Redskins Win In Appeals Court

[bigmarley4]

I apologize if this link is posted elsewhere in this thread. My lawyer friend sent me this story, more about the lawfirm than the Skins specifically:

Quinn Emanuel Associate Has Reservations About 'Redskin' Victory - Above the Law - A Legal Tabloid - News, Gossip, and Colorful Commentary on Law Firms and the Legal Profession

[BringBackJoeT]

Has this already been posted? I just saw it on Yahoo. Nothing sharp in the analysis here. It's just a rant.

No excuses: Redskins need a new nickname - NFL - Yahoo! Sports

Originally Posted by BringBackJoeT

Has this already been posted? I just saw it on Yahoo. Nothing sharp in the analysis here. It's just a rant.

No excuses: Redskins need a new nickname - NFL - Yahoo! Sports

I know 99% of this board will disagree with me but that article is spot on imo.

[skindeep]

I read the article and the guy just trying to piss off skins fans with his ignorance. I have indian blood in me and it not that upset hell it might be the reason I root so passionatety for my team. Hell the guy needs a hugg or a role model something.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by Brian Orakpo

I know 99% of this board will disagree with me but that article is spot on imo.

These arguments are almost always made by "intelligentia" to showcase their enlightened viewpoint and hammer on how historically the U.S. treated the NAs, or media types to get web hits and sell columns, or NA activists with either an ax to grind, publicity to get, or $$$ to make.

Bottom line, the Skins are a private entity, if folks don't like the name, don't buy tickets, buy merchandise, or watch the games. If someone has a problem, make another on-line petition like the one with 48 signatures mentioned earlier in the thread, and get it to DS (good luck with that).

From Sports Illustrated's article 'The Indian Wars"
"Indeed, a recent SI poll suggests that although Native American activists are virtually united in opposition to the use of Indian nicknames and mascots, the Native American population sees the issue far differently. Asked if high school and college teams should stop using Indian nicknames, 81% of Native American respondents said no. As for pro sports, 83% of Native American respondents said teams should not stop using Indian nicknames, mascots, characters and symbols. Opinion is far more divided on reservations, yet a majority (67%) there said the usage by pro teams should not cease, while 32% said it should."

[Skins4L]

Originally Posted by BleedBurgundy

spelling- baaad!

lol

but anyways this whole thing is retarted. glad we won that shit.

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

Bottom line, the Skins are a private entity, if folks don't like the name, don't buy tickets, buy merchandise, or watch the games. If someone has a problem, make another on-line petition like the one with 48 signatures mentioned earlier in the thread, and get it to DS (good luck with that).

Yes they are a private entity and no one is forcing anyone to watch Redskin games or buy merchandise. At the sametime on some level the team name is racist. I kinda find it funny in todays society that there is still a sports team with a racial slur as their team name.

I think its kinda sad when people start throwing out terms like "private entity". Thats kinda saying I know its a racial slur but people cant do anything about it so deal with it. That same attitude was the same attitude this Country had against African-Americans until the race stood up for themselves. The problem is their arent enough Native-Americans to really voice their anger over the team name imo compared to other races in this Country.

Like I have said before I have no huge problem with it because I do know that the team honors Indians and they dont mean for the team name to be offensive. As A Redskins fan im happy we still have the team name. At the sametime I do realize that it is also used as a racial slur. I do believe in time the team name will be changed. It may be 50 years from now but it will be changed soon enough.

As for the online petition those really mean nothing either way. Im sure the number of Indians who find the name offensive is alot higher than 48. The problem is when compared to the rest of this country the Indian population is quite small. If it was any other race of people the team name was offending the team name would of been changed a long time ago.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Rajmahal33

I think that it's pretty funny that the very term "Indians" itself is a misnomer that we can thank European colonists for. I, being an Indian indian, could go on this crusade to stop the term Indian from being misused to label Native Americans. But is it really worth it? What is that going to achieve?

It's not about what divides us but what unites everyone that these minority advocacy groups should be focusing in on. Ultimately, it should be about moving forward and gaining sympathy for your cause.

Haan Ji. you spit the truth

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by Brian Orakpo

...

At the sametime I do realize that it is also used as a racial slur. I do believe in time the team name will be changed. It may be 50 years from now but it will be changed soon enough.

...

