Free Trade: Fight It, or Embrace It

and in your comparison, sure country a will have more money in their pockets. but without jobs, they are holding on to it. thus, part of the economic mess we are into right now. people are very wary of losing their jobs. i know a ton of people that are really nervous about their financial future. in theory, more skilled people should make more money, and with better jobs. its that big transition to that period that scares the hell out of me

Actually, you wouldn't like what would happen if every country had to enact the same labor laws we have here. Prices for everything would be SO much higher. Your standard of living would take a direct hit because of it.
i dont disagree with this. but the american workers future would be much more secure because of it. ill take higher prices any day of the week, if it means 10 years from now i still have my job

i dont disagree with this. but the american workers future would be much more secure because of it. ill take higher prices any day of the week, if it means 10 years from now i still have my job

Problem is that anybody outside of the manufacturing sector would disagree with you, from a purely financial standpoint. Aside from manufacturers, not too many people would willingly accept 8-10% inflation just so manufacturers could keep their jobs. Most in the country would ask that manufacturers simply find another line of work.

and in your comparison, sure country a will have more money in their pockets. but without jobs, they are holding on to it. thus, part of the economic mess we are into right now. people are very wary of losing their jobs. i know a ton of people that are really nervous about their financial future. in theory, more skilled people should make more money, and with better jobs. its that big transition to that period that scares the hell out of me

Saving money instead of spending it will temporarily hurt the economy, you're right, but the money still stays in our citizens' hands and will eventually be spent when the economy turns back around.

You'll note that even after the worst recession ever, the Great Depression, the economy still turned back around and bounced back. Same thing will happen here. Next year jobs will be back on the rise in the US, they just won't be manufacturing jobs. They'll be healthcare jobs more than anything (Uutrasound techs, MRI techs, radiology techs, nurses, pharmacists, etcetera).

But that's not what put us into a recession in the first place. We got here because too many people borrowed money when they couldn't afford to pay it back.

This is a sticky situation and it's such a delicate and intricate situation you really can't tell what would happen. Yes, China has made mistakes with the lead paint, etc. However, we are so far in debt to China they could call in their debt and wreck us. China has more or less paid for the war in Iraq, they've been buying up our debt by the shit ton. So taking our business away from China could yield terrible results too.

I definitely feel for the laborers. I've done manual labor for a while. From when I finished high school for a few years and now I work summers doing manual labor. I don't think the doom and gloom is quite there. While many of the large companies will pack up, there will be small businesses that it's not worth to leave the country due to initial costs, importing, shipping time, etc.

I really do hate the environmental standards in many of these foreign countries. Honestly, I'm not very happy with the united states precautions. I recently read an article about the Ganges river in India and the extent of it's pollution is disgusting. Some of it is from poor sanitation (dumping human waste from cities into a river is a bad idea), but a lot of it is from toxic chemicals.

For the sake of America's economy, it's necessary to outsource. As people have mentioned, the price of American labor would shoot the price of products up by a ton and I doubt wages would follow that. I feel like a lot of the manual labor that can leave, more or less has. Lots of manual labor will still be needed within the US. I see us going outside the country a lot more for software development and help desk (even more than now) as we go forward.

i dont disagree with this. but the american workers future would be much more secure because of it. ill take higher prices any day of the week, if it means 10 years from now i still have my job

the problem with this is that having that job will mean so much less because prices are higher.

Economics as a guide utilizes the macro view while what you are focusing on is the micro view. Schneed is simply saying that for our country as a whole it would be better to continue to foster free trade in much the same way that we have been. It may be at the expense of some people but not at the ultimate expense of ALL people. Theoretically though it is the best for EVRYONE in a pure competitive environment. The key term is competition. Competition defines free trade and in competition some lose. It is its nature. Is that a bad thing? I guess that is the ultimate question that we constantly face in this country.

I would say that as to manufacturing jobs leaving this country: I really don't care. It is easy for me to say because it does not affect me for sure but my thoughts go back to competition. If a factory goes out of work then jobs will ultimately be created somewhere. Maybe not in that community but somewhere. Those workers need to be able to find other work. They are probably mostly very dilligent, honest and loyal workers and people like that are in demand. If they can't find a job in their community then they need to be ready to pick up and move to where they can find a job. If an entire communtiy is ruined by a factory closing then shame on the community for laying all its eggs in one basket. Local communities all over the US pump billions of dollars a year into Economic development to avoid such situations.

