Campbell will now stay away from Redskins Park

[SolidSnake84]

I made my peace with Beneil months ago. You guys should do the same. He's just a passionate fan. He does have good points from time to time.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

i still don't get what his point actually was and how its relevant to the topic of the thread.

[Beneil (diehard since 87)]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

Hindsight = 20/20.

Have you sent your resume in to the Skins yet, if I'm correct the scouts' contracts are up shortly after the draft? If you saw Gannon as a SB QB when he was with us...well I'll just say you've got Miss Cleo beat.

Glad to see that your depth of football IQ stems from watching The Blindside. What position did Oher play in the movie....was it O-Line? No, it was LT. You mention a Center, different position from LT. Last time I checked, there were 5 positions on the O-Line. QB is a position, a single player, and it is the most important SINGLE POSITION on the field, without question. And we did significantly upgrade this position with the acquisition of McNabb.

Of the five positions on the OL we have a gaping hole at LT, a solid LG, a C whose best days are behind him, but may be a stopgap this year, RG is an unknown (Hicks, Williams, Rinehart) but it should be average or slightly below, RT is probably either Heyer or Levi, again average or slightly below would be my current assesment of the position. We are not going to completely rebuild the OL in a single off-season.

Okay, now you're just TRYING to be mean. I didn't say that IIIII learned from watching The Blind Side. I said any idiot can watch blindside and see how important an OT is. And why is the whole " 'O-line' is not a position" thing even part of your argument!? You're just being aimlessly facitious. My point is obvious. The Center and Tackle opposite the strating QB's throwing arm are the two most important positions to have GREAT PLAYERS in my opinion but as a whole, the ENTIRE OFFENSIVE LINE doesn't need to be AWESOME but have depth. If you disagree on THAT then say your side, but to focus on the fact that O-Line is not the name of a specific position is stupid. You're acting like i said "Oher is the best Center ever!" or something. I said LT was important, then in a seperate sentence i say Center is important, so you put the two together and practicaly call me a moron. Nice. Us Redskins fans are always looking out for eachother.

As for not rebuilding the OL in a single offseason, we pretty much already have. (though not an UPGRADE)
Think. How many O-Linemen did we start with last year and how many of them are here now? The best we had is gone and most of them are new faces. Some that weren't here or starting all year are still around, others retired or got dropped and even the ones that had a few decent games, like Levi Jones, are gone. We ARE rebuilding... just not improving. Your description of our O-Line alone shows that I am right. I guarantee that starting 5 this year won't have but maybe 2 names at the MOST from last year. The bench may have one as well, but i'm calling that a rebuilt o-line... i just hope it's an improvement.

And finally, you cna say 20/20 all you want. The fact is that i only been on this site for so long. If I had a computer when i was a kid and this site was around, i would've been making post after post against losing the players that i mention seeing something in. I was saying it then and I'm typing it now. it sure as heck was NOT hindsight 20/20 on MY behalf. Right now, i'm saying the same thing about Jason Campbell. though I hope we keep him because if our O-LINE POSITIONS aren't drasticly improved, my 'cleo'-like prediction is that McNabb is gonna get hurt behind it and i'd rather have Jason in than Rex. I see a lot in Campbell. If on a team with a decent line, i "predict" HE'LL have a ring before he's done too. Just because you were wrong about players in the past doesn't mean everyone else was too. Some people can look at a short Dolfin receiver that can barely make the #4 spot and say "We should use this little Welker guy with that older has-been who's stinkin' up the Raiders and really make some noise". Then there are people like you who can't see greatness until his stat sheet is filled with wins.

[tryfuhl]

We haven't rebuilt the O-Line, we've just had a carousel. When something is built that means that it's done, we're currently building the O-Line. Past years should tell us that depth is very important.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

I made my peace with Beneil months ago. You guys should do the same. He's just a passionate fan. He does have good points from time to time.

Friend from another board?

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by Beneil (diehard since 87)

Okay, now you're just TRYING to be mean. I didn't say that IIIII learned from watching The Blind Side. I said any idiot can watch blindside and see how important an OT is. And why is the whole " 'O-line' is not a position" thing even part of your argument!? You're just being aimlessly facitious. My point is obvious. The Center and Tackle opposite the strating QB's throwing arm are the two most important positions to have GREAT PLAYERS in my opinion but as a whole, the ENTIRE OFFENSIVE LINE doesn't need to be AWESOME but have depth. If you disagree on THAT then say your side, but to focus on the fact that O-Line is not the name of a specific position is stupid. You're acting like i said "Oher is the best Center ever!" or something. I said LT was important, then in a seperate sentence i say Center is important, so you put the two together and practicaly call me a moron. Nice. Us Redskins fans are always looking out for eachother.

