Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

[SmootSmack]

One minute you're saying Shanahan wasn't even there. The next, he was but did nothing?

I've only spoken to Plummer twice, and most recently was 3 years ago. Doubt we'll talk again anytime soon

[SBXVII]

I know "both" QB's suck, it's hard to believe Rex is better then Beck. But as bad as Rex is I have to mention that again I don't think the INT's were all Rex's fault. The first one Hankerson fell down on his route, the second one I watched #10 WR run a slant route right into the LB. Why? I don't know. But instead of taking his route to the inside of the LB he stopped and started running behind the LB/post route looking for an open section of field.

I totally agree Rex should have seen the LB atleast from my perspective but perhaps not from Rex's. Again I don't want it to sound like I'm dismissing Rex's short comings but I couldn't help but think the WR failed to run the right route.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by SBXVII

I know "both" QB's suck, it's hard to believe Rex is better then Beck. But as bad as Rex is I have to mention that again I don't think the INT's were all Rex's fault. The first one Hankerson fell down on his route, the second one I watched #10 WR run a slant route right into the LB. Why? I don't know. But instead of taking his route to the inside of the LB he stopped and started running behind the LB/post route looking for an open section of field.

I totally agree Rex should have seen the LB atleast from my perspective but perhaps not from Rex's. Again I don't want it to sound like I'm dismissing Rex's short comings but I couldn't help but think the WR failed to run the right route.

I guess now it is a moot point, but with the way that Hank was going up in the air and attacking the ball, I don't know why they didn't throw a fade into the endzone and let Hank outjump the CBs. We could technically do the same with Davis, but he just doesn't attack the ball enough to beat the DBs.

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Jim Schwartz.

Schwartz. Let's see... This is his third year with the Lions. He's also had the benefit of the #1 overall pick in '09 with Stafford and the #2 overall pick with Suh. Plus he inherited one of the best wideouts in the game with Calvin Johnson. His front office has also set him up nicely -- This year, they were able to collect two second round picks, a pair of 1st rounders in 2009, and another pair of 1st rounders 2010. So he's had much more to work with in Detroit.

Not only that, Schwartz has now lost 3 of his last 4. So no, I stand by my statement that there's not a coach out there who'd be doing any better with what we have.

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

Schwartz. Let's see... This is his third year with the Lions. He's also had the benefit of the #1 overall pick in '09 with Stafford and the #2 overall pick with Suh. Plus he inherited one of the best wideouts in the game with Calvin Johnson. His front office has also set him up nicely -- This year, they were able to collect two second round picks, a pair of 1st rounders in 2009, and another pair of 1st rounders 2010. So he's had much more to work with in Detroit.

Not only that, Schwartz has now lost 3 of his last 4. So no, I stand by my statement that there's not a coach out there who'd be doing any better with what we have.

Well, Schwartz inherited a team that was a punch-line not just in the NFL, but in all sports nationwide in general. They had been decimated by years of Matt Millen's stewardship. He's been there 2+ seasons, and they've really turned it around in that time. Plus Matt Stafford was hurt for a large chunk of his time as HC.

I'm not ready to bail on Shanny just yet, but I will be if next year at this time the Skins are not leaps and bounds ahead of the hot garbage we're currently witnessing.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

Schwartz. Let's see... This is his third year with the Lions. He's also had the benefit of the #1 overall pick in '09 with Stafford and the #2 overall pick with Suh. Plus he inherited one of the best wideouts in the game with Calvin Johnson. His front office has also set him up nicely -- This year, they were able to collect two second round picks, a pair of 1st rounders in 2009, and another pair of 1st rounders 2010. So he's had much more to work with in Detroit.

Not only that, Schwartz has now lost 3 of his last 4. So no, I stand by my statement that there's not a coach out there who'd be doing any better with what we have.

This is a textbook exercise in excuse making.

When the Lions were 2-10 last year, I don't think a whole lot of people thought that the Lions weren't on the right track. I think Schwartz was starting to get some heat for short term results, but people knew the team was better and they knew that even with the QB out, the Lions were still making positive strides week to week.