Maybe in 50 years we will have had enough of lawsuits and PC'ness, and people will be amazed that any lawsuits were ever filed anyways.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by Brian Orakpo

I think its kinda sad when people start throwing out terms like "private entity". Thats kinda saying I know its a racial slur but people cant do anything about it so deal with it. That same attitude was the same attitude this Country had against African-Americans until the race stood up for themselves. The problem is their arent enough Native-Americans to really voice their anger over the team name imo compared to other races in this Country.

Please be clear, I am NOT saying, "I know it's a racial slur, but people can't do anything, so deal with it." I don't believe it to be a racial slur or I would agree with you. The faux outrage of NA activists on this issue really should make one look deeper at what their real motive is.

There are many names or things that can be perceived by one group or another to be offensive. There are many team names other groups may find offensive; Fighting Irish (focus on the drunken Irishman stereotype), Saints (atheists would find this offensive), the Razorback symbol at Arkansas or the "Hogs" (offensive to some Muslims as a pig is a low form of animal). The term "Redskin" and the N-word are two vastly different things. If you survey African Americans and ask if the N-word is a racial slur and if they would be against the term being used for a sports team, I'm pretty sure you'd get a 99%+ percent that the term is offensive. There is no positive or neutral connotation for that word at all. Yet in a survey of NA people, that the vast majority don't have a problem with NA team names, including Redskins, is very telling.

Do a Google search on "redskin" and the autolinks that come up are all about the Redskin team. Here is also an interesting read about the origins of the term Redskin, certainly not a negative or racist origin.

http://anthropology.si.edu/goddard/redskin.pdf

If you know Redskin team history, the name came about because the owner was honoring the coach who was NA and he also wanted to separate the team from the Braves name they had before. If the coach didn't resign or protest the team name, then I'd say we're on pretty solid ground here. This issue has only come about more recently in the PC world we live in.

The problem is when compared to the rest of this country the Indian population is quite small. If it was any other race of people the team name was offending the team name would of been changed a long time ago.

The size of NA population in the US has nothing to do with it. As I referenced in my last post, the problem is the NA team name issue offends NA activists and those with an agenda, not the NA people in general. Keep in mind it wasn't just African American folks who stood up for civil rights in this country, it was a consolidated effort by members of all races. If it was only African Americans, based on population count, we would not have made the progress towards racial equality that we have.

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

Maybe in 50 years we will have had enough of lawsuits and PC'ness, and people will be amazed that any lawsuits were ever filed anyways.

Yeah that sounds good lets just say the hell with it and start using racial slurs for all 32 NFL teams.

I never understood how people can be upset at things that are PC. They wouldnt be PC if people hadnt came up with these racial slurs in the first place. If people in this country back in the day wouldnt of been so racist towards other groups who werent like themselves we wouldnt have groups being PC and asking for things to change.

The bottom line imo is if this was any other race and we were using a racial slur against them as our team name it would of been changed by now.

I like our team name and history. I love how we take pride in Native Americans and take the field to honor them. I can understand the other point of view that our team name is offensive though. If it isnt changed great if it is great. No matter how much I like our team name and history and what it stands for I realize that it offends others.

I know most Redskin fans dont see what the big deal is but if the roles were reversed I think they would understand. Nowadays everyone is equal in this country and have rights so the team name isnt as big of a deal so most people dont care. For the people it offends though I can see their point of view and it does make sense.

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

I don't believe it to be a racial slur or I would agree with you. The faux outrage of NA activists on this issue really should make one look deeper at what their real motive is.

Check a list of racial slurs on any website. It lists Redskin as a racial slur. It might not have been how the team meant it but it is a racial slur.

Heres a list for you (some of these words are very offensive so anyone who clicks the link be aware of this)..........

List of ethnic slurs - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

There are many names or things that can be perceived by one group or another to be offensive. There are many team names other groups may find offensive; Fighting Irish (focus on the drunken Irishman stereotype), Saints (atheists would find this offensive), the Razorback symbol at Arkansas or the "Hogs" (offensive to some Muslims as a pig is a low form of animal). The term "Redskin" and the N-word are two vastly different things. If you survey African Americans and ask if the N-word is a racial slur and if they would be against the term being used for a sports team, I'm pretty sure you'd get a 99%+ percent that the term is offensive. There is no positive or neutral connotation for that word at all. Yet in a survey of NA people, that the vast majority don't have a problem with NA team names, including Redskins, is very telling.