The problem is this. You make a paragraph long rant about QBs we "gave up on". Multiple folks here pointed out your factual inaccuracies and hindsight observations. Then you go into another mini-rant about repeating the past, that ends with "Injury prone QB" and "Crappy line". That argument gets blown up...again with facts and reality, and you go off to something else. Now you want to cry foul...c'mon.

As for not rebuilding the OL in a single offseason, we pretty much already have. (though not an UPGRADE)
Think. How many O-Linemen did we start with last year and how many of them are here now? The best we had is gone and most of them are new faces. Some that weren't here or starting all year are still around, others retired or got dropped and even the ones that had a few decent games, like Levi Jones, are gone. We ARE rebuilding... just not improving. Your description of our O-Line alone shows that I am right. I guarantee that starting 5 this year won't have but maybe 2 names at the MOST from last year. The bench may have one as well, but i'm calling that a rebuilt o-line... i just hope it's an improvement.

We haven't done jack to our OL outside of bringing in Hicks and some camp fodder. Our starting OL, based on who we have now (and counting our 1st pick on LT) will likely be: LT - 1st rd pick, LG - Dock, C- Rabach, RG - Hicks, RT - Heyer. But....the draft hasn't happened, there are other cuts to be made, etc., etc., etc. The O/L is not anywhere near to a finished product. We have plenty of holes on this team, otherwise we wouldn't have been 4-12. Those holes won't all be filled in a single off-season. But one hole we did fill, at least in the short term, is at QB.

And finally, you cna say 20/20 all you want. The fact is that i only been on this site for so long. If I had a computer when i was a kid and this site was around, i would've been making post after post against losing the players that i mention seeing something in. I was saying it then and I'm typing it now. it sure as heck was NOT hindsight 20/20 on MY behalf. Right now, i'm saying the same thing about Jason Campbell. though I hope we keep him because if our O-LINE POSITIONS aren't drasticly improved, my 'cleo'-like prediction is that McNabb is gonna get hurt behind it and i'd rather have Jason in than Rex. I see a lot in Campbell. If on a team with a decent line, i "predict" HE'LL have a ring before he's done too. Just because you were wrong about players in the past doesn't mean everyone else was too. Some people can look at a short Dolfin receiver that can barely make the #4 spot and say "We should use this little Welker guy with that older has-been who's stinkin' up the Raiders and really make some noise". Then there are people like you who can't see greatness until his stat sheet is filled with wins.

Certainly your top-flight scouting abilities are beyond question. Without knowing what your other all-seeing, all-knowing, predictions are (that aren't after-the-fact) we'll just have to see how the JC thing pans out. I'm making my prediction (and have in numerous other posts) that JC will be nothing more than a back-up and if he gets a ring, he'll have about as much to do with winning it as Chase Daniel did to get his.

[Beneil (diehard since 87)]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Actually, you're wrong about Doug Williams...but that won't stop you from defending your error I suppose

uh huh... I was wrong, his worst season was 5-11.

You know, you guys are right! As a Buc, his 31 wins, 34 losses, and one tie as practicaly SCREAMS 'Superbowl record breaker' if you think about it! You're right. As soon as I saw is best season of 76.8 rating i would've forgotten all about the two years where he rated in the lower 50's. Wow! If his early work would've inspired you to hire him, i bet you must LOVE Jason Campbell! His first buc season was 5-11, then they went 10-6... which would be cool if they didn't just end up going to 5-10-1 the next season (WAY better than JC), but i guess his final 9-7 season is what really told you he was destined for greatness.

No... i bet it was his 14-22 record as an Arizona Outlaw in the USLF that you guys saw that cemented in your mind that THIS was the guy!

