The State of the Redskins (MERGED)
 

I just saw Ryan Clark make a great play, an interception. I watched Antonio Pierce play great against us. Trotter is one of the best middle line backers out there. Smoot is doing well. Would we have been better signing those guys? You bet we would have. They would have been cheaper and we would be alot better. Who agrees with that? I am pissed. I love Dan Snyder, for always trying, but this sucks. This post was locked out of extremeskins stadium forum, but unfortunatley it is the truth.[IMG]http://www.extremeskins.com/forums/images/smilies/cheers.gif[/IMG]

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

I totally agree, I think our front office has a secret deal with all the other NFL teams. Basically we breed talent, and after they become good we get ride of them. Other teams get their players, and Dan Synder gets his jollies watching the Skins lose. It is a win-win situation.

I say we bring back Green for CB, and Theisman, maybe we would have gotten those 3rd and shorts.

Doug Williams anyone?

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

I guess you mean Dan Snyder, not Schneider

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

They should have kept Pierce, Smoot, and Clark. No question. Trotter I can't fault them for. He never played that well for us. Sean Barber was a long time ago.

You can't keep everyone, but we certainly got taken to the cleaners this off-season. We have taken a huge step back defensively.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

trotter never would have been good for us. solely a run stopper, cant cover. i think he is hugely overrated because everyone loves the eagles (made the pro bowl with 58 tackles). letting pierce go was a HUGE mistake, and i wanted us to keep in badly. with smoot he showed his true colours in minnesota and thats not what we need. letting ryan clark leave was also very stupid. how can u say barber? dudes been injured sooo much over the last 5 or so years.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

[quote=Big C;225784]trotter never would have been good for us. solely a run stopper, cant cover. i think he is hugely overrated because everyone loves the eagles (made the pro bowl with 58 tackles). letting pierce go was a HUGE mistake, and i wanted us to keep in badly. with smoot he showed his true colours in minnesota and thats not what we need. letting ryan clark leave was also very stupid. how can u say barber? dudes been injured sooo much over the last 5 or so years.[/quote]

No theisman or doug williams?!! lol

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

There is nothing wrong with our front office. They are geared up for marketing, not football. If Snyder wanted to put the best team on the field every year he would. 10 times out of 10 Snyder would choose to make the big splash as opposed to keeping a proven commodity.

Just wait when they bullshit Taylor and he walks.

If extremeskins locked this thread they are living the lie and that is pathetic.

Just like you I am tired of this bullshit. Brunell is a joke and Hall is even worse. Yet week after week we cheer them on like stupid sheep.

F*ck you Dan Snyder.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

[quote=TAFKAS;225778]I guess you mean Dan Snyder, not Schneider[/quote]

No I also blame Dan Schneider! You know the fat guy from "Head of the Class"...

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

[quote=NYCSkin;225793]No I also blame Dan Schneider! You know the fat guy from "Head of the Class"...[/quote]

He was the funniest guy on that show. Great reference NYCSKIN!

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

I was always a fan of Jawarhalal. The show was never the same when they let him go. Damn that front office!

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

[quote=NYCSkin;225806]I was always a fan of Jawarhalal. The show was never the same when they let him go. Damn that front office![/quote]

Ha!

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

I can't a thread seriously when someone starts off with butchering the spelling of the owner's name.

Spare me the crying over players that are no longer on the team.

Who cares.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

[quote=Mattyk72;225825]I can't a thread seriously when someone starts off with butchering the spelling of the owner's name.

Spare me the crying over players that are no longer on the team.

Who cares.[/quote]

Good point. If we had a real QB no one would care about these other guys. Gibbs is the one tied to Brunell, not the front office.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

Brunell isn't the only problem either, so let's stop with the tired Brunell bashing.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

I think the front office is the genesis of our problems. And it's one thing to dismiss criticism about players not on the team; but many of the players ON the team where placed there by decisions by the front office. Therefore, questioning the front office of this organization is as pertinent as discussing players and coaches.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

[quote=Mattyk72;225830]Brunell isn't the only problem either, so let's stop with the tired Brunell bashing.[/quote]

You are right, the D has been crap so far but the QB has the greatest impact on a game. He can't throw in between the hash marks. I could name no less than 20 QB's that we would have a better record with.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

If only we had Arrington back. And if we didn't have ST, or anyone else currently on D who we would no longer be able to afford under the cap given what these guys were asking.

