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With the 19th Pick, the WFT selects....

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Old 04-22-2021, 10:46 AM   #61
NYCskinfan82
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Re: With the 19th Pick, the WFT selects....

Micah Parsons is not falling to us and 19, but if he did it you should hand that card in immediately.
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Old 04-22-2021, 10:47 AM   #62
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Re: With the 19th Pick, the WFT selects....

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Originally Posted by SkinzWin View Post
This is a great article about Micah Parsons.

https://www.pennlive.com/pennstatefo...-blessing.html
His mom thinking about murdering him as a baby has zero relevance to his draft status.

It's a local feel-good article about a Penn State player.


There are legitimate reasons so many teams do not want to draft him.

He may actually fall to 19 and if we're in a gambling mood on character issues, we might take him. It bit us hard with Guice last time we tried to overlook character issues.



Id rather take Zavan Collins or Owusu-Koramoah.
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Old 04-22-2021, 11:11 AM   #63
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Re: With the 19th Pick, the WFT selects....

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Originally Posted by NYCskinfan82 View Post
Micah Parsons is not falling to us and 19, but if he did it you should hand that card in immediately.
Absolutely a no brainer. But like you said, there's zero chance he's there at 19.
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Old 04-22-2021, 11:13 AM   #64
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Re: With the 19th Pick, the WFT selects....

If there weren't this crazy infatuation with this year's "top 5" QBs, he'd be gone inside 5. He still might be.
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Old 04-22-2021, 11:19 AM   #65
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Re: With the 19th Pick, the WFT selects....

CB Asante Samuel ... thats my pick as who we take. A bit early but some reports have him being the best CB in the draft, bit undersized, CB is not a huge need now for us but I think they go BPA based on their board and they have Samuel high.

edit - I dont think I would take Samuel at 19 personally, trade back into late1st yes but not at 19. This is my guess on what the skins will do.

Last edited by SunnySide; 04-22-2021 at 12:50 PM.
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Old 04-22-2021, 11:54 AM   #66
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Re: With the 19th Pick, the WFT selects....

WFT should stick at 19 and take whichever player is ranked highest on this list who remains available when they pick:

1) Trevor Lawrence
2) Zach Wilson
3) Penei Sewell
4) Kyle Pitts
5tie) Jaylen Waddle
5tie) Ja'Marr Chase
7) Justin Fields
8) Micah Parsons
9) Trey Lance
10) Caleb Farley
11) DeVonta Smith
12) Patrick Surtain
13tie) Rashawn Slater
13tie) Christian Darrisaw
15) Mac Jones
16) Teven Jenkins
17) Jeremiah Owusu-Koramoah
18) Zaven Collins
19) Alijah Vera-Tucker (G-T versatility)

There are some edge dudes that belong in this top 19 list, but like F we need an edge. Boy does it feel good to say that.
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Old 04-22-2021, 11:55 AM   #67
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Re: With the 19th Pick, the WFT selects....

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Originally Posted by Schneed10 View Post
WFT should stick at 19 and take whichever player is ranked highest on this list who remains available when they pick:

1) Trevor Lawrence
2) Zach Wilson
3) Penei Sewell
4) Kyle Pitts
5tie) Jaylen Waddle
5tie) Ja'Marr Chase
7) Justin Fields
8) Micah Parsons
9) Trey Lance
10) Caleb Farley
11) DeVonta Smith
12) Patrick Surtain
13tie) Rashawn Slater
13tie) Christian Darrisaw
15) Mac Jones
16) Teven Jenkins
17) Jeremiah Owusu-Koramoah
18) Zaven Collins
19) Alijah Vera-Tucker (G-T versatility)

There are some edge dudes that belong in this top 19 list, but like F we need an edge. Boy does it feel good to say that.
Good list. I want to make my own top 19 big board (specific to our team) prior to the draft.

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Old 04-22-2021, 04:24 PM   #68
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Re: With the 19th Pick, the WFT selects....

OT Christian Darrisaw

LB JEREMIAH OWUSU-KORAMOAH
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Old 04-22-2021, 05:35 PM   #69
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Re: With the 19th Pick, the WFT selects....

