Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=mooby;1275424]We don't have to pretend like that cap space is a set-in-stone object. We have execs that can move money around, create cap space by restructuring or releasing players, so I'm not worried about the financial aspect of it. I'm just worried about the price to pay. If the price is too steep, Ron needs to bounce. Let's not fool ourselves into thinking we're one piece away from contending, this team still needs serious help at multiple spots. Unfortunately we had the luck of playing in a division so terrible 7-9 won it, but any other year 7-9 would be considered "progress, but not title contention." Somehow we've fooled ourselves into thinking we're a couple pieces away from contending. There's no Tom Brady to fall into our lap this year.[/quote]


I dont think we are one or two pieces of title contender, but are we one or two pieces away from division favorite? If one of those pieces is a QB I believe so, its that I get the feeling that for some of us we might as well have been 3-13 again

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=mredskins;1275359]It was for 5 quarters! TH is a journey man at best. He is not like some 3rd round pick we got and he is 21 just starting out.

Look at his "career":
[B]December 8, 2020: Washington Football Team added QB Taylor Heinicke to the practice squad.

August 30, 2019: Carolina Panthers cut QB Taylor Heinicke.

December 26, 2018: Carolina Panthers placed QB Taylor Heinicke on IR.

April 16, 2018: Carolina Panthers acquired QB Taylor Heinicke off waivers from the Houston Texans.

April 13, 2018: Houston Texans waived QB Taylor Heinicke.

December 15, 2017: Houston Texans activated QB Taylor Heinicke from the practice squad.

November 29, 2017: Houston Texans added QB Taylor Heinicke to the practice squad.

October 9, 2017: New England Patriots cut QB Taylor Heinicke.

September 23, 2017: New England Patriots added QB Taylor Heinicke to the practice squad.

September 12, 2017: Minnesota Vikings cut QB Taylor Heinicke.

September 11, 2017: Minnesota Vikings waived QB Taylor Heinicke.

September 3, 2017: Minnesota Vikings placed QB Taylor Heinicke on IR.

November 8, 2016: Minnesota Vikings activated QB Taylor Heinicke from the non-football injury list.

July 29, 2016: Minnesota Vikings placed QB Taylor Heinicke on the non-football injury list.

May 9, 2015: Minnesota Vikings signed QB Taylor Heinicke.[/B]

Just no, TY is not the answer, just stop.[/quote]

If you read my entire posts I did say that we should also draft a qb and bring back Allen.

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

if you were Stafford would you come here? Colts are already a playoff team w/ a very good o-line. They will play at least 9 games indoors.

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1275436]if you were Stafford would you come here? Colts are already a playoff team w/ a very good o-line. They will play at least 9 games indoors.[/quote]

1. Yes.

2. So are we.

3. And you think that's a good thing?

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

I think to work out the right approach you have to stand back and look at a few things. When building a SB contender, what has worked elsewhere? For me, there are 3 possible formulae for winning:

1) Find a franchise QB in the draft and build around him. Wherever in the draft doesn't really matter, to me it seems its more important to be able to recognise the talent (like Shanny recognised that RG3 might not hold up and that Cousins was an NFL calibre QB). Pats (TB), Packers (RA), Chiefs (PM), Seahawks (RW) etc. are winners that fit in this category (won multiple times in a span or at least multiple appearances)
2) Have a team in largely place that's missing a few key pieces. Often but not necessarily QB. I'd put the '16 Broncos in here (PM), '13 Ravens (Flacco wasn't franchise material, but the missing piece to get them there), possibly the '02 Buccs (added McCardell and Pittman to supplement a great D). Often 1 off wins because the team wasn't built as a unit so pieces fall away the following years.
3) Stars align. Team is already good overall, maybe great at some positions, but somehow it all comes together for the one year. I'd put the '09 Saints and the '17 Eagles in this category.

