Absolutely Stunned.
 

I can't believe we let every single one of our decent UFA's escape. Smoot and Pierce were important pieces to our puzzle. I feel Pierce is a lot more replaceable than Smoot, but they were both very good players. Everyone on thewarpath, like always, preached stability. We all thought someone with a level head would be able to keep the spending to a minimum.

Then the Coles situation popped up. I was a bit suprised, but then after stepping back and thinking about it his moves kinda make sense. I was never for a trade of Coles no matter what, but what's ridiculous is us removing our 10.5M signing bonus from the table when Smoot went to the Vikings and trying to lowball him. Sorry, he's worth at least 11M in my mind. Especially when we're going to spend a long season seeing Harris get beat like a rented horse.

I am really starting to feel Gibbs should NOT be President of this team. There's a reason he won in strike years/with great talent scouts by his side. These moves are absolutely miserable. Add 6 Million dollars to Moss's current salary and tell me he's worth that! I don't think any sane person will tell you he is. Not to mention he's going to want his payday next year and chances are he'll walk which means we traded Coles for a one year WR.

Losing Smoot really chaps my ass because it's not like the Vikings gave him an offer that blew him out of the water, we pulled back our offer (which was fair, and would have been worth going into a bidding war with MN with up to 11 - 11.5 M.) Instead we decide to pull back our offer and try to lowball him. I have a feeling this is all Gibbs since Snyder isn't exactly known for lowballing. Especially a fan favorite and team leader in Smoot.

I didn't want anything this offseason, but more importantly I didn't want to lose anything. We got an F in both categories.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

This offseason sucks. We signed Rabach and Patten which were two good moves. After that this thing really sucks. I really feel like we took a step back this offseason.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

It's been frustrating, but as most people have said here over the past month let's stop worrying about "winning" in March. Because lately winning in the springtime hasn't provided many positive results in the fall. Maybe our luck will change this year

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

Smoot - the whole point is I didn't want to "win" in march. I just didn't want to lose anyone!

Rabach was a great signing, Patten I'm not sold on -- we'll see.

Time to start drinking.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

[QUOTE=smootsmack]It's been frustrating, but as most people have said here over the past month let's stop worrying about "winning" in March. Because lately winning in the springtime hasn't provided many positive results in the fall. Maybe our luck will change this year[/QUOTE]The last couple years we have won in March and sucked during the real season maybe this year we swap??? Man do I hope!!!

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

every other offseason everyone thought we did amazing and we end up sucking during the season
now everyone thinks were having a terrible offseason so maybe we'll do good during the season


my bad...i didnt see that post above

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

The more I think about us losing so called loyal players the more I think about what we are becoming. The patriots a few years back and also now, minus corey dillon, what other big names did they have. How many times did their FO sign big name players and give out ridiculous contracts/signing bonuses, zero. This year Gibbs is focusing on team players that want to win, its looking like the what the patriots have been doing for the past 5 years. It will take time to gel, with Ramsey now the leader with fast, smaller receivers, he will look a lot like brady dumping the ball off on short routes. Also our workhorse portis can run down hill like dillon does for the patriots. The signing of Patten will give Gibbs more of an idea of how the patriots are doing it consistently in the NFL without big names on team. I dont doubt gibbs at all.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

No. Wrong. Go to jail, go directly to jail do not pass go.

What everyone else is seeing as a clusterf***, I see as management taking a new (and better) fiscal line. Get rid of players who don't want to be here, take the hit now to increase flexibility, give good solid offers to good players but don't overpay.

One season Daseal, he has had one season. Last year he gets blasted for paying too much for Griffin, Washington and Springs and now for being too frugal. Maybe, perhaps just maybe, the fiscal strategy of the team is changing. In doing so, and for the next year or so, we may lose a good player or two.

This league is ALL about coaching. In each case, Smoot, Coles and Pierce, coaches feel like they have replacements. One of the first things Gibbs said after the season is that they would be taking a hard look at ALL their receivers. Read the Walters article, I get the feeling the Skins don't think Coles toe is gonna get better. Pierce? He's a MLB for pete's sake, Williams kicked ass w/out LaVar - He will kick ass without Pierce. Smoot, a tougher pill to swallow, but still there were several articles about Williams not being sold on Smoot. They made a solid offer, clearly within the market - and Smoot rejected it.

It's JG's 2nd offseason - and he doesn't appear to be making the same mistakes he made last year. Hmmmmm, maybe he DOES learn.

