Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=AnonEmouse;1278143][URL="https://www.nfl.com/news/charley-casserly-2021-nfl-mock-draft-1-0-justin-fields-slides-to-steelers"]https://www.nfl.com/news/charley-casserly-2021-nfl-mock-draft-1-0-justin-fields-slides-to-steelers[/URL]

I like the idea of Fields and Jones sliding down to/past #19 (though I'm not sure anyone rates Lance as better than Fields...), but if that were to happen would we seriously overlook 2 potential franchise QB's in favour of a LB? Can't see that happening.[/quote]

I don’t know. I’ve seen some stuff out there that says that Fields have difficulty reading defenses and has a high number of plays that he’s firing to his 1st read instead of being able to work through his progressions. I see Lance as a Josh Allen 2.0. He may be raw but has a HUGE talent and athleticism ceiling. Allen surged in year two. Lance may follow the same trajectory. I personally would rather have Lance over Fields. But I doubt we get either. We would be more like to get Mac Jones, and although I think he will be a solid QB, his lack of mobility will not translate well to our current offensive scheme.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=Ruhskins;1278164]Also, in what universe is Rodgers considered a pocket passer?[/quote]

The same universe in which Smith wasn’t mobile 5 years ago

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

The crap against Fields is just that, crap. He played in a system that was designed to get the first read open and make sure that open receiver was hit with the pass. It is not that he can't "read" secondary or third receivers. It is that OSU's system is designed to maximize the potential to hit the first read. But Fields is very, very intelligent, extremely self critical and willing to sacrifice himself for the best for the team. He is a strong leader and very mature. He is completely unlike Haskins. Fields will make the adjustment to the NFL. He will be willing to watch hours and hours of film. But there is not chance that he will be available at 19. I think it is highly likely he will go to Atlanta at No. 4.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=Ohioskins;1278180]The crap against Fields is just that, crap. He played in a system that was designed to get the first read open and make sure that open receiver was hit with the pass. It is not that he can't "read" secondary or third receivers. It is that OSU's system is designed to maximize the potential to hit the first read. But Fields is very, very intelligent, extremely self critical and willing to sacrifice himself for the best for the team. He is a strong leader and very mature. He is completely unlike Haskins. Fields will make the adjustment to the NFL. He will be willing to watch hours and hours of film. But there is not chance that he will be available at 19. I think it is highly likely he will go to Atlanta at No. 4.[/quote]

I’ve always felt that’s what makes college QBs so hard to judge. Figuring out what they CAN do vs what they were asked to do in college. I think Fields and Jones are in the same boat there.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=BaltimoreSkins;1278136]Give me your data and we can have a discussion about it. But once again I love how you lump everyone in as either a pocket passer or a running qb with out recognizing a continuum. How can you seriously lump in Rodgers and Manning in the same category? It is absurd.[/quote]

Rodgers is more mobile than Manning, but Rodgers primarily sits in pocket and tries to read the D and make throws. No, they aren't identical creatures, yes there is a continuum, but both are primarily pocket passers. My data is the simple bottom-line result: every QB who has won 2+ SBs in salary cap era is a pocket passing QB.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=Ohioskins;1278180]The crap against Fields is just that, crap. He played in a system that was designed to get the first read open and make sure that open receiver was hit with the pass. It is not that he can't "read" secondary or third receivers. It is that OSU's system is designed to maximize the potential to hit the first read. But Fields is very, very intelligent, extremely self critical and willing to sacrifice himself for the best for the team. He is a strong leader and very mature. He is completely unlike Haskins. Fields will make the adjustment to the NFL. He will be willing to watch hours and hours of film. But there is not chance that he will be available at 19. I think it is highly likely he will go to Atlanta at No. 4.[/quote]

Maybe, maybe not. Until a guy has read Ds successfully in a pro system, it is a projection. He played in a system that was not a true pro system which required him to read Ds and go through progressions, in other words. He played in a system that is nothing like the pros. I'm not hating on Fields, but you don't know he can read pro Ds because his college system never asked him to. He made easy passes to wide open receivers who were usually MUCH more talented than their defenders. That doesn't mean he sucks, but it means he will be in an environment in the pros COMPLETELY different than that in college. You can't ever assume someone will easily succeed in that transition. Some guys make the transition, some bust, even the total experts aren't sure why. Sure, not being a lazy turd like Haskins helps, but some guys watch all the film in the world and still never make the transition. It is HARD, which is why franchise QBs are rare. What is certain is that you GREATLY decrease your chance of having a QB bust by drafting one who already played in a pro-style system.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=SkinzWin;1278171]I don’t know. I’ve seen some stuff out there that says that Fields have difficulty reading defenses and has a high number of plays that he’s firing to his 1st read instead of being able to work through his progressions. I see Lance as a Josh Allen 2.0. He may be raw but has a HUGE talent and athleticism ceiling. Allen surged in year two. Lance may follow the same trajectory. I personally would rather have Lance over Fields. But I doubt we get either. We would be more like to get Mac Jones, and although I think he will be a solid QB, his lack of mobility will not translate well to our current offensive scheme.[/quote]

