Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=AnonEmouse;1277757]If we draft WR would you go for a speed or size? Can't help thinking that Gandy-Golden and Cam Sims offer the size option (and I like what Sims showed later last season), so we should go for another blazer opposite McLaurin. We really need to be able to stretch the field more consistently to help the run game if nothing else.

I'd agree with waiting until rd2+ to pick a WR unless the guy is BPA when we pick at #19. We don't have a big sample set but we haven't had success with 1st round WR's since Art Monk![/quote]

You go for the guy that can run routes and catch and loves the game and will work to get better. WRs usually take a bit for the lights to come on.

Two blazers with no size, I'm not sure. I think you need a true #1WR, speed AND size. Problem with our big guys is they are slow or don't consistently run good routes and make catches. Speed is also a relative term, lot of big guys are long striders but not quick, can't get open on short routes consistently especially against tall press corners.

LT and WR we have guys that could in theory become quality starters, but do you stand pat and gamble on potential? Probably not.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=Scalper;1278033][B]Not so sure on Miami. [/B]I don't think Jones makes it past Patriots. Belicheat takes him in a heartbeat there, methinks.

From 10-18 picks, number of teams with QB solved, and also number of teams with starting QBs that could look to improve. How much do Vikes believe in Cousins? Niners in never-healthy Garrop? You really want him, other teams I mean, you need to trade up over other teams who also want him, so teams make sure they are moving up high enough to actually get him. I think there could be a lot of action to trade into 14 before Pats if Jones on board. Anywhere between 10 and 14. Also, keep in mind, mock draft Homers also often rank QBs different than pro scouts. Jones could easily be gone top-10.

I would favor taking him at #19 if there, but seriously doubt he will be. I think if you bring Jones in and give him massive reps in camp, he is immediately better year one than Smith or Allen, even a healthy Smith. Hein the X factor. Then ideally take Ramsey later in draft, and have Jones, Ramsey, Hein. THat'll never happen because Jones won't be there at 19 and RR will want a safety valve, a proven veteran with a known floor.[/quote]

Yeah, I didn't say Jones wouldn't get taken before that. I'm just saying if he's still there at #18, that's a likely spot for a team in the 20s to move up to pick him.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

I'm not suggesting we need a running QB, but we need a mobile one. Unless we can rebuild the OL in one season (and being in mind Scherff might only be here 1 more year max), we need a guy who can extend passing plays, not just takes off running every time. A Mahomes/Wilson type, not Jackson.

OTOH if RR and Turner think they can scheme up protection improvements in the meantime, and ANYONE will be be more mobile than Smith (hell, a pot plant would be more mobile), then maybe Jones is a good answer if he can move around a bit. I'm just conscious of putting a static rookie back there and breaking him a la Burrow.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

Kiper has Mac Jones going #8 in fact he has all 5 going top 10..

I do not see that happening.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[QUOTE=skinsfaninok;1278049]Kiper has Mac Jones going #8 in fact he has all 5 going top 10..



I do not see that happening.[/QUOTE]



No fucking way. Lol. He is getting too cute. Probably because he is always wrong. I have a gut feeling Jones is going to be there at 19 and we are going to pick him. Then I will hold my breath for a couple years to see if we finally got our guy....again.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1278049]Kiper has Mac Jones going #8 in fact he has all 5 going top 10..

I do not see that happening.[/quote]

That is so crazy...and possible.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=AnonEmouse;1278040]I'm not suggesting we need a running QB, but we need a mobile one. Unless we can rebuild the OL in one season (and being in mind Scherff might only be here 1 more year max), we need a guy who can extend passing plays, not just takes off running every time. A Mahomes/Wilson type, not Jackson.

OTOH if RR and Turner think they can scheme up protection improvements in the meantime, and ANYONE will be be more mobile than Smith (hell, a pot plant would be more mobile), then maybe Jones is a good answer if he can move around a bit. I'm just conscious of putting a static rookie back there and breaking him a la Burrow.[/quote]

Your “pot plant” comment is out of bounds. This individual gave up his right leg playing for your team, and played heroically when pressed into emergency because we literally had no one else to play.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

Why is that out of bounds? He's just drawing a fairly accurate analogy.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[QUOTE=SCRedskinsFan;1278052]Your “pot plant” comment is out of bounds. This individual gave up his right leg playing for your team, and played heroically when pressed into emergency because we literally had no one else to play.[/QUOTE]



Do you only come on here to police people’s posts or do you ever actually have anything to say?

