Campbell will now stay away from Redskins Park

[RedskinMike]

Originally Posted by GridIron26

^^ Me 3, I just hope Redskins will be able to get more than one pick for Campbell.. Ex: a first day pick and a second day pick..

first day pick is now only the first round.

[Beneil (diehard since 87)]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

- So by your logic, the Skins shouldn't have signed Rypien to an extension and kept him the starter after a SB MVP season? Don't get me wrong, I liked Stan the Man, but that's just crazy talk.
- Rich Gannon - outside of the 2000-02 seasons his career was pedestrian at best. So the Skins should've been able to identify that he would have those great seasons 6-7 years prior and with no indication by his previous play.
- Trent Green - the Skins did try to resign him, but he went for a more lucrative contract with the Rams. So the Skins overpay for players and they're damned, they don't overpay and they're damned.
- Brad Johnson's SB win had a whole lot more to do with the TB defense than him.

You're just all over the map. Admit it, you're a closet Eagles fans who's mad we got McNabb.

Last time I checked O-Line wasn't a position, QB is. QB is the most important position in football...WITHOUT QUESTION. And our QB situation has UNQUESTIONABLY been significantly upgraded.

We have the #4 pick are will likely go with Okung, a potential franchise LT. If not a possible trade down and we'll still get a starting caliber LT. There's a lot of time between now and training camp and I expect moves to upgrade the OL.

No, you did. You made the quote about "learning from the past". And there are several similarities between Elway when MS came in and McNabb now.

Rypien: He eent to the Canadian league and toyed with us like Favre did Green bay. Once we got him back, he was out of shape and missed a lot of training and stuff. We didnt have Mr Superbowl man, we had an out of shape canadian and a crappy back-up. Stan, had we kept him, would've been a FAR better follow-up to the QBs we had after Rypien.

Gannon: Um, in short, yes. I guess you would've gotten rid of Peyton Manning after HIS crappy first year too huh? Look, Every great QB starts out as a new guy that has no NFL game tape to go on. His preseason and the few plays he got in, whatever. All i know is i remember saying, "What the heck!?! What happened to Gannon?" Sorry for not taping tha games he DID play to use as evidence that I thought he was good. the other teams he played for obviously saw what i saw.

As for the "O-Line isn't a position" statement... that was just stupid and pointless. you watch the movie 'Blindside'? even my WIFE knows the importance of having a monster Tackle on the left side of a right handed QB. (and vice versa) Oh, and in front of any alltime great QB is an inteligent and dependable center. If you think a QB can be great without at least those two things, please, name one great QB that won games while lying on his back.

Oh, and yes... i AM an Eagles fan...
Well, two days of the year anyway. Sometimes 3, if the Cowboys and Eagles make the playoffs. I'm a true skins fan my friend. My second favorite team is whoever plays the Cowboys that week!

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Beneil (diehard since 87)

Rypien: He eent to the Canadian league and toyed with us like Favre did Green bay. Once we got him back, he was out of shape and missed a lot of training and stuff. We didnt have Mr Superbowl man, we had an out of shape canadian and a crappy back-up. Stan, had we kept him, would've been a FAR better follow-up to the QBs we had after Rypien.

Mark Rypien is Canadian, but he never went to the CFL (which is what I think you're saying), or threaten to retire and then come back and then retire again (which is what I think is what you're saying)

Gannon: Um, in short, yes. I guess you would've gotten rid of Peyton Manning after HIS crappy first year too huh? Look, Every great QB starts out as a new guy that has no NFL game tape to go on. His preseason and the few plays he got in, whatever. All i know is i remember saying, "What the heck!?! What happened to Gannon?" Sorry for not taping tha games he DID play to use as evidence that I thought he was good. the other teams he played for obviously saw what i saw.

Rich Gannon's stats:

Minnesota (1987) 4 games, 0 games started, 0 TD, 1 INT
Minnesota (1988) 3 games, 0 games started, 0 TD, 0 INT
Minnesota (1989) did not play
Minnesota (1990) 14 games, 0 games started, 16 TD, 16 INT
Minnesota (1991) 15 games, 11 started, 12 TD, 6 INT
Minnesota (1992) 12 games, 12 started, 12 TD, 13 INT
Washington (1993) 8 games, 4 started, 3 TD, 7 INT
* NOT ON A ROSTER IN 1994

So where is all this "no game tape to judge him on"?