Plus, does nobody remember how [b]bad[/b] Trotter was when he played here?

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

Trotter wasn't used properly here and he definitely wasn't a good fit for GW.

He's at his best when he's attacking the line of scrimmage, he's very good at it but he's one dimensional.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

I wouldn't argue that Trotter wasn't used well here. I think you are 100% on target that Trotter wouldn't play well under GW (I'm pretty sure he left before GW started). Hell, he probably wouldn't play at all. Which brings us back to, why would we want Trotter, Smoot, or Pierce, since we've shown we don't need them? With Springs out, Clark would be helpful in the secondary, though.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

In Trotter's defense, he looked good under Marvin Lewis. He looked awful under Edwards ... as did the rest of the defense. Trotter also went to the Pro Bowl 2 years ago because he turned around the Eagles run defense, even if he had just 58 tackles.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

Trotter was still here when GW took over the D but GW never even let him hit the practice field. Guess he knew enough about him to know that he wasn't the guy to run his D.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

[quote=Mattyk72;225926]Trotter was still here when GW took over the D but GW never even let him hit the practice field. Guess he knew enough about him to know that he wasn't the guy to run his D.[/quote]

But didn't GW admit that letting Trotter go was a bit of a mistake? Granted it worked out because Pierce became a player under GW and is now a force...just not for us.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72;225926]Trotter was still here when GW took over the D but GW never even let him hit the practice field. Guess he knew enough about him to know that he wasn't the guy to run his D.[/QUOTE]
According to this, Trotter was back in Philly for the 2004 season, which was GW's first season here:
[url=http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/TrotJe00.htm]Jeremiah Trotter statistics - pro-football-reference.com[/url]
[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gregg_Williams]Gregg Williams - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/url]

Or, are you talking about pre-season? I don't remember the details, I just remember [b]not[/b] seeing Trotter in a regular season game with GW.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

OK, I see Trotter was released after GW got here, but before the season started.

[url=http://www.thehogs.net/content/story.php?id=278]Training Camp Preview - Linebackers[/url]

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

[quote=onlydarksets;225935]According to this, Trotter was back in Philly for the 2004 season, which was GW's first season here:
[URL="http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/TrotJe00.htm"]Jeremiah Trotter statistics - pro-football-reference.com[/URL]
[URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gregg_Williams"]Gregg Williams - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/URL]

Or, are you talking about pre-season? I don't remember the details, I just remember [B]not[/B] seeing Trotter in a regular season game with GW.[/quote]

Trotter was on our roster when Williams was hired. He was released and made Philly as a special teams player. The middle Lb got hurt, Trotter stepped in and made the pro-bowl that year.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

The biggest problem for me 2 years ago was that we didn't get Smoot OR Peirce. I kinda thought it would be one or the othere (personally I was rooting to keep Smoot). I think Lamar Marshall has done a great job replacing Peirce on the inside, but we could be alot better with Peirce in the middle, Marshal on the outside, but overall, I dont think were that much worse off w/o him. We could def. use some CB help, but w/e. We drafted a young CB who hopefully will work out, and I think Marshal has been great inside. Plus, we made a great offer to Peirce from what I heard, but he went to NY for the money. Which is fine, if you wnat to get paid I can handle that, but quit your bitching because I know we offered him somthing close. I'm pretty sure we just let Smoot walk which I didnt really like because I loved Smoot.