But you're right. Gibb's should be fired. A new offense installed and, while we're at it - let's just blow the whole damn team up for the 5th straight year and start from scratch. It has worked so well in the past.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

Unfortunately, Danny Boy has a bad habit of low-balling his current players. Sometimes it comes back to bite him - and the team - in the ass.

Remember they could have restructured Chirs Samuels in January for several million less as a signing bonus AND with a team option to get out of year 6 of his cotract. But Danny Boy decided to play hardball - translation: lowball him - and when the market ran away from him, he had to raise the bid fast or get nothing in terms of restructuring done with Samuels.

Pierce got more $$$ from NY - not a team known for wild and crazy spending.

They played hardball with Smoot too thinking that he would not command a better deal and would come back to them and they could hammer him some more. Sorry, another FO miscalculation.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

[QUOTE=JoeRedskin]No. Wrong. Go to jail, go directly to jail do not pass go.

What everyone else is seeing as a clusterf***, I see as management taking a new (and better) fiscal line. Get rid of players who don't want to be here, take the hit now to increase flexibility, give good solid offers to good players but don't overpay.

One season Daseal, he has had one season. Last year he gets blasted for paying too much for Griffin, Washington and Springs and now for being too frugal. Maybe, perhaps just maybe, the fiscal strategy of the team is changing. In doing so, and for the next year or so, we may lose a good player or two.

This league is ALL about coaching. In each case, Smoot, Coles and Pierce, coaches feel like they have replacements. One of the first things Gibbs said after the season is that they would be taking a hard look at ALL their receivers. Read the Walters article, I get the feeling the Skins don't think Coles toe is gonna get better. Pierce? He's a MLB for pete's sake, Williams kicked ass w/out LaVar - He will kick ass without Pierce. Smoot, a tougher pill to swallow, but still there were several articles about Williams not being sold on Smoot. They made a solid offer, clearly within the market - and Smoot rejected it.

It's JG's 2nd offseason - and he doesn't appear to be making the same mistakes he made last year. Hmmmmm, maybe he DOES learn.

But you're right. Gibb's should be fired. A new offense installed and, while we're at it - let's just blow the whole damn team up for the 5th straight year and start from scratch. It has worked so well in the past.[/QUOTE]

Good points JoeRedskin..........

That is exactly what the Doc Walker articles said.....Gibbs was doing things behind the scenes to find "his kind of guys". Joe is getting things setup and trying to undo 13 years of bad managing. I'm sorry we lost Pierce and Smoot, but we shouldn't be fools and overpay either. Last year Williams put in some unknown guys and they did well, so I think we will be okay on defense, let Williams work his magic . Having Arrington back in the lineup should help the defense and Williams can find a replacement for Smoot. Our offense looks better with Rabach at center, a healthy Jansen and we may not have the fastest, but we havew 2 decent WR's.....and could pick up an extra draft pick for Gardner.....so all is not lost.
KEEP THE FAITH!

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

Hope our draft is better..........

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

I'm not all that unhappy that we saved some money by not re-signing Smoot. I think that we have a replacement on the team that will step in and play better (yes, I said it) than Smoot has. Smoot was a great personality to have on the team, and was an above average player. I do not believe, though, that he is irreplaceable in this defense. He had his flaws (how many times did he miss a sack on a corner blitz because he jumped on a pump fake?).

I'll miss him, and Pierce for that matter, but I just don't think the defensive play will drop off considerably because of their departure.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

First off, NOBODY should be surprised that we lost Smoot. We all saw the writing on the wall.

That said, Joe Redskin for President. He's right, this team needs smart management. No more overpaying for players. No more winning the offseason. No more installing new offenses. No more integrating new players. No more new defensive coordinators. No more short-sighted planning.

The Skins are being smart with the situation they're in. Not enough people here on the Warpath are focusing on years 2006 and beyond, in my opinion. Everyone is concerned what happens to our cap in 2005, but nobody's talking about how much better our 2006 cap looks now. I'm very excited, because when I look at it now it's telling me that we can actually keep our players and not have to blow up the team like the Titans did.

Bad things about this year:
- Lost Smoot
- Lost Pierce
- Lost Coles

Good things about this year:
- The same D coordinator as last year (hasn't happened in a long ass time).
- Ramsey starting for a full season, instead of for only 7 games.
- A team atmosphere, getting rid of the players who don't want to be here.
- An O-line with stability, in the same scheme as last year (they'll jell faster this year).
- More draft picks than last year.
- Ramsey growing in the offense.
- Healthy Jansen.
- Healthy Lavar.
- Casey Rabach
- David Patten
- Santana Moss
- A pledge by Gibbs to go deep and use the speed he just acquired at WR.

