Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=Beemnseven;683312]Now that it's done, I'm 90% in favor. But the one thing that's been on my mind is pick #37 this year. [B]In the long run, wouldn't it have been better to take the two best offensive tackles in the 1st and 2nd knowing how horrific the line was last year?[/B]

[B]Doesn't matter anymore though[/B].[/quote]

That's what i was thinking word for word.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=pg86;683609][B]Im tired of people telling us to draft linemen[/B]

this is the NFL you don't want a rookie guard not just that the skins have been signing linemen williams is a guard!

McNabb is gonna do great and we didn't need to tell Jason about the transaction what has he really given to the franchise?[/quote]

So you're the jerk that Vinny was listening to? Seems to me you've been getting your way for the past . . . . ten years!

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=NYCskinfan82;683617]That's what i was thinking word for word.[/quote]

Remember when we had Chris Samuels and Jon Jansen, a first rounder and second rounder respectively, as bookend tackles?

Quarterback is the most important position, period.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=Redskins_P;683205]This is the way I see the trade....

Campbell + Zorn < McNabb + Shanahan[/quote]



Agreed

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;683584]Ok, so about T+20 hours. I still don't like it, but reports are that the Skins/McNabb are working to get an extension. Campbell should be traded for an "acceptable" pick. So, without switching to a "Yes" I will say if the following things occur, I will feel MUCH better:

A) DM signs a 4-5 year deal for "reasonable" money, 4-5 is simply so we aren't playing around with him anymore. Should be set in a way that after year 3 he is easily cuttable.

B) JC is traded for at least a 3rd in this year's draft.

C) We win a SB[/quote]

Still mulling this whole trade over. Not a big fan - too much for an older player when we are more than one player, even a top 10 QB, from a SB.

With that said:

A) Agreed. Please, please - Can we avoid Jason Taylor redux?

B) Good luck with that. If we get a 4th I would be amazed. Everyone knows we just want to dump him.

C) Yes that would be sweet. DM throwing the winning touchdown. As an added bonus, an apoplectic Eagles fan base would implode from frustration.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=Son Of Man;683614]Finally, I can look forward to Madden 2011.[/quote]

I'm already updating my roster

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;683624]Still mulling this whole trade over. Not a big fan - too much for an older player when we are more than one player, even a top 10 QB, from a SB.

With that said:

A) Agreed. Please, please - Can we avoid Jason Taylor redux?

B) Good luck with that. If we get a 4th I would be amazed. Everyone knows we just want to dump him.

C) Yes that would be sweet. DM throwing the winning touchdown. As an added bonus, [B]an apoplectic Eagles fan base would implode from frustration[/B].[/quote]

That would make it all worth it to me.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;683619]So you're the jerk that Vinny was listening to? Seems to me you've been getting your way for the past . . . . ten years![/quote]
No if Vinny were listening to me he would of been out to get McNabb years ago :P

I'm just saying I find it odd that our lines so horrible yet a backup qb can get behind it and not get sacked till the playoffs

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=pg86;683628]No if Vinny were listening to me he would of been out to get McNabb years ago :P

I'm just saying I find it odd that our lines so horrible yet a backup qb can get behind it and not get sacked till the playoffs[/quote]

Yeah in 2007. And that line wasn't stellar either. It's 2010. Last year's line stank.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;683630]Yeah in 2007. And that line wasn't stellar either. It's 2010. Last year's line stank.[/quote]

We don't even know what the draft target is now though...what can we get for deep sixing J.C.?!?!? Or Colt

But really you don't wanna draft a rookie linemen

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=Audi;683595]Decline or not, Donovan McNabb is the best quarterback the Redskins have had in decades.[/quote]

I was hoping that we would get "the best QB in decades" but have him be young, so we have him for a long time.