It's fine that you have your opinion but start basing your opinion on actual real information

[SolidSnake84]

I honestly dont know if staying out of camp is good or bad for him at this point.

I mean i know why he wouldnt want to be there, and i dont blame him, but if he ends up staying here, that could really factor against him because you know how Shanahan likes active participation. It wouldn't surprise me if Jason is #3 because Shanahan didn't like that Jason wasn't very involved.

[Monkeydad]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

I honestly dont know if staying out of camp is good or bad for him at this point.

I mean i know why he wouldnt want to be there, and i dont blame him, but if he ends up staying here, that could really factor against him because you know how Shanahan likes active participation. It wouldn't surprise me if Jason is #3 because Shanahan didn't like that Jason wasn't very involved.

That will all change as soon as Rex has to step on the field in a real game.

McNabb has to come out, Rex steps in. 2 plays later, Coach Shanahan asks Jason to get loose because Rex can't convert a 3rd and 57.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

I honestly dont know if staying out of camp is good or bad for him at this point.

I mean i know why he wouldnt want to be there, and i dont blame him, but if he ends up staying here, that could really factor against him because you know how Shanahan likes active participation. It wouldn't surprise me if Jason is #3 because Shanahan didn't like that Jason wasn't very involved.

uhhh, shanahan approves of jason staying away. he might have even been the one who suggested campbell stay away: 1) he doesn't want campbell getting hurt and eliminating whatever trade value campbell has left. 2) his presence would be awkward for the team. donovan is the teams leader now and campbells presence would only be a distraction.

[Beneil (diehard since 87)]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Mark Rypien is Canadian, but he never went to the CFL (which is what I think you're saying), or threaten to retire and then come back and then retire again (which is what I think is what you're saying)

Rich Gannon's stats:
So where is all this "no game tape to judge him on"?

When it comes to Rypien, I'm just going by what the announcer said then he was out of shape in preseason. I didn't know he was Canadian until they said he considered playing there instead of re-uping with us. Omit it if you want, but you have to admit, he seemed very sluggish until well into the season. At least he did to me.

I wasn't saying that there was not game tape on him, i was replying to someone ELSE who said that by saying that he obviously had done enough if so many other teams signed him. Besides, everyone starts out with no NFL game tape. It's call having a great scouting team and coaching staff. There's more than just stats to see the potential of a man. The same way that a perfect pass, popped up by a guy thinking about AFTER the catch, caught by the corner of the opposing team... that's an interception in the QB's stats. They say that the numbers don't lie, but if you actualy watch the game and pay attention, you know the real deal.

[wilsowilso]

Anyone around here thinking we are getting anything more than a fourth(or most likely a fifth) round pick for Campbell needs to leave fantasy island and return to the land of reality.

[Beneil (diehard since 87)]

I guess looking at the numbers, Neither Brad Johnson nor Rich Gannon looked like Superbowl level QB's... but hey, neither did Doug Williams. As the Buc's QB, they went 2-14. Wow... 2 games worse than JC's last season. (since everyone considers the win/loss record as a qb stat)

Rypien's pre-superbowl stats weren't very impressive either. Not horrible, but not, "Holy Crap! This guy's gonn abe a Superbowl NVP some day" looking either.

[Beneil (diehard since 87)]

I'm just saying, pryor to his superbowl victory behind an awesome team, his best seasonal rating was 76.8.

His last season before Gibbs brought him here, he threw 9 tds and 11 interceptions. So tell me, Mr Smootsmack... if you look at all the QBs that have won the big one, and just look at stats, are they all Marino and McNabb like?

Lack luster, yet dependable QBs with some "but not necessarily great" comeback abilities like Brad Johnson and Trent Dilfer prove that with a great defense and a 'solid' offense, the big games can be won WELL! Great line, Steady QB, solid RBs, and sure handed passing options are all it takes if the defense is top 5.