Not being able to keep our free agents was frustrating. But I think when all we ever talk about is offseason moves, we forget the situation the team takes into next season. All those positives are the reasons we're going to be better than we were last year.

Playoffs baby, playoffs.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

Let's ask ourselves this very simple question, are the losses of Smoot, Pierce and Coles going to doom our 2005 season?? I'd be willing to bet there is an entire team and coaching staff that would beg to differ.

Pierce wasn't even on our radar before Barrow went down. I loved him last year but let's not forget Marshall filled in and did a very admirable job in Arrington's place, in fact, we had guys filling in left and right on the D and they never missed a beat.

We lost one of the top corners in the league just a year ago in Bailey and the D actually improved after he left. Go figure. Smoot is a nice young corner but he won't be impossible to replace.

As for Coles, he's a better overall WR than Moss, but Moss isn't exactly a piece of crap either. The loss of Coles is a case of addition by subtraction.

The past few offseasons we've been spoiled by all the splashy signings, only to spend all year complaining about how the team throws money around too much and we're doomed to end up in cap hell.

Now the team is showing some financial sensibility and all we hear is how we should have upped the ante on Pierce, we should have upped our offer on Smoot...we can't have it both ways guys.

Much like in Marty's first year here when he cleaned house a bit to get the team back in a solid financial state, Gibbs seems to be taking the same approach. They have a financial plan and they're holding strong and not putting an individual's demands above the needs of the team as a whole.

I know it's been a while since we didn't win an offseason so obviously some people are going to scratch their heads and wonder why we just don't outbid everyone in sight, but hey, welcome to the way the rest of the league operates.

The sky isn't falling guys, everyone around the league is losing valuable members of their teams right now. This isn't a problem exclusive to the Washington Redskins.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

[QUOTE=Daseal]Smoot - the whole point is I didn't want to "win" in march. I just didn't want to lose anyone!

Rabach was a great signing, Patten I'm not sold on -- we'll see.

Time to start drinking.[/QUOTE]

I agree, man. I don't know wtf we're thinking this offseason. I love the signings we made, but I would have liked to have kept Smoot or at least signed an adequate replacement.

As for the drinking part...I'm not legal yet, but now that I've been accpted to Tulane School of Engineering, I'm sure I'll find time. That's right I'll turn 21 about 3 weeks after I get there. :laughing2

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

In all seriousness, though, college announcements aside. We finished with a losing record with em, I'm sure we can do it without em.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

i won't lose any sleep over the departure of smoot, he's not really that good anyway. some people like him because he is out spoken and kinda cocky but he always talked a better game then he played. he was 2nd to bailey, then he was 2nd to springs.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

After letting the emotions settle down.......... I think Cpayne, Schneed, and Matty are right regarding the overspending for free agents ....and there is some good signings
at center, WR I'm pleased with Patten, and a healthy Arrington and Jansen should improve the team from last year. Coles was just a no win situation.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

Smoot - Pierce - Coles + Arrington + Jansen + Rabach

While I don't like all the losses, we could be okay.

I'm trying real hard to see the positive here.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

[QUOTE=jdlea]In all seriousness, though, college announcements aside. We finished with a losing record with em, I'm sure we can do it without em.[/QUOTE]

Right, it's not like we're a team coming off a Super Bowl win, we're a team that's been mired in mediocrity for the last decade and it's going to take some time, patience and tough decisions to right the ship.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

i blame this on coles. he killed our cap number so we had to take away our offer to smoot, otherwise we would not be able to sign our draft picks. o well the draft has to be very good :party-smi

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

C'mon everybody...relax. After off-season after off-season of big free agent signings and huge contracts maybe there has been a realization that we need to exercise some sanity. I trust Gibbs that he doesn't need Coles and Gradner and likes Moss, Patten and our younger receivers. I trust Williams when he says that we'll be fine without Smoot and Pierce. It's not like this was a super-bowl contending team!! Let's see how this plays out over the draft and the season. I can't wait till next season when everybody is talking about the brilliant offseason moves the skins made to take care of the financial aspects of the team and plugging ANOTHER set of no-names (and that is exactly what Pierce was) into a top level D.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

smoot left for more money , not because the skins"supposedly" lowerd their offer. the vikings are paying more money over the first three years than the skins could afford.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

[QUOTE=jdlea]I agree, man. I don't know wtf we're thinking this offseason. I love the signings we made, but I would have liked to have kept Smoot or at least signed an adequate replacement.