Look, though the latest Superbowl winning QBs are upper echelon like Manning, Brady, and Brees, One: the change that GOT them to the big game is improved defense, improved o-line (+insane kicker), and improved defense respectively. A great QB breaks records like Dan Marino, but alone is as useless as having only Barry Sanders. Fill the stat books but not win championships. Also, without the other pieces, a great player can be hidden behind lacklust stats due to the rest of the team. If you just look at wes welker in Miami, especialy just his stats, you do NOT see him as the guy you have to game plan around. TWO: there are PLENTY of Superbowls that were won by teams with QBs that dont' have the IT factor. If IT factor was all it took, Dan Marino would have more rings than fingers and Trent Dilfer would DEFINATLY not have a ring. Rex Grossman sure as hell wouldn't have had a superbowl appearance either.

[Beneil (diehard since 87)]

Oh and no, i dont' think we'll have a "Perfectly Rebuilt Offensive Line" by week one. That's one of the main reasons I question the McNabb signing.

[SolidSnake84]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Friend from another board?

No, i just know him from here. Him and Me got into it pretty hard over a Clinton Portis argument last fall, but eventually the dust settled and we made peace lol.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by Beneil (diehard since 87)

If you just look at wes welker in Miami, especialy just his stats, you do NOT see him as the guy you have to game plan around. TWO: there are PLENTY of Superbowls that were won by teams with QBs that dont' have the IT factor. If IT factor was all it took, Dan Marino would have more rings than fingers and Trent Dilfer would DEFINATLY not have a ring. Rex Grossman sure as hell wouldn't have had a superbowl appearance either.

Welker has never been "gameplanned around". Randy Moss is a guy that's gameplanned around, that opens things up for Welker.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Beneil (diehard since 87)

uh huh... I was wrong, his worst season was 5-11.

You know, you guys are right! As a Buc, his 31 wins, 34 losses, and one tie as practicaly SCREAMS 'Superbowl record breaker' if you think about it! You're right. As soon as I saw is best season of 76.8 rating i would've forgotten all about the two years where he rated in the lower 50's. Wow! If his early work would've inspired you to hire him, i bet you must LOVE Jason Campbell! His first buc season was 5-11, then they went 10-6... which would be cool if they didn't just end up going to 5-10-1 the next season (WAY better than JC), but i guess his final 9-7 season is what really told you he was destined for greatness.

No... i bet it was his 14-22 record as an Arizona Outlaw in the USLF that you guys saw that cemented in your mind that THIS was the guy!

Dripping sarcasm noted....Anyway, in his 2nd year in the league, Williams was the QB of a team that went to the NFC Championship game (I think, not positive off hand). A team that was only in ts 4th year of existence.

But I'm not even sure what your point was in the first place.

Look, though the latest Superbowl winning QBs are upper echelon like Manning, Brady, and Brees, One: the change that GOT them to the big game is improved defense, improved o-line (+insane kicker), and improved defense respectively. A great QB breaks records like Dan Marino, but alone is as useless as having only Barry Sanders. Fill the stat books but not win championships. Also, without the other pieces, a great player can be hidden behind lacklust stats due to the rest of the team. If you just look at wes welker in Miami, especialy just his stats, you do NOT see him as the guy you have to game plan around. TWO: there are PLENTY of Superbowls that were won by teams with QBs that dont' have the IT factor. If IT factor was all it took, Dan Marino would have more rings than fingers and Trent Dilfer would DEFINATLY not have a ring. Rex Grossman sure as hell wouldn't have had a superbowl appearance either.

IT factor is, of course, not all it takes but more often than not a team won't make a Super Bowl without a franchise QB.

Though I'm still not sure what your point is in all of this. And what your rants about Rypien, Humphries, and Gannon were all about

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by Beneil (diehard since 87)

Oh and no, i dont' think we'll have a "Perfectly Rebuilt Offensive Line" by week one. That's one of the main reasons I question the McNabb signing.

i am curious - why did you wait until 1987 to become a diehard skins fan?

[tryfuhl]

Yeah I didn't bother replying to most of that because I didn't see it going anywhere.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by Beneil (diehard since 87)

Oh and no, i dont' think we'll have a "Perfectly Rebuilt Offensive Line" by week one. That's one of the main reasons I question the McNabb signing.

So by your logic, we should wait until we upgrade the OL before we look to improve the QB postion, correct?

[tryfuhl]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

So by your logic, we should wait until we upgrade the OL before we look to improve the QB postion, correct?

Yeah, apparently you have to prioritize order outside of the draft too!