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Originally Posted by skinsfan69 View Post
History shows 2 or 3 out of the 5 that will go in the first round will bust. Jones to me isn't even a first rounder.
Physical talent, maybe not even a 2nd rounder.
But QB is 90% mental and mechanics. We see all sorts of athletic freaks, Jackson, Newton, etc., who never win big because they can't read Ds super fast mentally, aren't accurate, etc. Brees, Manning, Brady, Montana, guys in playoffs (or were) year in and out, are much more like Jones than any of QBs rated higher except of course Lawrence.
Not saying I know, but you see so many great athletes who can't ever elevate mentally, and never have to correct mechanics because they always take off running. Pocket passers win long term in NFL. So lots of teams may place a premium on a guy they KNOW has that 90% of game down and is elite mentally, even if some athletic limitations. Again not saying I know, but the interesting thing is that people who know QBs--professionals who feed their families scouting--disagree so strongly.
Lance and Fields may never be able to read a D and be pocket passers and could be total busts. Jones may never have the arm to punish you deep, but should be at least a serviceable starter. Which is a greater liability? I do not know, but opinions vary. I would say I would feel a hell of a lot better taking a guy like Jones near 20 rather than top 10.
Lance's arm strength is really intriguing, but he should be rated 2nd or 3rd round, but sheer demand of market drives that price much higher and always will for QBs. So what do you do?
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Old 04-22-2021, 10:16 PM   #70
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Re: With the 19th Pick, the WFT selects....

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Originally Posted by Chief X_Phackter View Post
But I thought he had all kind of character issues and red flags that would cause him to slide...
I heard the same thing. They talked about it at length the other day on SiriusXM NFL Radio, one incident was in high school. Another was alleged with a civil suit against his college by a former teammate (safety) but he was not named directly in the suit. The other issue was some comments made on social media while being recruited by Ohio State and they wound up ghosting him. A couple of people I have heard have couches for his character and said his issues were in high school when he was younger.
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Old 04-23-2021, 01:42 AM   #71
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Re: With the 19th Pick, the WFT selects....

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Originally Posted by SkinzWin View Post
I heard the same thing. They talked about it at length the other day on SiriusXM NFL Radio, one incident was in high school. Another was alleged with a civil suit against his college by a former teammate (safety) but he was not named directly in the suit. The other issue was some comments made on social media while being recruited by Ohio State and they wound up ghosting him. A couple of people I have heard have couches for his character and said his issues were in high school when he was younger.
You don't magically become a fundamentally different person in college. You don't win drafting criminals, period. Maybe it never becomes an issue, but not worth the risk. We just cut wasted 2nd round pick (Guice), plus Dunbar and others, you don't take those risks with 1st round picks.
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Old 04-23-2021, 02:44 AM   #72
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Re: With the 19th Pick, the WFT selects....

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Scalper, tell me who the franchise LT is at 19
I'm not a professional scout, LOL.
I think Sewell long gone. Darrisaw viewed as equal good pass run blocker, Slater as better pure pass blocker, but both very good. I'd be happy with either. Most pundits have those as the big-3 tackles, top 3, with dropoff to next tier. Whether that is accurate I cannot say. Then you have about 8 tackles with 2nd round grades. A couple are certainly going to pan out better than others, but which ones? Different people have different opinions. I don't want to spend a 1st round pick on LT to get elite run blocker, it is a high leverage position because it protects your QB from the Chase Youngs of the world. I also don't want to spend that pick on a player we slide to G permanently (the Scherff problem of owing a G $20M end of rookie deal, McL drafted him saying he's a T). I want the best pass protector, and one that is elite.

If you have the next 8 tackles all rated about same, no reason you couldn't trade down and still get franchise LT. You could also trade end of 1st round and pick non-5 QB you like to make sure you get him.

Leatherwood viewed as dominant run blocker first. So is Jenkins. Cosmi played both Ts, prefer someone who was strictly LT (flashed athleticism to be unequivocal LT). Eichenberg and Tucker short arms, many project to G. We don't need at G at 19. Tucker some list as 4th T and in group with the top-3 going top-20. Carman not dominant pass blocker. Eichenberg seems more like RT. And so forth. Radunz they talk about at G, but seems like could play T, but like him better 2nd round. Little bit of x-factor. Tucker, if you believe he's a LT, seems more like end of 1st round pick. I only see three players that unequivocally make sense at LT at 19, Sewell, Slater, Darrisaw, but most think all three gone by 19. If you assume all 5 QBs gone, plus Pitts Chase, that is 10 picks. Parsons should be off your board for character flag, but hopefully someone takes him first, 11 picks. Then you figure couple edge rushers, couple more WRs, takes you to 15. Figure 2 corners, 17. At 19 you might BPA be looking at a corner, Farley or Horn. Maybe DL or Moehrig gets taken before us, maybe not. Think some good WRs could be there also, but I get feeling based on signing basically NO ONE at LB in FA, that we will go LB early in draft if not 1st round.