Then adapt the scheme. That is what great coaches do, get the most out of players by maximizing utilization of their strengths.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=BaltimoreSkins;1278175]The same universe in which Smith wasn’t mobile 5 years ago[/quote]

He wasn't. Mobile or not, Smith never lived up to his high draft status. He has been an above average QB at absolute best, played on some solid teams but never elevated them and never came up big in playoffs when it counted most. Trading for him was horrible. He is again a stellar human being, but a thoroughly average QB. The worst thing about him is he is Cousins 2.0, Captain checkdown, lacks the killer instinct to go for the big play. You're not beating Mahomes or other great QBs with a QB with that mentality. Sooner he is off the roster, the better, even if he was never injured.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

I agree Scalper. Smith is a great human being. but he was at his best not much more than a slightly above average QB.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=Scalper;1278199]Then adapt the scheme. That is what great coaches do, get the most out of players by maximizing utilization of their strengths.[/quote]

I agree but I think you and I both know that more coaches than not in the NFL run a “system” and work to make the player fit their scheme instead of build something around the player that maximizes their skill set. Too many big egos in the NFL.

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

My first crack at a mock draft for 2021, basically just went bpa

19: R1 P19 QB Justin Fields - Ohio State
51: R2 P19 TE Hunter Long - Boston College
74: R3 P10 G Jackson Carman - Clemson
82: R3 P18 LB Jabril Cox - LSU
124: R4 P19 RB Jaret Patterson - Buffalo
164: R5 P19 CB Shawn Davis - Florida
243: R7 P17 WR Jhamon Ausbon - Texas A&M
245: R7 P19 LB Justin Hilliard - Ohio State

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=MTK;1278514]My first crack at a mock draft for 2021, basically just went bpa

19: R1 P19 QB Justin Fields - Ohio State
51: R2 P19 TE Hunter Long - Boston College
74: R3 P10 G Jackson Carman - Clemson
82: R3 P18 LB Jabril Cox - LSU
124: R4 P19 RB Jaret Patterson - Buffalo
164: R5 P19 CB Shawn Davis - Florida
243: R7 P17 WR Jhamon Ausbon - Texas A&M
245: R7 P19 LB Justin Hilliard - Ohio State[/quote]

Hmmm looks like you found Scherff's replacement

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

[quote=MTK;1278514]My first crack at a mock draft for 2021, basically just went bpa

19: R1 P19 QB Justin Fields - Ohio State
51: R2 P19 TE Hunter Long - Boston College
74: R3 P10 G Jackson Carman - Clemson
82: R3 P18 LB Jabril Cox - LSU
124: R4 P19 RB Jaret Patterson - Buffalo
164: R5 P19 CB Shawn Davis - Florida
243: R7 P17 WR Jhamon Ausbon - Texas A&M
245: R7 P19 LB Justin Hilliard - Ohio State[/quote]

Sign me up for Hunter Long. Not familiar with picks 124 thru 245. Some new guys to look up. The best thing about mocks. #knowledgeispower

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

Courtesy of the PFN Mock Draft Simulator

19. Rashod Bateman WR Minnesota
51. Asante Samuel Jr. CB Florida State
74. Brevin Jordan TE Miami (FL)
82. Walker Little OT Stanford
124. Kyle Trask QB Florida
164. Larry Rountree III RB Missouri
243. K.J. Britt LB Auburn
245. Tre Walker WR San Jose State

Re: The Too Soon 2021 NFL Draft Thread
 

I did my own with the PFN simulator, accepting trade offer for #19:

32. Kadarius Toney WR Florida
51. Richie Grant S UCF
67. Dylan Moses LB Alabama
74. Josh Myers OC Ohio State
82. Hunter Long TE Boston College
124. Jamie Newman QB Georgia
148. Paulson Adebo CB Stanford
164. Jaelon Darden WR North Texas
243. Brenden Jaimes OT Nebraska
245. Tommy Kraemer OG Notre Dame