Most of those examples you gave arent racial slurs so there is a huge difference. As for the difference between the N-Word and Redskin the only difference is the number of these races in the US. If you flip flopped the number of people of these races in the US people wouldnt have a problem with the N-word as a team name.

As for NA people who dont have a problem with it thats because the times are different. Just like the amount of African-Americans who think the N-word is racist has declined. If you polled NA at earlier times the number would be higher. Another reason some NA dont think the word Redskin is racist is because nowadays people arent as racist as they use to be in this country. If you dont hear the word directed toward you as a racial slur but only as the name of a football team they would probably not think the word is racist. I bet if they had a talk with their ancestors they would have a different view on the word. Any NA who understands the true meaning and how it was used towards them would say it is racist.

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

Do a Google search on "redskin" and the autolinks that come up are all about the Redskin team.

Well that makes sense I would think if you googled the word Redskin alot of the top listing would be of the football team. I dont see how that means Redskin isnt a racial slur. You could google every NFL team name and most of the top responses would be of that team.

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

If you know Redskin team history, the name came about because the owner was honoring the coach who was NA and he also wanted to separate the team from the Braves name they had before. If the coach didn't resign or protest the team name, then I'd say we're on pretty solid ground here. This issue has only come about more recently in the PC world we live in.

Yes we were the Boston Braves in 1932 and changed our team name to the Boston Redskins in 1933. Just because the coach didnt protest the team name doesnt mean it isnt a racial slur towards NA.

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

The size of NA population in the US has nothing to do with it. As I referenced in my last post, the problem is the NA team name issue offends NA activists and those with an agenda, not the NA people in general. Keep in mind it wasn't just African American folks who stood up for civil rights in this country, it was a consolidated effort by members of all races. If it was only African Americans, based on population count, we would not have made the progress towards racial equality that we have.

Ok well I have to just agree to disagree here. Let me ask you this if we flip flopped the number of each race in this country and everything that happened between whites and these races over the last several hundred years for starters. Now lets say our team name was the Washington N-words. Would you feel the same way as you do about the word Redskins?

All im saying in this thread is no matter how many people think its a racial slur or not the bottom line is a racial slur is a racial slur. I do believe the Redskins team never meant for the name to be racist. I do understand the people who think the word is racist because of the way it has been used against NA.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by Brian Orakpo

Check a list of racial slurs on any website. It lists Redskin as a racial slur. It might not have been how the team meant it but it is a racial slur.

This list also includes: Canuck, Dutchman, Eskimo, Husky, Jock, Yankee, and my favorite "cheese-eating surrender monkey"

Most of those examples you gave arent racial slurs so there is a huge difference.

The druken Irishman sterotype isn't offensive??? If I'm an atheist a team name of Saints pushes religion on me and that's offensive. If I'm a Muslim, especially if playing for them, that Hog on the helmet is offensive.

As for NA people who dont have a problem with it thats because the times are different. Just like the amount of African-Americans who think the N-word is racist has declined. If you polled NA at earlier times the number would be higher. Another reason some NA dont think the word Redskin is racist is because nowadays people arent as racist as they use to be in this country. If you dont hear the word directed toward you as a racial slur but only as the name of a football team they would probably not think the word is racist. I bet if they had a talk with their ancestors they would have a different view on the word. Any NA who understands the true meaning and how it was used towards them would say it is racist.

Interesting how you believe to know how the NAs surveyed by SI think and you state your belief as fact????

All im saying in this thread is no matter how many people think its a racial slur or not the bottom line is a racial slur is a racial slur. I do believe the Redskins team never meant for the name to be racist. I do understand the people who think the word is racist because of the way it has been used against NA.

I would argue that the opinion of the people you perceive as being slurred is infinitely more important than anyone else's

[EARTHQUAKE2689]

Why dont we just call them the Washington 53 man roster??? And that same nickname for all the other teams

[SkinDogg]

Originally Posted by SBXVII

You know what if they don't like the name don't root for the team. Everyone thinks we all should think a like. It's every where even in Gov. We elect people to sit in Washington and make decisions as to what we as a society would want and they vote on it no matter if it's the popular vote or not.

People are way too politically correct. Which is why I love Carlos Mencia. I just wish people would not try to force their oppinions of what I should watch or listen to on my radio. If you don't like it change the channel.

Please don't believe the hype, Carlos Mencia is an actor trying to get paid.