make it through this entire year without swapping play callers mid season

Re: Mini camp news
 

[quote=mlmdub130;689669]seriously, no knock on jc, but he isn't mcnabb. mcnabb is a proven leader and pro bowler who can make receivers that aren't very good look good. i think dt is poised to have a break out year, i just don't have the same feeling about kelly, [B]he just seems to have to much keyshawn in him [/B]for my liking but time will tell. and not to mention we should be able to make it through this entire year without swapping play callers mid season[/quote]

In what way?

Re: Mini camp news
 

i"ve just heard a few different quotes from him about when they get me the ball, and if they get me involved more, this is what will happen. he said it a couple times last year after he had a decnt game i feel like it was towards the end of the year when dt was out. i just don't get a good vibe from him maybe it's just me. dt just seems to be more of a worker

Re: Mini camp news
 

[QUOTE]“Learning curve? It’s football,” the former Oklahoma standout said Monday. “It’s not really as hard as it seems.”[/QUOTE]

just crap like that i guess, this was from dec 08 but i just feel like thats his attitude towards the game