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1278054]Do you only come on here to police people’s posts or do you ever actually have anything to say?[/quote]

Feel free to disagree with me regarding the potted plant comment. I thought it was an insult to a guy who literally gave his right leg to the franchise. As to the “policing” nonsense, to each their own.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

Try reading some other posts. I applauded AS for coming back and competing, let alone starting.

But he isn't even remotely mobile, especially compared to how he could move pre-injury. Its just a fact, whether he admits it or not, he can't move in the pocket and is therefore a liability. I'd put money on him being gone 1st June.

If I wanted to be insulting I'd have compared him to a boulder. At least a pot plant shows motion in a draft.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=AnonEmouse;1278040]I'm not suggesting we need a running QB, but we need a mobile one. Unless we can rebuild the OL in one season (and being in mind Scherff might only be here 1 more year max), we need a guy who can extend passing plays, not just takes off running every time. A Mahomes/Wilson type, not Jackson.

OTOH if RR and Turner think they can scheme up protection improvements in the meantime, and ANYONE will be be more mobile than Smith (hell, a pot plant would be more mobile), then maybe Jones is a good answer if he can move around a bit. I'm just conscious of putting a static rookie back there and breaking him a la Burrow.[/quote]

Running and mobile are synonyms. Your QB spends much time outside the pocket, he gets creamed eventually, period. You need a pocket QB with pocket presence, who has the gift of sensing pressure and eluding it without taking off running, stepping up to get the pass off or throw it away. You don't draft the wrong sort of QB long term because of short term blocking problems. Everyone is enamoured of mobile running QBs, but year in year out the guys winning it and making deep playoff runs are pocket passers.

Wilson only won SB with one of most stacked Ds of all time. Mahomes has been banged up since he started running more. I think he was WAY more injured in SB than he let on. No excuses, Bucs won, but Mahomes mechanics seemed off all game.

Your focus in drafting a QB should be his accuracy, arm strength, and ability to generally throw the ball, not his ability to play RB, period. You can't have your QB taking hits from 250 LBs and 275-300 LB DL. The QB that doesn't get hurt is the one that can go through his progressions fast and has pocket presence, and that does NOT mean the ability to run real fast outside the pocket. RBs get hurt more than most any other position, why would you use your QB, the hardest position in all of sports to fill, as one? Most running QBs have never demonstrated an ability to go through progressions and elude the rush WITHIN the pocket, which is one reason bust rates are sky-high in recent years. You draft a guy who does things in college that don't equate with pro success and then express amazement when your QB can't ever really read a D, go through progressions fast, and get the ball out fast. Jones has a PROVEN ability to do the things that great NFL pocket passers do, but I still don't love his arm strength. Jones is a no brainer versus most of the other prospects everyone rates higher.

Burrow had nothing approaching elite athleticism. He was not worthy of the #1 pick. That being said, sucks anyone gets injured that bad. You need an OC who runs a system that maximizes talent rather than forcing the system he loves. In the final analysis, you have to draft a QB and protect him, but you can't let lack of protection warp the way you evaluate long term prospects of success of a QB. EVERY QB who has won more than one SB in salary cap era is a pocket passer. There is not one exception. Running QBs are a fad, nothing more.

If you refuse to draft a QB who has not flourished for at least two years in a pro style system, and demand that such a QB have natural accuracy, natural pocket presence, and the intelligence to read Ds coming out of school (not learning it later as a projection) bust rates plummet. A HUGE percentage of the highly drafted QB busts are running QBs or system college QBs with NO experience in reading Ds or pro Os. Just because everyone espouses something doesn't make it sensible, and the opposite is usually true. Don't believe the hype about running QBs. One other problem with them is much shorter shelf life. They lose a step and then run out of the pocket, as they age, they get KILLED.

Again, it won't matter. Jones will be gone by the time we pick methinks. Long gone.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=SCRedskinsFan;1278052]Your “pot plant” comment is out of bounds. This individual gave up his right leg playing for your team, and played heroically when pressed into emergency because we literally had no one else to play.[/quote]

He is paid $20M+ a year for a profession he knowingly chose, including the risks. I would never want anyone to lose a leg playing football, but it is a dangerous game and no one put a gun to Smith's head and forced him to play. He is a shell of his former self in terms of playing skills. No one will ever dispute Smith's character, he is a stellar human being, but he has always been a mediocre QB at best. Assessing extremely high-paid players based on their physical gifts and limitations is not out of bounds, it comes with the territory. Enough of the PC police. Try reading the first amendment. Enough of the censorship in this country. The people I want to have the right to speak the most are those whose views I find the most offensive, because without that freedom you have tyranny. Who made you the omniscient arbitrator of what is in and out of bounds? Move to Russia or China, Comrade.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=Scalper;1278080]Running and mobile are synonyms. Your QB spends much time outside the pocket, he gets creamed eventually, period. You need a pocket QB with pocket presence, who has the gift of sensing pressure and eluding it without taking off running, stepping up to get the pass off or throw it away. You don't draft the wrong sort of QB long term because of short term blocking problems. Everyone is enamoured of mobile running QBs, but year in year out the guys winning it and making deep playoff runs are pocket passers.