As for the drinking part...I'm not legal yet, but now that I've been accpted to Tulane School of Engineering, I'm sure I'll find time. That's right I'll turn 21 about 3 weeks after I get there. :laughing2[/QUOTE]

Congrats on Tulane!

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

I'm not worried by this offseason at all. Could it be better? Yes, but I've watched so may "great offseasons" turn into crap regular seasons that maybe it is time for something else. Coles and Smoot were not taking us to the Superbowl anytime soon. I'm not penciling in a losing season just yet.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

It is not good news that Smoot and Pierce have gone,but long term i think it could be.

I trust that Williams will be able to plug players in, Wild or Harris for Smoot, Marshall or Barnes for Pierce.

We now have several ways we can go in the draft, either CB/WR, or trade down, so we are not tied to one particular position or guy.

In effect we are getting 2 new signings anyway with the return of a healthy Jansen and Lavar.

The main thing i like about this off season is the continuity. There are players who have been here for numerous seasons and had a new co-ordinater every year so they are starting from scratch every year. This season the majority of the roster will already know what is expected, and that has to be an advantage.

All in all id say we are about even cos Coles is no great loss if he didnt want to be here.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

Finally, no more kid in a candy store mentality!! We are finally seeing how a true front office should be ran in the off season! I hate to see Smoot go, but ya know, the world doesn't end without him. I hate to see Pierce go, but again, we can move along without him!

I just can't seem to understand this:Alot of us here complain about how we throw money around at big name players, and then the off-season we don't do that, the same people complain about our new found frugal approach to the office season. What's more is, alot of people are blaming the front office and Joe Gibbs for the Coles situation. That situation was completely on LC. He wanted out and I am sorry, but just because the offense isn't built exactly the way he wanted it doesn't give him a free pass to want out after one season in this system and two seasons with the team. Has anybody, including Coles realized that his injured toe hendered his full potiential? I will say that Coles is probably an all-around better receiver than Moss WHEN he is healthy. However, I would rather take a healthy Moss over an unhealthy Coles. Would you guys rather us not get anything out of the Coles situation? I heard on the television the other day that what we should have done was force Coles to stay with the team and if he didn't want to play, deactivate him. How would that be a better situation for us??? We would be without a receiver!! Maybe it would be better on the cap situation, but ya know, this wasn't our fault! If Coles decided to keep his mouth shut and play next season, then we wouldn't have been in that situation. With the exception of Brunell, look at what we have gotten since Gibbs has arrived! How can we say this team is taking a step back??? Haven't we learned from that 2000 season (or was it 2001?)

I say hurray for us "losing" in March so we can look forward to winning in September, October, November, December, and hopefully January!

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

Matty:

As usual, you are a voice of reason and logic here on the board. The 2005 season is not over and done with already; neither is it one in which a Super Bowl appearance would be expected.


Schneed10:

You pointed out "bad things" that hapened in this offseason and all of them are facts; there's no "ifs" or "maybes" associated with them.

Then you listed a whole menu of great things that have happened to the Skins recently - - without noting the "ifs" and "maybes". So let me try to do that for you:


Good things about this year:

- The same D coordinator as last year (hasn't happened in a long ass time).

Very true regarding the continuity from year to year. Of course this is only a real blessing if all the players who return this year will play up to - or better than - the level they played at last year AND the subs stepping in for Pierce and Smoot play as well or better. Gregg Williams made ZERO tackles last year and he will make ZERO tackles this year.


- Ramsey starting for a full season, instead of for only 7 games.

Ramesy will start in September. Health and winning games will determine if he starts for a full season.


- A team atmosphere, getting rid of the players who don't want to be here.

Very dangerous to list this as a positive. Who knew that Coles would be one of the players to "ask out"? If that is the atmosphere here, what happens next January if Arrinigton and Portis decide to get pissy and want to leave? Just cut 'em and hope they get injured for their new teams because all we want here are "true Redskins"? Be careful what you wish for...


- An O-line with stability, in the same scheme as last year (they'll jell faster this year).

They damned well better jell faster than last year because if they don't Ramsey will not last the year - see point above about him needing to maintain his health to play a full season. You are also assuming that no one on the O-Line gets injured during the year AND that Dockery actually shows to be a productive OL at the NFL level. Both could happen but neither is a 100% lead-pipe certainty.