#1 is obviously the way to do it and build a team that will go to multiple SB's in a short span. Chiefs have managed to do it now, and the Pats did it before them. Hard to maintain without some serious cap juggling, but better to achieve sustainable results.

But if you're happy with winning an SB every so often, either of the other 2 will work (maybe with a bit of luck).

So for me, we're probably in the 2nd category. We could draft in a rookie QB and assuming we get the right one, build around him, but by the time he's ready our D will probably be fragmenting as the cap hits. Of course we could just keep drafting players that slot in, but you need a good personnel team to find the lower round picks and UDFA/cheap FA players that fit that scheme (like the Pats did up to last year).

As I don't think we are in that position (KS or no KS), I'd agree that bringing in a veteran QB to drive an O to marry up with our D makes most sense. Maybe we then draft our future Mahomes/Brady/Rodgers in 2-3 years time and move on to building a new team around him. But I'm not convinced RR is our Belichick or Reid capable of doing that. So for me you see there's a window now of 2-3 years to build a championship team and you bring in the pieces to get there.

That's why I go after Stafford now. And bring in the likes of Robinson, Samuel or Galloday, draft OL and TE to give him weapons, and patch the gaps on D by drafting CB and LB. If we lose our 1st and a 3rd to bring in Stafford we could do that with the remaining picks.

And if we lose out on Stafford, I'd stand pat and hope we can get our QB in the draft. I'm just not wholly convinced we have the talent to spot that guy in the lower rounds, especially if we part ways with KS.

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

Kurt Warner was an out-of-work Arena football player working in a grocery store just before winning the Super Bowl.



[quote=mredskins;1275359]It was for 5 quarters! TH is a journey man at best. He is not like some 3rd round pick we got and he is 21 just starting out.

Look at his "career":
[B]December 8, 2020: Washington Football Team added QB Taylor Heinicke to the practice squad.

August 30, 2019: Carolina Panthers cut QB Taylor Heinicke.

December 26, 2018: Carolina Panthers placed QB Taylor Heinicke on IR.

April 16, 2018: Carolina Panthers acquired QB Taylor Heinicke off waivers from the Houston Texans.

April 13, 2018: Houston Texans waived QB Taylor Heinicke.

December 15, 2017: Houston Texans activated QB Taylor Heinicke from the practice squad.

November 29, 2017: Houston Texans added QB Taylor Heinicke to the practice squad.

October 9, 2017: New England Patriots cut QB Taylor Heinicke.

September 23, 2017: New England Patriots added QB Taylor Heinicke to the practice squad.

September 12, 2017: Minnesota Vikings cut QB Taylor Heinicke.

September 11, 2017: Minnesota Vikings waived QB Taylor Heinicke.

September 3, 2017: Minnesota Vikings placed QB Taylor Heinicke on IR.

November 8, 2016: Minnesota Vikings activated QB Taylor Heinicke from the non-football injury list.

July 29, 2016: Minnesota Vikings placed QB Taylor Heinicke on the non-football injury list.

May 9, 2015: Minnesota Vikings signed QB Taylor Heinicke.[/B]

Just no, TY is not the answer, just stop.[/quote]

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1275418]JP Finlay; Washington should trade for Matt Stafford. That's it. That's the headline:

[url]https://www.nbcsports.com/washington/football-team/washington-should-trade-matthew-stafford-thats-it-thats-headline[/url][/quote]

end of thread

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=Monkeydad;1275445]Kurt Warner was an out-of-work Arena football player working in a grocery store just before winning the Super Bowl.[/quote]

Kurt Warner was a lottery ticket for the Rams.

Sure maybe TH is the next Kurt but my guess is he is just a scratch off ticket in the trash with no winning numbers.

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1275435]If you read my entire posts I did say that we should also draft a qb and bring back Allen.[/quote]

Sorry man i don't have time to read your entire 14k plus post to figure out your full opinion.

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=mredskins;1275458]Kurt Warner was a lottery ticket for the Rams.