I don't love TOK. He's a playmaker, but he's basically a S at LB. Going to take a beating in NFL being so light, not unprecedented, and you could do worse, would certainly end some of torching in coverage, but I see big RBs running outside a lot with him there and getting big gains. . . You still have to rate him higher than most of the second tier LTs though.

I would rather take a CB or WR at #19 if BPA, we can't tie up any more major money at either position in FA for several years except to extend McL, so having guys on rookie deal not dumb, and can extend after Samuel or Jackson deals expire. That is probably smartest LONG TERM move, fill one of 5 high leverage positions and lock it up long term, assuming player you are picking scouts out as 10 year starter. We could, in particular, use a third CB, and Fuller much better in slot, to say nothing of nickel, injury, etc.

It sucks such thin draft for FS at top.

I basically don't love anyone available when we pick, barring QB or LT falling, one of top ones. If you are determined to fill need at LB with LT and QB not available (2 high leverage positions), rather than going BPA which is probably WR or CB, then I would trade back to late 1st early second, pickup 2-3 add'l picks, and draft one of second-tier LTs or a LB or QB. How much better is JOK than Cox or Davis? If you could trade back to say 45 and add a 2nd round pick, and get Cox or Davis instead of JOK and a LT or QB, do you? I do. Simply because bust rate is 50%, you add two more picks, you get 1 more non-bust. We have been basically adding 3 starters and 1 solid backup per draft, with about 8 picks or so, recently. I would trade back and try and make that 5 starters and 2 solid backups, to continue filling out our roster.

That being said, I would not be surprised to see FO take JOK and fill biggest need that can be filled (there being no FS, QB, LT, etc.). If lots of players we like are gone early, trade down offers limited, and good value trade up, I could also see them moving to 10 or 14 or so and drafting QB. Whatever they will do, what I would do is trade down every time I could. I would call all 31 teams for every pick, field all trade down offers, and take any reasonable offer I could get, with emphasis on (1) pick this year's draft, (1) add'l pick this years draft and (1) pick next year's draft. I would gladly trade a 2nd for a 3rd and 4th this year and a 3rd next year, for example. I'd do that 5 times if I could. Then you have 3 3rds and a 4th this year, I'd trade a 3rd for a 4th, 5th this year, plus a 4th next year (you'd really need one other pick to make sense), and so forth. You basically bump every pick down a round to pick up 1 add'l pick minimum, ideally 2 add'l and one next year. You then have 4-5 more picks this year, 3-4 more next year, for what in aggregate represents surrendering 2nd round pick, though I'd trade 1st as well. This again reflects philosophy that more lottery tickets better. I would do this every year until we have 10 picks per year minimum 3 years out, and until entire roster rounded out without having to sign 10 guys in FA every year. Only exceptions are franchise LT and franchise QB.

Many teams placing big premium on future picks this year, however, because COVID has so many players not playing who may never regain their peak form.
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Old 04-23-2021, 02:53 AM   #73
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Re: With the 19th Pick, the WFT selects....

If Parsons is there, I could see FO taking him despite character flags, while offering usual platitudes about having done their HW on him, etc.

I think we need a true thumper in middle more than anything else, even coverage LB, but you don't have to spend a super-high pick on one.
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Old 04-23-2021, 08:45 AM   #74
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Re: With the 19th Pick, the WFT selects....

There is some talk that if SF doesn't take Fields , he will slide to the teens
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Old 04-23-2021, 08:49 AM   #75
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Re: With the 19th Pick, the WFT selects....

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Originally Posted by skinsfaninok View Post
There is some talk that if SF doesn't take Fields , he will slide to the teens
If that happens I doubt he'd get past NE
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