Joe Theismann played 5 full seasons before throwing more TD's than picks. I guess when Joe Gibbs get here, he should've looked at Joe' sold stats and ignored the gameplay, huh. Judging by his stats, he was NOT a Superbowl winner. Instead of drafting Mark May to solidify the o-line, we should've gotten one of the great QBs available.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Beneil (diehard since 87)

When it comes to Rypien, I'm just going by what the announcer said then he was out of shape in preseason. I didn't know he was Canadian until they said he considered playing there instead of re-uping with us. Omit it if you want, but you have to admit, he seemed very sluggish until well into the season. At least he did to me.

I'll omit that what you said about him going to the CFL because it never happened. Yes, he used it as leverage in negotiations with the Redskins but that's as far as it went

I wasn't saying that there was not game tape on him, i was replying to someone ELSE who said that by saying that he obviously had done enough if so many other teams signed him. Besides, everyone starts out with no NFL game tape. It's call having a great scouting team and coaching staff. There's more than just stats to see the potential of a man. The same way that a perfect pass, popped up by a guy thinking about AFTER the catch, caught by the corner of the opposing team... that's an interception in the QB's stats. They say that the numbers don't lie, but if you actualy watch the game and pay attention, you know the real deal.

Sigh...kudos to you I guess for having the vision to see that Rich Gannon would have a Peyton-esque season or two in his 10+ years of pedestrian QB play

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Beneil (diehard since 87)

I guess looking at the numbers, Neither Brad Johnson nor Rich Gannon looked like Superbowl level QB's... but hey, neither did Doug Williams. As the Buc's QB, they went 2-14. Wow... 2 games worse than JC's last season. (since everyone considers the win/loss record as a qb stat)

Rypien's pre-superbowl stats weren't very impressive either. Not horrible, but not, "Holy Crap! This guy's gonn abe a Superbowl NVP some day" looking either.

Actually, you're wrong about Doug Williams...but that won't stop you from defending your error I suppose

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by Beneil (diehard since 87)

Rypien: He eent to the Canadian league and toyed with us like Favre did Green bay. Once we got him back, he was out of shape and missed a lot of training and stuff. We didnt have Mr Superbowl man, we had an out of shape canadian and a crappy back-up. Stan, had we kept him, would've been a FAR better follow-up to the QBs we had after Rypien.

Hindsight = 20/20.

Gannon: Um, in short, yes. I guess you would've gotten rid of Peyton Manning after HIS crappy first year too huh? Look, Every great QB starts out as a new guy that has no NFL game tape to go on. His preseason and the few plays he got in, whatever. All i know is i remember saying, "What the heck!?! What happened to Gannon?" Sorry for not taping tha games he DID play to use as evidence that I thought he was good. the other teams he played for obviously saw what i saw.

Have you sent your resume in to the Skins yet, if I'm correct the scouts' contracts are up shortly after the draft? If you saw Gannon as a SB QB when he was with us...well I'll just say you've got Miss Cleo beat.

As for the "O-Line isn't a position" statement... that was just stupid and pointless. you watch the movie 'Blindside'? even my WIFE knows the importance of having a monster Tackle on the left side of a right handed QB. (and vice versa) Oh, and in front of any alltime great QB is an inteligent and dependable center. If you think a QB can be great without at least those two things, please, name one great QB that won games while lying on his back.

Glad to see that your depth of football IQ stems from watching The Blindside. What position did Oher play in the movie....was it O-Line? No, it was LT. You mention a Center, different position from LT. Last time I checked, there were 5 positions on the O-Line. QB is a position, a single player, and it is the most important SINGLE POSITION on the field, without question. And we did significantly upgrade this position with the acquisition of McNabb.

Of the five positions on the OL we have a gaping hole at LT, a solid LG, a C whose best days are behind him, but may be a stopgap this year, RG is an unknown (Hicks, Williams, Rinehart) but it should be average or slightly below, RT is probably either Heyer or Levi, again average or slightly below would be my current assesment of the position. We are not going to completely rebuild the OL in a single off-season.

Forgive him, for he knows not of what he speaks

[tryfuhl]

more like Beneil (hardhead since 87) amirite?

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by tryfuhl

more like Beneil (hardhead since 87) amirite?