Sure maybe TH is the next Kurt but my guess is he is just a scratch off ticket in the trash with no winning numbers.[/quote]

The Rams and Cowboys struck gold with Warner and Romo.

Both are as RARE as it gets.

That shows you how starved this fanbase is of a great QB.. TH was labeled a QB1 after 5 QTRS of football lol. The guy has been all over the place before this yr.

If I'm Ron and Co. I offer the next 3 First Round picks to Houston today for Watson. If they say no, I move on to Stafford and offer 19, 76 and next years 2nd for him. Keim reported that it will take a few picks in his opinion.

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

I get the argument that you possibly can win by building around a decent QB.

But it's not as possible. Look at the championship games this Sunday.

You had the GOAT, a top 10 QB in NFL history, a guy well on his way to being a top 10 in NFL history, and a top 10 current NFL QB in Allen.

Allen is the "worst" of the bunch, and he is 10x better than anything we have. Let's get ourselves a damn QB. With Heinicke as an excellent backup QB.

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1275468]I get the argument that you possibly can win by building around a decent QB.

But it's not as possible. Look at the championship games this Sunday.

You had the GOAT, a top 10 QB in NFL history, a guy well on his way to being a top 10 in NFL history, and a top 10 current NFL QB in Allen.

Allen is the "worst" of the bunch, and he is 10x better than anything we have. Let's get ourselves a damn QB. With Heinicke as an excellent backup QB.[/quote]

Josh Allen is already the best QB that we would have had since Rypien and prob better

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1275475]Josh Allen is already the best QB that we would have had since Rypien and prob better[/quote]

Rypien was the perfect QB for that 1991 team and that team was awesome. I'll say yes from 1992 onwards, with Brad Johnson 2nd. I'd kill for a Brad Johnson right now.

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1275477]Rypien was the perfect QB for that 1991 team and that team was awesome. I'll say yes from 1992 onwards, with Brad Johnson 2nd. I'd kill for a Brad Johnson right now.[/quote]

Here you go, the modern-day Brad Johnson is available!




[img]https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fsection307.files.wordpress.com%2F2013%2F08%2Fpho-10apr06-215968.jpg&f=1&nofb=1[/img]

[img]https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fimages.saymedia-content.com%2F.image%2FMTY4MDI5NjY2MTA2NDE4NTYw%2Fryan-fitzpatrick-fantasy-football-dolphins.jpg&f=1&nofb=1[/img]

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

Other than the # I don't see what Johnson and Fitzpatrick have in common. Totally different types of QB's.

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=mredskins;1275458]kurt warner was a lottery ticket for the rams.

Sure maybe th is the next kurt but my guess is he is just a scratch off ticket in the trash with no winning numbers.[/quote]
hatters gone hat

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=MTK;1275483]Other than the # I don't see what Johnson and Fitzpatrick have in common. Totally different types of QB's.[/quote]

Caucasian?

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=mredskins;1275492]Caucasian?[/quote]

Right Handed?

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;1275493]Right Handed?[/quote]

A team from Florida is included in both images?

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1275498]A team from Florida is included in both images?[/quote]

Yup to all, basically the same guy.

Come to think of it never seen Brad Johnson and Fitzmagic in the same room together.

Hmmm...

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

And they both have killer beards, it's making sense now

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=Meks;1275491]hatters gone hat[/quote]

Lol!

Who’s the poster with all of WarPath’s unique vocab in their sig?

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

“Teams have contacted the lions to see what it will take to land Stafford”

Shefty

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=chief x_phackter;1275275]i'ma get the f out then if go big means giving away more than #19 and #74. You can have a matthew stafford in the building, but if you don't have enough pieces around him, it won't matter.