The Clark one is the only one that I can really look back on and be like wtf. I dont get why we let him go, he was a perfect role player, loved by the team, and we went out and signed the big name to replace him; and in all seriousness I dont think he's as good as Clark and we pd. him way more. I think that situation just pissed me off because it was the only one I was pissed about when it happened. I didnt like the idea then, and I'm being proved right unforunatley so far.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

Ok...here's the icing on the cake. Walt Harris who we all remember and loved for a long time here had 3 INT's for the 49ers today!!! Freakin' walt harris, who was burned so much he coughed up smoke, has 3 picks. Even his sorry coverage skills would prob. help improve this secondary a little.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

cant dwell on the past mistakes....smoot and clark but barber trotter and pierce? not sure about those three.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

I bet most of you guys posting on this thread were saying how great we were against the Jags last week. A lot of these posts sound like fair weather garbage. You really want LA back? His problem even under Paterno was that he makes his own decisions. Good ridence LA. Trotter, all he cares about is $'s. No loyalty. And Pierce, lol, Marshall is a stellar replacement. I have not forgotten #28 D G, 20 years, thick and thin. If you are a bandwagoneer then go somewhere else. Our problems this year have barely been addressed in this thread, and I believe only by the Mod's. Our Redskins problems have nothing to do with who is not on this team anymore. I hear Parcells likes fair weather fans, grow up or get out.

Hail
44

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

geez, people are acting like we lost the game... i just don't... oh, oh yeah, that's right.


brunell is inconsistant, but the play calling sucked. we tried the same sweeps and such that we used againt two BACKUP DEs in jacksonville. when you replace them with very active and much faster DEs (and become predictable) it doesn't work as well. the NYG DTs stepped up too. they didn't get great push, but they didn't let portis run past them either.

and yeah, pierce and clark were mistakes. smoot would have been nice to keep, but GW rather have big tacklers than guys who can cover :P the big problem with pierce was letting him go to a team that we play twice a year that needed a MLB so desperately. trotter helps the eagles too, so that kinda sucks, but dumping him was the right call.

smoot wasn't cheaper (than rogers or other #2 CBs) btw. and trotter wasn't either (pierce and marshall were making vet min).

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

AP is the only one I was relly disapointed to see go. As for Ryan Clark....I don't think we would be notice he was gone if Pierson Prioleau didn't get hurt, and no one can predict when that happens. I think we really miss #20

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

[quote=Kope;226014]AP is the only one I was relly disapointed to see go. As for Ryan Clark....I don't think we would be notice he was gone if Pierson Prioleau didn't get hurt, and no one can predict when that happens. I think we really miss #20[/quote]

Yeah I think that's the point that alot of people are missing.

If Prioleau was healthy we probably wouldn't hear a peep out of the Clark lovers.

Nobody could have predicted that Springs AND Prioleau would both be out, Springs is a big loss and Prioleau is a very underestimated one.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

missing #24 and #20 real bad

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72;226022]Yeah I think that's the point that alot of people are missing.

If Prioleau was healthy we probably wouldn't hear a peep out of the Clark lovers.

Nobody could have predicted that Springs AND Prioleau would both be out, Springs is a big loss and Prioleau is a very underestimated one.[/QUOTE]


Thats a real good point. I still like Clark and would probably mention it, but its weird that I dont even think about Prioleau! He was very under-rated and thats ashame.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

I thought Ryan Clark was adequate. I didn't mind the attempt to upgrade him, but I do mind the choice we made. Archuleta blows. It's not Ryan Clark I miss, it's Archuleta who I hate.

Also, I used to think we were better off with Lemar Marshall at MLB making $1 million per year instead of Antonio Pierce making $4 million a year. Now I'm not so sure. Lemar is a solid system LB. He'll make an INT here or there. But Pierce is one of the savviest LBs I've ever seen. Nobody diagnoses plays faster than he does. I miss him VERY badly. Pierce was asking for more than Marcus Washington made, and I can understand how Gibbs would want to draw that line. But I'm not so sure Pierce isn't just as valuable, if not more so, than Marcus Washington.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

It's not the front office's job to plan a game and to motivate and use players. We came out flat as week old soda. Is that Snyder's fault? Come on. When a team ACROSS THE BOARD plays like that, it's not jst this or that personel move, IMO. It's about coaching and team chemistry and leadership. When this team plays with fire, we are a good team (see LAST week!); when we come out as we did in NY, we are a bad team. Which suggests to me that the problem is NOT player moves, it's how the players we have here now play. And that, IMO, is on the coahing staff, the highest paid staff in league history. Snyder and Vinny aren't coaching, and in all honesty, they are not deciding any longer who to get in the draft and FA. Do you REALLY think Snyder is telling GIBBS who to get? Come on.