- More draft picks than last year.

Oh good. We get to pick up the new versions of Rod Gardner and Andre Johnson this year. That'll solidify things for years to come...


- Ramsey growing in the offense.

You've assumed here that you have not already seen the limits of Patrick Ramsey's productivity. I hope you're right, and I know that he has some impressive physical skills - not including any that have to do with his legs and feet! - but so far he hasn't shown them to be enough to do what is REALLY important in the NFL. What is REALLY important is for a good QB to win more games than he loses. Stats are for losers. The only stat people quote about Tom Brady is "three".


- Healthy Jansen.

99% chance you're right on here...


- Healthy Lavar.

I'm not nearly as certain with this one as you are.


- Casey Rabach

Better than Cory Ramer or Lenny Friedman or any of the other jamokes who have played center here for the past few years. But don't get carried away. He ain't going to Canton when his playing days are over unless it's to take his kids to see the NFL Hall of Fame and he buys a family day pass.


- David Patten

Clearly an upgrade over Rod Gardner as the #2 WR. Clearly an upgrade over an INJURED Lavernaeus Coles as a #1 WR. Clearly not a premiere WR in the NFL. If this is your lead pony in a passing attack, you'll be reminded of the Eagles several years ago when their lead pony was James Thrash.


- Santana Moss

I like Moss. I don't like that he has a reputation of not wanting to go over the middle. Maybe that will change here because he won't have to play against Sean Taylor and be terrified about what Taylor might do to him. Oh wait, that's not a good argument because he didn't have to play against Taylor much for the last few seasons either... And Moss has the negotiation leverage with Danny Boy for a contract so get set for that tussle. And if that tussle goes poorly, maybe Moss will be part of that Redskins team atmosphere where you get rid of guys who don't want to be here?


- A pledge by Gibbs to go deep and use the speed he just acquired at WR.

If that OL doesn not perform much better than last year, you will leave a plunger-footed Patrick Ramesy back there waiting to "go deep". Do that too many times and you will witness the rebirth of Mark Brunell under center for your Washington Redskins.


Just keepin' it real...

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

I believe some people emphasize players more than the team on a whole. Can you possibly think Greg Williams' system will not survive without Smoot? :oink:

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

The past 5 off-seasons:

2000: Bought a bunch of big names and "won the off-season", which turned a 10-6 playoff team into an 8-8 team with an interim coach.
2001: New coach and FO structure got rid of or lost a lot of players. Started out horrible at 0-5 and almost had a mutiny, but turned it around to end up 8-8.
2002: Another new coaching staff and back to the old FO structure, made a couple splashes on D, but went for "cheap and available" players on O, and slipped to 7-9.
2003: Same HC, but lost a top DC, Went after talented, younger players, but overpaid to get some of them...still made a big splash. Slipped to 5-11.
2004: New HOF coach and very experienced staff. Went after a couple big name players and a few up-and-comers, lost a pro bowl CB. HC seemed to take a while to get back in the swing of things, but the D ruled under another top DC. Went 6-10.

So the best seasons compared to the previous were the Marty year and last year....and considering that Marty's team arguably had a lot less talent than the 2000 team, so I'd say that was the best improvement. So I'm VERY curious to see the 2005 team without making a big splash in FA for the first time since 2001.
Yeah it hurt losing Pierce and Smoot, but as someone else said, EVERY team loses good players. That's the nature of how it is set up. To me Smoot leaving hurts a little more, not necessarily for his play, but he just seemed like a true Redskin....put it like this: If Lavar is the "face" of the Redskins (player-wise...overall it has to be Gibbs), Smoot was most definitely the "voice".

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

[QUOTE=sportscurmudgeon]- David Patten

Clearly an upgrade over Rod Gardner as the #2 WR. Clearly an upgrade over an INJURED Lavernaeus Coles as a #1 WR. Clearly not a premiere WR in the NFL. If this is your lead pony in a passing attack, you'll be reminded of the Eagles several years ago when their lead pony was James Thrash.
[/QUOTE]

SC- Some very good points, but I have one question: Just how good did the Eagles do with Thrash as their lead pony? Oh yeah, the NFC runner-ups! I know, he most definitely was not the sole reason they got there, but it shows it can be done (success without a true #1 WR)....and I'm sure many Skins fans would love the Redskins to be in that position.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