That hope squashed, I still take solace that we are better at QB than we've been in decades, as you indicate.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=pg86;683631]We don't even know what the draft target is now though...what can we get for deep sixing J.C.?!?!? Or Colt

But really you don't wanna draft a rookie linemen[/quote]

Samuals was a rookie lineman. If my memory serves me he started right away?

Buges is gone man. That whole, "I don't trust rookie lineman" didn't exactly pan out for us too well. Just ask Campbell, Brunell, and Ramsey. Ask them how that turf tastes in Landover.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;683606]Is McNabb the 2004 version, absolutely not.[B] Is he still a top 10 QB, absolutely[/B]. The article mentioned the Eagles are in a youth movement, Kolb is young. McNabb's numbers are strong and he's a major upgrade from Campbell. There is no statistical indication McNabb's peerformance will decline in the near term (2-3 years).[/quote]

#1- I am no fan of JC and have lobbied for us to draft a QB, but statistically JC's numbers are not far off from McNabb's. So you are correct we are not getting the McNabb of 2004, we are getting McNabb of 2009 with the same numbers as JC (minus 2 games) in a better situation then JC. So please don't mention he's statistically better cause he's not. Go look.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

I really don't know were i stand with this trade yet but,
1. DM works out in the off season,
2. DM never took painkillers Favre did & if he didn't he probably wouldn't be here now
3. Favre is still playing & DM takes better care of himself.
4. DM is a good roll out QB.
5. DM has the ablility to make his WR's better.

I'm a JC supporter & i'm sad to see him go (more than likely.)

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=SBXVII;683639]#1- I am no fan of JC and have lobbied for us to draft a QB, but statistically JC's numbers are not far off from McNabb's.[B] So you are correct we are not getting the McNabb of 2004, we are getting McNabb of 2009 with the same numbers as JC (minus 2 games) in a better situation then JC[/B]. So please don't mention he's statistically better cause he's not. Go look.[/quote]

Thanks SBXVII. That is what bothers me. That and the fact that we're giving up a pick at #37 for an older QB who may not do that much, if any, better than the QB we have. We would have improved with the RB situation, the draft, new coaching and improved line play anyway. Now we're out a young player at #37 and a pick next year for someone I wasn't that impressed with to begin with. Hopefully he plays lights out this year. I'll believe it when I see it.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;683637]Samuals was a rookie lineman. If my memory serves me he started right away?

Buges is gone man. That whole, "I don't trust rookie lineman" didn't exactly pan out for us too well. Just ask Campbell, Brunell, and Ramsey. Ask them how that turf tastes in Landover.[/quote]

I don't remember I think we had some guy named Tre Johnson for a year before Samuels got the start.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[url=http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/2010/04/theismann_mcnabb_is_the_last_p.html?wprss=dcsportsbog]
D.C. Sports Bog - Theismann: McNabb "the last piece of the puzzle"[/url]
Glad to see him back to his old optimistic self.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

Some guy from CSNPhilly.Com just said he thinks this trade will give McNabb a jump start but the Skins still have alot of holes to fill that can't be filled only by the draft. He also said Philly liked Kolb's quick release and they felt McNabb sometimes held on to the ball too long and didn't get to some of his reads which cost them some games. Just relaying the thoughts of a sportscaster from Philly.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=Lotus;683634]I was hoping that we would get "the best QB in decades" but have him be young, so we have him for a long time.

That hope squashed, I still take solace that we are better at QB than we've been in decades, as you indicate.[/quote]

I agree, but a second rounder and a likely third rounder really isn't too bad of a deal for a proven quarterback. In fact, it almost seems cheap.

3rd for Mark Brunell was pretty bad because he was already well into his decline shown through his poor play and eventual benching in Jacksonville.

I believe we traded a 1st and 2nd and 3rd rounder for Brad Johnson in 1999.

We used a 1st and 3rd and 4th for Jason Campbell.

Matt Cassel cost a 2nd rounder and who knows how good he actually is.