Now that is an exteremly simplified view point and I don't really subscribe to that in the cold hearted way it comes accross. But I think we forget that competition means survival of the fittest which means everyone needs to be trying or they'll get left behind. I find it difficult to have much compassion for those who don't try.

the problem with this is that having that job will mean so much less because prices are higher.

Economics as a guide utilizes the macro view while what you are focusing on is the micro view. Schneed is simply saying that for our country as a whole it would be better to continue to foster free trade in much the same way that we have been. It may be at the expense of some people but not at the ultimate expense of ALL people. Theoretically though it is the best for EVRYONE in a pure competitive environment. The key term is competition. Competition defines free trade and in competition some lose. It is its nature. Is that a bad thing? I guess that is the ultimate question that we constantly face in this country.

I would say that as to manufacturing jobs leaving this country: I really don't care. It is easy for me to say because it does not affect me for sure but my thoughts go back to competition. If a factory goes out of work then jobs will ultimately be created somewhere. Maybe not in that community but somewhere. Those workers need to be able to find other work. They are probably mostly very dilligent, honest and loyal workers and people like that are in demand. If they can't find a job in their community then they need to be ready to pick up and move to where they can find a job. If an entire communtiy is ruined by a factory closing then shame on the community for laying all its eggs in one basket. Local communities all over the US pump billions of dollars a year into Economic development to avoid such situations.

Now that is an exteremly simplified view point and I don't really subscribe to that in the cold hearted way it comes accross. But I think we forget that competition means survival of the fittest which means everyone needs to be trying or they'll get left behind. I find it difficult to have much compassion for those who don't try.

Excellent post. Goes right along with my way of thinking. If you lose your job you may have to face the fact that your next one may be in a different locale. Or you're going to have to find out what some of your community's "needs" are and fill that hole.

the problem with this is that having that job will mean so much less because prices are higher.

Economics as a guide utilizes the macro view while what you are focusing on is the micro view. Schneed is simply saying that for our country as a whole it would be better to continue to foster free trade in much the same way that we have been. It may be at the expense of some people but not at the ultimate expense of ALL people. Theoretically though it is the best for EVRYONE in a pure competitive environment. The key term is competition. Competition defines free trade and in competition some lose. It is its nature. Is that a bad thing? I guess that is the ultimate question that we constantly face in this country.

I would say that as to manufacturing jobs leaving this country: I really don't care. It is easy for me to say because it does not affect me for sure but my thoughts go back to competition. If a factory goes out of work then jobs will ultimately be created somewhere. Maybe not in that community but somewhere. Those workers need to be able to find other work. They are probably mostly very dilligent, honest and loyal workers and people like that are in demand. If they can't find a job in their community then they need to be ready to pick up and move to where they can find a job. If an entire communtiy is ruined by a factory closing then shame on the community for laying all its eggs in one basket. Local communities all over the US pump billions of dollars a year into Economic development to avoid such situations.

Now that is an exteremly simplified view point and I don't really subscribe to that in the cold hearted way it comes accross. But I think we forget that competition means survival of the fittest which means everyone needs to be trying or they'll get left behind. I find it difficult to have much compassion for those who don't try.

Well-put. The micro vs macro view is definitely what separates the two viewpoints. If your job is the one at risk, naturally you're going to find it hard to focus on the greater good. But whoever is running the country, they need to.

As my previous posts indicate, I am pretty "pro-globalism." I don't think that there is much we can or should do to fight the effects of the global economy (e.g., manufacturing jobs leaving the U.S.). However, I do think the government ought to at the very least consider offering programs or incentives to encourage people in the manufacturing sector to seek and gain new skill sets.

As my previous posts indicate, I am pretty "pro-globalism." I don't think that there is much we can or should do to fight the effects of the global economy (e.g., manufacturing jobs leaving the U.S.). However, I do think the government ought to at the very least consider offering programs or incentives to encourage people in the manufacturing sector to seek and gain new skill sets.

Perfect. To me this is a fantastic way of the government helping people. Instead of fixing the market they fix the workers. What's the saying?

"Give a man a fish, feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish, feed for a lifetime."

This would such a better use of resources and time rather than artificially influencing a market in a way that long term won't work anyways.

I guess once again education is the magic bullet.