[QUOTE=Gmanc711]This offseason sucks. We signed Rabach and Patten which were two good moves. After that this thing really sucks. I really feel like we took a step back this offseason.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, kinda sucks! I had better hopes. But performance-wise, losing Coles and gaining Moss is a wash. Coles dropped too many passes and didn't have the elusiveness that he used to have. Losing Pierce and Smoot hurts our defense, but I have great faith in GW. Gaining Rabach and Patten helps our offense, but it's the scheme that's hurts us.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

[QUOTE=SkinsRock]SC- Some very good points, but I have one question: Just how good did the Eagles do with Thrash as their lead pony? Oh yeah, the NFC runner-ups! I know, he most definitely was not the sole reason they got there, but it shows it can be done (success without a true #1 WR)....and I'm sure many Skins fans would love the Redskins to be in that position.[/QUOTE]

Let's not worry too much about who we have as a receiver. We have plenty of speed, talent and athleticism at that position. Once we benched Brunell and Ramsey got going, I think the real problem was our inability to give Patrick time to throw.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

[QUOTE=SkinsRock]SC- Some very good points, but I have one question: Just how good did the Eagles do with Thrash as their lead pony? Oh yeah, the NFC runner-ups! I know, he most definitely was not the sole reason they got there, but it shows it can be done (success without a true #1 WR)....and I'm sure many Skins fans would love the Redskins to be in that position.[/QUOTE]

they have mcnabb though to make up for it.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

[QUOTE=Tahoe Skin]Let's not worry too much about who we have as a receiver. We have plenty of speed, talent and athleticism at that position. Once we benched Brunell and Ramsey got going, I think the real problem was our inability to give Patrick time to throw.[/QUOTE]

Very true.

The line and Ramsey's inexperience in the system and in general played a big part in the lack of an effective passing game. Hopefully both of those areas will improve this year along with a more aggressive downfield attack from Gibbs.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

[QUOTE=That Guy]they have mcnabb though to make up for it.[/QUOTE]

True, but the Eagles didn't have a Clinton Portis, either. They had the three-headed monster of Staley, Westbrook and Buckhalter-- but none of those guys inspired defenses to put 8 men in the box with any regularity. Staley and Buckhalter had one or two good rushing games a year, and Westbrook has been more or less a wide receiver out of the backfield. It's not like the Eagles were loaded on offense prior to acquiring Terrell Owens last season. Pre-T.O., McNabb was the only player on that offense that really made defensive coordinators wake up in cold sweats.

The Skins may not have Coles and Gardner, but look at how splendid this offense was with those two players as the top wideouts. People have been crying for the Skins to get rid of Gardner for years-- with good reason, and Coles is certainly not the weapon he used to be. The fact is, this offense couldn't get much worse than it was last season. Patten, while unheralded, is a reliable receiver who will actually catch passes that hit him in the hands, and Moss, while not the tough-guy that Coles was, will provide the deep threat that Coles can no longer claim to be. This offense, believe it or not, tried to go deep last season. The reason there weren't many long completions is that the receivers struggled to get open deep, and the quarterbacks were forced to go to their shorter options.

With Moss and Patten, that may change. With Coles and Gardner, I doubt it would have improved.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

at first, i was as shocked as everyone about how our core guys were leaving, but after reading gibbs' reasoning in today's post article, i'd have to say i agree with him...

they didn't want to pay our RFAs more than guys who were playing similar positions at equal or better levels of performance. I know the market each year calls for higher salaries, but it's only a year removed from paying out Marcus Washington and Shawn Springs... in the cases of Pierce and Smoot, they didn't necessarily outperform Washington and Springs last year. if the FO pays the RFAs more just a year later than signing Marcus and Shawn, what message does that send to them?

I'd understand if Springs was in the last year of a 5 year contract and Smoot demanded a substantial amount more than him (market inflation)... but it's only been one year and Springs and Washington performed at least equally to Smoot and Pierce. I actually like this precedent, if the Skins are going this way.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

I understand your point, but I would still have spent the extra $800,000 to keep Smoot and chalked it up to inflation. I think Walt Harris played very well when he spelled Smoot, but still Smoot is quite a talent.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

I hated to see Pierce go over a small amount of money.Synder should have paid. Smoots put himself above the team. We will be fine without him.My concern is the QB.

Re: Absolutely Stunned.
 

Yeah, money is DEFINITELY doing some talking this offseason. I've said it once and I'll say it again, Gibbs is setting a precedent for how he's going to handle signings in the offseason (with the exception of the Coles scenario.)