It almost seems like McNabb came at a bargain.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;683556]Not really, the article addresses the business issues. The only things about McNabb's performance were the games against Dallas, his completion % (which I already showed was above career avg.), and passing yds (not surprising as McNabb missed two games). If you add 500 yds to his passing yd total for the year he winds up at 10th. Let's look at some other 2009 McNabb stats:

- TD % = 9th
- INT % = 8th
- QB rate = 12th
- Yds / Att = 7th
- Adjusted Net Yds / per ATT = 10th
- Yds / Game = 10th

This whole decline thing is BS, this was a business move and long term strategy move by the Iggles. Not considering McNabb's leadership and mobility which make him more valuable, we're getting a top 10 passing QB for a 2nd rounder and a mid-round pick in 2011. Good deal for the Skins.

I don't care what ridiculous geometric/triangulation/5th-week-of-the- season-away-on-astroturf metrics Football Outsiders or GTripp throws out here. McNabb led his team to the playoffs the last two years and was 11-5 last year. The Eagles lost to New Orleans (SB Champ), Chargers (AFC Championship game), and Dallas (playoff team who Eagles don't match up well against) and the Raiders (????) and were 5th in scoring with McNabb at QB.[/quote]Anyway, I call BS on McNabb as a top ten QB, still, in 2010. Indefensible premise.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

CRedskinsrule in Part I said it all for me.

"Now we get to be the NYJ of two years ago with McNabb for 1 year, then he will sit out and go to the Vikings and we get nothing... And lose a pick next year. First move from this new team that I absolutely don't like!"


It's hard to turn 180 overnight and embrace a former rival's QB.

The Front Office seemed to revert to Snyderatto days, and overpaid again for an aging vet. So much for the needed youth movement. We are not a team 1 or 2 players away from winning it all. We are 10-15 players away.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=SBXVII;683639]#1- I am no fan of JC and have lobbied for us to draft a QB, but statistically JC's numbers are not far off from McNabb's. So you are correct we are not getting the McNabb of 2004, we are getting McNabb of 2009 with the same numbers as JC (minus 2 games) in a better situation then JC. So please don't mention he's statistically better cause he's not. Go look.[/quote]You're only looking at the base numbers and not the numbers I've quoted in earlier posts. Statistically, W-L and intangibles McNabb is a MAJOR upgrade over JC.

So if your premise is correct and JC = McNabb (or real close) then MS, KS and Bruce Allen are idiots. That's the logical conclusion unless they're working another trade scenario.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=GTripp0012;683657]Anyway, I call BS on McNabb as a top ten QB, still, in 2010. Indefensible premise.[/quote]I call BS, on your call of BS :hitfan:

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=Audi;683652]I agree, but a second rounder and a likely third rounder really isn't too bad of a deal for a proven quarterback. In fact, it almost seems cheap.

3rd for Mark Brunell was pretty bad because he was already well into his decline shown through his poor play and eventual benching in Jacksonville.

I believe we traded a 1st and 2nd and 3rd rounder for Brad Johnson in 1999.

We used a 1st and 3rd and 4th for Jason Campbell.

Matt Cassel cost a 2nd rounder and who knows how good he actually is.

It almost seems like McNabb came at a bargain.[/quote]

Super analysis my friend. McNabb is indeed a bargain if he takes us to the playoffs this year. I mean, EVERY team in the NFL would trade their 2nd round pick every season for a guaranteed shot at the playoffs. And if McNabb plays near as long as Favre...we just need to go ahead and lock him up with a 5 year deal right now.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;683669]You're only looking at the base numbers and not the numbers I've quoted in earlier posts. Statistically, W-L and intangibles McNabb is a MAJOR upgrade over JC.

So if your premise is correct and JC = McNabb (or real close) then MS, KS and Bruce Allen are idiots. That's the logical conclusion unless they're working another trade scenario.[/quote]Well, I mean if you were grading them on this one move, the conclusion would be that they in fact are idiots.