If it were anyone but JG, we'd be talking about coaching. Snyder is an easy target, everyone loves to hate him. But that's Gibbs team out there, folks.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

[quote=Schneed10;226045]I thought Ryan Clark was adequate. I didn't mind the attempt to upgrade him, but I do mind the choice we made. Archuleta blows. It's not Ryan Clark I miss, it's Archuleta who I hate.

Also, I used to think we were better off with Lemar Marshall at MLB making $1 million per year instead of Antonio Pierce making $4 million a year. Now I'm not so sure. Lemar is a solid system LB. He'll make an INT here or there. But Pierce is one of the savviest LBs I've ever seen. Nobody diagnoses plays faster than he does. I miss him VERY badly. Pierce was asking for more than Marcus Washington made, and I can understand how Gibbs would want to draw that line. But I'm not so sure Pierce isn't just as valuable, if not more so, than Marcus Washington.[/quote]

the problem with not paying pierce is that it means holdman has to be on the field. lemar is better than him at OLB.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

Maybe I was misunderstood. I am saying those guys wanted alot more money than they were making, but the people that we have brought in are way over what we would have had to play our own players. Archuleta, is a perfect example, highest payed saftey ever. Hey, I think he had the best game of anybody against the Giants. At least he made tackles, but what we payed him alot and alot to many of others. We could have just kept what we had, probably saved money and would be a better team at this point.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

[quote=chris36;226064]Maybe I was misunderstood. I am saying those guys wanted alot more money than they were making, but the people that we have brought in are way over what we would have had to play our own players. Archuleta, is a perfect example, highest payed saftey ever. Hey, I think he had the best game of anybody against the Giants. At least he made tackles, but what we payed him alot and alot to many of others. We could have just kept what we had, probably saved money and would be a better team at this point.[/quote]

at least if we kept the cheap guys and they still sucked, we'd have more cap flexibility to fix it :/.

Re: WHATS WRONG WITH OUR FRONT OFFICE? Barber, Trotter, Smoot, Pierce, and Clark.
 

[quote=JWsleep;226047]It's not the front office's job to plan a game and to motivate and use players. We came out flat as week old soda. Is that Snyder's fault? Come on. When a team ACROSS THE BOARD plays like that, it's not jst this or that personel move, IMO. It's about coaching and team chemistry and leadership. When this team plays with fire, we are a good team (see LAST week!); when we come out as we did in NY, we are a bad team. Which suggests to me that the problem is NOT player moves, it's how the players we have here now play. And that, IMO, is on the coahing staff, the highest paid staff in league history. Snyder and Vinny aren't coaching, and in all honesty, they are not deciding any longer who to get in the draft and FA. Do you REALLY think Snyder is telling GIBBS who to get? Come on.

If it were anyone but JG, we'd be talking about coaching. Snyder is an easy target, everyone loves to hate him. But that's Gibbs team out there, folks.[/quote]

I agree with you, this past game was a coaching issue, not a player acquisition issue. But that's not the point of this thread. We have let some players go, and brought in some others for higher pay, and the decisions haven't made sense.

That's not the reason we lost against the Giants though. The biggest reason we lost was we just played like a bunch of girls. No fire. No emotion. The offensive line had no pride, no will to beat the crap out of the Giants like they did against the Jags.

We may have made some mistakes with player personnel, but we still have done a good job of putting a lot of talent together. Enough talent to win if we play hard. But that shouldn't stop us from criticizing questionable personnel decisions.