Just sayin - jimmy g was 5 minutes away from winning the sb last year, because he had a sb caliber cast around him. I'm not suggesting they go get [i]him[/i], but in my opinion, they shouldn't go big at the expense of the rest of the roster.[/quote]

+100

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1275330]I'd rather take my chances w/ keeping my picks and rolling w/ Allen and Heinike. Pick a Qb within the 1st 3 rounds. I just really really liked what I saw from Heinike. Is everyone just forgetting how well he played under some tough circumstances? How many drops he had? Give him a chance w/ more weapons. He was making throws that we hadn't seen in a while, we was anticipating, moving well.[/quote]

The more I think about it, the more I'm starting to lean towards your way of thinking. I'm not quite there yet as I'm on the fence, but I'm slightly tilting "your way."

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

Heinicke is a walking injury. His one consistent is he always gets hurt. There is just no way if I was Rivera I could go into next season with him as the likely starter. Allen isn't good enough in general. Those 2 plus a more proven veteran would be OK imo. But not just those 2.

Note - I think regardless of what we do, we're keeping 3 QBs next year, not including PS.

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

I wish Taylor was the answer ... I just don’t know

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=rocnrik;1275532]I wish Taylor was the answer ... I just don’t know[/quote]

He's not

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

Honestly how is trading for Stafford even a debate? Just get it done.

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=MTK;1275547]Honestly how is trading for Stafford even a debate? Just get it done.[/quote]

This is where I'm at.

I've seen this team make blockbuster trades/FA signings time and time again for players that weren't of the same caliber as Stafford. We desperately need an upgrade at QB and he still has a LOT to offer at this point in his career.

I know it's a new regime in Washington and they're trying to reset the culture but this seems like a move we have to make. If they were willing to go "all in " on Cooper last off-season they should see do the same here.

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[QUOTE=sdskinsfan2001;1275530]Heinicke is a walking injury. His one consistent is he always gets hurt. There is just no way if I was Rivera I could go into next season with him as the likely starter. Allen isn't good enough in general. Those 2 plus a more proven veteran would be OK imo. But not just those 2.



Note - I think regardless of what we do, we're keeping 3 QBs next year, not including PS.[/QUOTE]



Very very small sample size. Could be a freak thing. I believe he stayed healthy in college. I know he played at a small school but I dont think im ready to call him a Jordan Reed yet.

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

They offered 23M guaranteed to Cooper vs cowboys 60M guar, it was never a real offer. per keim

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

So if we trade for Stafford (which would clearly be a win now move) do we draft one of the first round quarterbacks if they fall too us or do we use that on a tackle or wr to compliment Stafford?

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=MTK;1275547]Honestly how is trading for Stafford even a debate? Just get it done.[/quote]

It makes us NFC East Champs for a couple of years, hooray.

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=punch it in;1275553]So if we trade for Stafford (which would clearly be a win now move) do we draft one of the first round quarterbacks if they fall too us or do we use that on a tackle or wr to compliment Stafford?[/quote]

If we trade for Stafford we won't have a first round pick

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=mredskins;1275554]It makes us NFC East Champs for a couple of years, hooray.[/quote]

I think you're underselling Stafford and the value of having a legit QB to go along with this growing defense, but anyway, given our brilliant W/L record since 1991 how is winning a few more division titles at the very least, a bad thing?

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=EdmundDorf;1275555]If we trade for Stafford we won't have a first round pick[/quote]

Most likely true. So after that, we build around him. 2nd round pick should be the left left tackle available, if WR if we didn't land a big FA name.

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[QUOTE=mredskins;1275554]It makes us NFC East Champs for a couple of years, hooray.[/QUOTE]You have to get to the playoffs to be in the mix as an annual contender.

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

What if we get Golloday back with Stafford, we send them a first and a third this year and a 3rd next year and they send Stafford and Golloday

Re: Stafford in WFT Plans? He’s Available
 

[quote=MTK;1275547]Honestly how is trading for Stafford even a debate? Just get it done.[/quote]

probably because chances are low we can get Stafford . . . too many better qualified teams will be looking (Patriots, 49ers, Colts, Rams), so why would he come here?