I know it's hard to believe that Shanahan would ever make a mistake, it's not like he's got a history of personnel mistakes, so I guess we will have to wait and see if his gamble pays off.

You call BS on my call of BS?! Well, I'm calling BS on that on the grounds of, huh?

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

Everyone keeps arguing whether the quarterback or linemen are more important. I see it like this. Who came first the chicken or the egg? Without a good line your quarterback stays on his backside most likely irregardless of whether he has jason campbell or peyton manning numbers. Without a good quarterback you can have a great line and still not produce anything offensively. I can't help but think that Shanny has a good idea of how to fill at least most of the holes we have. He probably already has some things figured out we don't know about. If we've got a good QB we need to address our line first and if we have a good enough pick at the end of the day, draft a developmental qb. If not, draft one next year.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

hahaha Andrew Perloff on SI.com has Kolb throwing for more than 4000 yards and 30 touchdowns. What an ass-munch, doesn't he realize that Kolb has started in 2 games and he is playing 3 really tough defenses in the division alone.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;683584]Ok, so about T+20 hours. I still don't like it, but reports are that the Skins/McNabb are working to get an extension. Campbell should be traded for an "acceptable" pick. So, without switching to a "Yes" I will say if the following things occur, I will feel MUCH better:

A) DM signs a 4-5 year deal for "reasonable" money, 4-5 is simply so we aren't playing around with him anymore. Should be set in a way that after year 3 he is easily cuttable.

B) JC is traded for at least a 3rd in this year's draft.

C) We win a SB[/quote]

A) Early reports are indicating 4 year deal (team option on year 4), 3 years around $25 million base (very early reports mind you)

B) 4th or 5th more likely

C) Sure

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=SmootSmack;683695]A) Early reports are indicating 4 year deal (team option on year 4), 3 years around $25 million base (very early reports mind you)

B) 4th or 5th more likely

C) Sure[/quote]


$25 Million base? Is that for 3 years or is this a $75 million contract?

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;683705]$25 Million base? Is that for 3 years or is this a $75 million contract?[/quote]

DM's good but he ain't 25mil a yr good.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

I really hope this gets done. Forget the salary cap and let Snyder do what he does best and sign a nice contract for McNabb to relate his game too.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;683705]$25 Million base? Is that for 3 years or is this a $75 million contract?[/quote]

$25 million per home game...unless the barometric pressure drops below 35 (excluding prime time games)

$25 million for all 3 years

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

Do you know based on this pickup we are going to have alot of Prime Time Games.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=NYCskinfan82;683714]Do you know based on this pickup we are going to have alot of Prime Time Games.[/quote]

We better. If it wasn't for sunday ticket I'd see 1-2 games a year max.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

Hail SUNDAY TICKET!!!!!

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

Just saw reports that JAX is not interested in Mr Campbell.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

Yeah that's what they're saying now, publicly at least. But we'll see what happens.

Jacksonville's problem is that they have a limited number of draft picks (4 or 5) and are trying to get more picks. They'd rather not spend a pick on Campbell alone

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

Well why don't they just ship us their best lineman in an even swap for Campbell? Keep in mind I have no idea what the Jax line looks like and could be worse that ours. However that is most likely doubtful.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;683281]youre not considering what could have been done with the 2nd round pick. How about this? Wait until the 37th pick is made in the draft and let us know if that player (or any player still available at that point) is better than McNabb.[/quote]

Well, by that rationale, you'll really have to wait to see what the Eagles do with the 3rd or 4th round pick in 2011, because we gave them that as well.

I like the trade I guess, but I just have this feeling that Campbell could have put up some very nice numbers under Shanahan's tutelage.

Re: McNabb a Redskin! (Part II)
 

[quote=SkinzWin;683726]Well why don't they just ship us their best lineman in an even swap for Campbell? Keep in mind I have no idea what the [B]Jax line looks like[/B] and could be worse that ours. However that is most likely doubtful.[/quote]
Two 1st round, 2nd year O tackles.