Pretend you are the Skins' GM...

Wow, you really like to hear yourself type, don't you? :D

You are blatantly undervaluing and underestimating Torain. When healthy, he's an explosive runner who is capable of being a Top 15-20 RB in the league. Yes, I just said that. He's a young player, only 24. If he can overcome his early injury troubles and remain on the field for a few years, he'll be as valuable as Portis was for us.

Hightower was not brought here to be a #1 back. He has never held that role before and is not expected to here. He'll likely be a 3rd-down back because of his red zone success and his pass blocking abilities. With the loss or Portis, we needed a new RB who could block when needed. Hightower should fill that role on passing downs. Keiland Williams at FB should also help in that duty.

A Torain/Helu tandem is too valuable to break up for an aging cornerback. If we were to rely on a rookie and a timeshare back going foward, that's risky. Depth at RB, an injury-prone position is more important than acquiring a big name CB who would be marginally-better than other options like Grimes or even Wilson who we already have...without the risk of making a division rival stronger, again.

Also, you claim that the running game is some ancient form of play that has become obsolete...yet teams with strong running games like Baltimore, the Jets, Kansas City, Eagles, Giants and Texans are some of the stronger teams in the league. Even the Patriots ranked higher in rushing (9th) than passing (11th) last year. Rushing teams are not weak, outdated teams destined to failure as you claim.
NFL - Statistics by Team - Yahoo! Sports (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/stats/byteam?group=Offense&cat=Rankings&conference=NFL&year=season_2010&sort=523&timeframe=)First, you can't read. Because you're responding to points I never made. And you're doing that poorly.

No one ever said teams with strong rushing games don't do better than teams with weak rushing games. However, you've tried to prove that non-assertion correct, and did a horrible job, using team rushing YPG as evidence.

If you were better at reading, you might have tried to prove that Ryan Torain actually could contribute to a strong rushing team. You may have either found yourself to be wrong (unlikely), or you might have made a case based on some flimsy evidence and high on personal attacks (more likely).

Your case, in logical format:

1) Ryan Torain is just 24 years old.
2) Ryan Torain is capable being a Top 15 to Top 20 NFL runner
3) Ryan Torain can overcome early career injury troubles to become a top 15 to 20 runner.
4) Tim Hightower is being brought in to play on third downs, with Torain on first and second downs.

Conclusion:
5) If you break up a Helu/Torain tandem, your team will lose more because of it.

Points 3+4 kind of decrease the likelihood that you are right on Torain's upside. But I think you're biggest mistake is that you're treating Torain's 24 as young, without giving the same benefit of youth to the other RBs on the Redskins roster who don't have obvious injury issues. Torain is not younger than the average Redskins RB. And he is not likely to play 16 weeks on the Redskins roster this year.

Given all the above, it would seem foolish to hold him in higher regard than someone like Jeremy Jarmon, who was a third round draft pick and just 24 years old when Washington traded him this offseason. But on the difference of opinion regarding Torain's upside: to each their own.

I would just point out to reach upside, opportunity to do so must be abundant. As a Shanahan RB, I'm not sure why Torain would get enough opportunities to reach that upside while every other player rots on the bench.

An assertion I can make, all else equal: a Helu/Keiland tandem is stronger in both youth and ability than a Torain/Helu tandem.

straight up trade samuels for buchanon? lol

straight up trade samuels for buchanon? lol

Great idea. The Skins get a better CB AND Samuels is younger than Buchanon so the team can get younger at the same time.


Quick, get Joe Banner on the phone and see if he's interested...

Nah, I'm actually pretty happy with what we've done this offseason. We are going younger, future rather than bigger, now. I'd rather remain consistent than make a trade for Samuel which runs contrary to all of our other moves.

the eagles should just thrown in a reacharound and send him to us for nothing after selling us on that mcnabb trade last year!

Nah, I'm actually pretty happy with what we've done this offseason. We are going younger, future rather than bigger, now. I'd rather remain consistent than make a trade for Samuel which runs contrary to all of our other moves.

Another great point...we've done a lot of work to cut our the older and declining players (like Samuel) from our roster to get younger.

Continuing that route can only benefit the team long-term. If we were one CB away from contention...go ahead and deal for Samuel (without giving up our starting RB). We're a few years away...better to go with youth.

it would be different if we are one player away from a super bowl,but we are'nt so we should just leave things as they are.

Well, first, I think Torain is in that "traded because he won't make the team" category along with Holliday and Jarmon.....

A runner who is useless to us and a third round pick seems like a good price for a guy who would be our no. 1 CB.First off, in our current situation (rebuilding) no way I trade for Samuel.

I don't think Torain fits into the same category as VH and Jarmon. VH is an older player and we just signed two expensive FAs on the interior DL. VH was expendable. Jarmon doesn't fit our scheme, he's more of a 4-3 end, not big/strong enough to play 3-4 DE, not quick/mobile enough to play LB.

Torain has value for the Skins and is certainly not useless. Not sure why you're so down on him. He's a consistent runner who can move the chains and carry the ball 18-24 times per game. He had some very nice games for us last year. Doesn't appear to have a fumbling problem. Can get in the end zone. Doesn't get tripped up by long blades of grass (sorry, had to throw in a cheap shot at Portis). He averaged 4.5 YPC and the team average was 4.2 YPC. He and Hightower are the only two backs on the roster that have over 70 carries in the NFL (KW has 65 and only carried more than six times in an NFL game twice, those two games Torain was out). Torain was 13th in the NFL in YPC.

RT needs to work very hard on pass blocking, but if a RB has the "want to" he will improve his pass blocking. It can be taught.

Hmmm wonder if Darrell Green will come out of retirement... seems hes old but probably faster and better. or has a HoF member ever come back to play or are they not allowed after retiring for 5+yrs

Torain has value for the Skins and is certainly not useless. Not sure why you're so down on him. He's a consistent runner who can move the chains and carry the ball 18-24 times per game. He had some very nice games for us last year. Doesn't appear to have a fumbling problem. Can get in the end zone. Doesn't get tripped up by long blades of grass (sorry, had to throw in a cheap shot at Portis). He averaged 4.5 YPC and the team average was 4.2 YPC. He and Hightower are the only two backs on the roster that have over 70 carries in the NFL (KW has 65 and only carried more than six times in an NFL game twice, those two games Torain was out). Torain was 13th in the NFL in YPC.I wasn't aware that someone that loses yardage on three out of ten carries can wear the "consistent" label. That's...a really, really low bar. In fact, 100% of NFL running backs qualify as consistent. No running play is a bad running play!

Well, okay. I'll halfheartedly buy the bolded argument. I don't see him as a Top 15 to 20 back in the league, but for this Skins team, fine. Someone has to carry the ball besides Helu.

Maybe I was wrong about Hightower. I suggested that Hightower was going to force Torain off the roster. Maybe its the opposite. Hightower will play on the punt team and cover kicks and that actually saves Torain's bacon.

Not an optimal use of our personnel, but if we're more focused on Torain's YPC average than doing what it takes to win, yeah, I could see that.