Tom "Iceman" Brady

You will soon realize you can not use any fact, stat or accomplishment of Bradys that might be better than Mannings.
If you point to the terrible games Manning had in the playoffs, Mr. GTripp0012 will blame the Colts offensive line, defense or the other teams incredible defense. Everyone else is to blame for Mannings terrible playoff performances other than Manning.But what in gods name does Brady do better than Manning. IMO, he moves around better in the pocket. That's it.

The reason this is such a dead end arguement for the Brady guys is because theres absolutely ZERO evidence that Brady does even one thing better than Manning. He doesn't complete more passes. He doesn't get more yards, he doesn't get more TD's.

His offenses score significantly less (this is a team stat, so you may dismiss this arguement as a product of his offensive unit, although Manning has significantly more control of this unit than Brady does over the final outcome of games).

That's the thing, NO stats favor Brady. Part of that is Manning's offense, but mostly it's because he's jsut better, plain and simple.


i don't understand your logic, maybe it's just me but you seem to want to discredit brady's stats, and yes there are plenty of stat in his favor, you choose to call them "team stats" but yet you want to give all credit to manning for his completions and his passing yardage and his qb rating when you know very well just as much credit should be given to his recievers.

But what in gods name does Brady do better than Manning. IMO, he moves around better in the pocket. That's it.

He throws the ball to the players that are actually on his own team in the playoffs better.

He throws the ball to the players that are actually on his own team in the playoffs better.Does he? I think its pretty equal, ESPN posted the stats yesterday.

i don't understand your logic, maybe it's just me but you seem to want to discredit brady's stats, and yes there are plenty of stat in his favor, you choose to call them "team stats" but yet you want to give all credit to manning for his completions and his passing yardage and his qb rating when you know very well just as much credit should be given to his recievers.But WHY should I see those team stats as anything more than having a superior team (as his team is quite obviously superior, evidenced by the wins)? What's your reasoning that they SHOULDN'T be discredited in a debate about individual players, not teams? Every other piece of evidence says that Manning outplays Brady. So why all of a sudden does Brady get more credit for doing less?

But WHY should I see those team stats as anything more than having a superior team? What's your reasoning that they SHOULDN'T be discredited in a debate about individual players, not teams? Every other piece of evidence says that Manning outplays Brady. So why all of a sudden does Brady get more credit for doing less?

but isn't it reasonable for manning to have better stats in certain areas because he has superior recievers ? when you say "superior team" are you speaking of offense , defense or both because it is debatable as to which team has had the best offense over the past few seasons.

but isn't it reasonable for manning to have better stats in certain areas because he has superior recievers ? when you say "superior team" are you speaking of offense , defense or both because it is debatable as to which team has had the best offense over the past few seasons.Yes, its very reasonable to say that Manning's stats are improved by his offensive teammates. But I don't think it comes close to explaining the massive distance he continues to put between himself and Brady year after year. There's a small minute possibility that if Harrison and Wayne are the two greatest recievers ever, that it may explain the enitre gap in production.

I don't buy it. Harrison and Wayne don't help Manning out after the catch nearly as much as Santana does for us. Is Joseph Addai really a better runner than Dillion or Maroney? For that matter, was Edgerrin James really that much better? He hasn't been so hot in Arizona.

Players who leave Indy's offense traditionally don't have success other places. Who could blame them?

there is a poll question on redskins.com that asks "if you were a GM starting a team who would be your pick at qb"

choices are brady, manning, breeze and grossman

brady is leading with 55.3 %
manning is 2nd with 29.6 %

over 55 % of skins fans can't be wrong :)

Superior team refers to the offense, the defense, and special team. Superior team means if the teams played 100 times on a neutral field, I believe that the team I deem superior would win significantly more times than it lost.

If their stats were close, I wouldn't bother arguing it. My beliefe is that Manning is SO much better that it would be foolish to say otherwise. I don't expect everyone to agree with me, or even the majority. But I do want to see people who think Brady is the leagues best QB defend him with evidence that says he's the leagues best QB, not that he's a winner or clutch. If you say that, you havent said anything. Jake Plummer's a guy who is both a winner and clutch. There's a bunch of guys in the league who I'd rather have than Plummer. We have two on our team right now.

Superior team refers to the offense, the defense, and special team. Superior team means if the teams played 100 times on a neutral field, I believe that the team I deem superior would win significantly more times than it lost.

i'd say they were probably close overall over the last few seasons
just from what i remember i'd give an edge to the colts on offense,an edge to the pats on defense and sp.teams was pretty much even until the post season.