Wilson only won SB with one of most stacked Ds of all time. Mahomes has been banged up since he started running more. I think he was WAY more injured in SB than he let on. No excuses, Bucs won, but Mahomes mechanics seemed off all game.

Your focus in drafting a QB should be his accuracy, arm strength, and ability to generally throw the ball, not his ability to play RB, period. You can't have your QB taking hits from 250 LBs and 275-300 LB DL. The QB that doesn't get hurt is the one that can go through his progressions fast and has pocket presence, and that does NOT mean the ability to run real fast outside the pocket. RBs get hurt more than most any other position, why would you use your QB, the hardest position in all of sports to fill, as one? Most running QBs have never demonstrated an ability to go through progressions and elude the rush WITHIN the pocket, which is one reason bust rates are sky-high in recent years. You draft a guy who does things in college that don't equate with pro success and then express amazement when your QB can't ever really read a D, go through progressions fast, and get the ball out fast. Jones has a PROVEN ability to do the things that great NFL pocket passers do, but I still don't love his arm strength. Jones is a no brainer versus most of the other prospects everyone rates higher.

Burrow had nothing approaching elite athleticism. He was not worthy of the #1 pick. That being said, sucks anyone gets injured that bad. You need an OC who runs a system that maximizes talent rather than forcing the system he loves. In the final analysis, you have to draft a QB and protect him, but you can't let lack of protection warp the way you evaluate long term prospects of success of a QB. EVERY QB who has won more than one SB in salary cap era is a pocket passer. There is not one exception. Running QBs are a fad, nothing more.

If you refuse to draft a QB who has not flourished for at least two years in a pro style system, and demand that such a QB have natural accuracy, natural pocket presence, and the intelligence to read Ds coming out of school (not learning it later as a projection) bust rates plummet. A HUGE percentage of the highly drafted QB busts are running QBs or system college QBs with NO experience in reading Ds or pro Os. Just because everyone espouses something doesn't make it sensible, and the opposite is usually true. Don't believe the hype about running QBs. One other problem with them is much shorter shelf life. They lose a step and then run out of the pocket, as they age, they get KILLED.

Again, it won't matter. Jones will be gone by the time we pick methinks. Long gone.[/quote]

There is such a huge fallacy here with regards to "running quarterbacks"
QBs get injured on designed runs 1 out of every 236 plays. A QB that scrambles gets injured the same rate as a QB that gets sacked once out of every 92 plays. The worst is the knockdown when a QB is taken down while planting and throwing once every 67 plays. That was in 2018. John Varros compiled the data for Sports Info Solutions in 2018 and in 2019 compiled this data: [url]https://twitter.com/VerrosJohn/status/1262483721602699271[/url]

Furthermore there are degrees of mobility. Brady looks like a rushing QB when compared to Manning. One is far more comfortable with moving the pocket both had significant injuries during their career. Everybody wants a pro ready QB but we shouldn't discount one that can move too.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=Scalper;1278083]He is paid $20M+ a year for a profession he knowingly chose, including the risks. I would never want anyone to lose a leg playing football, but it is a dangerous game and no one put a gun to Smith's head and forced him to play. He is a shell of his former self in terms of playing skills. No one will ever dispute Smith's character, he is a stellar human being, but he has always been a mediocre QB at best. Assessing extremely high-paid players based on their physical gifts and limitations is not out of bounds, it comes with the territory. Enough of the PC police. Try reading the first amendment. Enough of the censorship in this country. The people I want to have the right to speak the most are those whose views I find the most offensive, because without that freedom you have tyranny. Who made you the omniscient arbitrator of what is in and out of bounds? Move to Russia or China, Comrade.[/quote]

OK, enough of this crap. My opinion is that the “potted plant” comment was offensive. Actually I said “out of bounds”. I never said or implied that it was somehow illegal or against any rules, so don’t give me your first amendment lecture. Expressing an opinion is what these boards are all about, and in your short tenure here you have certainly gotten an ample opportunity to express yours.

And speaking of offensive, the last line of your post speaks for itself.