I don't know if the Lions are going to make the playoffs in year three, but they already have results. Mike Shanahan has accomplished nothing here in a year and a half. And the idea that Detroit was in better shape three years ago than the Redskins were two years ago is just not accurate.

I think most NFL coaches would be doing a better job here. When you consider just how far the Redskins have fallen short of expectations, I think that's pretty difficult to argue against.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by GMScud

I'm not ready to bail on Shanny just yet, but I will be if next year at this time the Skins are not leaps and bounds ahead of the hot garbage we're currently witnessing.

I think the only difference between you and I is that I think the 2012 draft is too critical to leave to an administration that is just going to get whacked at midseason next year for lack of results. If a change is needed, we should make it with the intention of getting the right people in here to draft the next QB. I can't justify letting the Shanahan's pick a quarterback in the first round in a desperate attempt to salvage the mess they created.

[SirClintonPortis]

We are not showing improvement because Mike Shanahan did not fully commit himself to rebuilding the roster. Detroit made that commitment the year . He made a gross miscalcuations with the roster in 2010 and essentially wasted a year. But I am willing to give him a mulligan since he at least didn't mortgage away high draft picks this offseason and the players he picked have shown promise.

[GTripp0012]

Crowdsourcing:

Let's say the Redskins keep the status quo and draft a quarterback in the first round in 2012. That is the only starter that comes out of the draft. We can add a reasonably priced class of free agents.

How many wins do the Redskins improve over this year's 4 or 5 win effort?

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I think the only difference between you and I is that I think the 2012 draft is too critical to leave to an administration that is just going to get whacked at midseason next year for lack of results. If a change is needed, we should make it with the intention of getting the right people in here to draft the next QB. I can't justify letting the Shanahan's pick a quarterback in the first round in a desperate attempt to salvage the mess they created.

I don't think Shanny has done a poor job with the draft selections he's made. Kerrigan, Jenkins, and Hankerson all seem like they'll be good players in this league. Perry Riley looks good, too. And Maurice Hurt is able to crack the lineup despite being a 7th rounder. He's brought in some decent talent.

However, I think his decisions at the QB position have been nothing short of disastrous, and he should bear the full blame. Also, with regard to the QB position and the draft, I think the net negative of both not selecting a QB (not even a developmental later round pick) and trading high picks for McNabb is a terrible gaffe.

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Crowdsourcing:

Let's say the Redskins keep the status quo and draft a quarterback in the first round in 2012. That is the only starter that comes out of the draft. We can add a reasonably priced class of free agents.

How many wins do the Redskins improve over this year's 4 or 5 win effort?

There are so many "ifs" in that question/scenario. IF we stay relatively healthy (unlike 2011), IF some of our other draft picks in the 2012 draft (we have plenty) contribute, and IF that rookie QB can come in as a starter and immediately play decent, then we could certainly sniff the 8 or 9 win mark, maybe more.

It's all about the quarterback.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by GMScud

I don't think Shanny has done a poor job with the draft selections he's made. Kerrigan, Jenkins, and Hankerson all seem like they'll be good players in this league. Perry Riley looks good, too. And Maurice Hurt is able to crack the lineup despite being a 7th rounder. He's brought in some decent talent.

However, I think his decisions at the QB position have been nothing short of disastrous, and he should bear the full blame. Also, with regard to the QB position and the draft, I think the net negative of both not selecting a QB (not even a developmental later round pick) and trading high picks for McNabb is a terrible gaffe.

I have no problem with the drafting they've done. In spite of that, I don't think it makes sense to let them pick a quarterback if 90% of that QB's career will be determined by a different coaching staff. It is so very hard to envision a scenario where Mike Shanahan is both the head coach of the Redskins through 2015 and a successful one.

Under normal circumstances, I don't think it's a good idea to bail on a coach after two years, but why let a lame duck coach draft a quarterback? If it wasn't before, it's now clear that Mike Shanahan isn't going to build a great team here. I'm just trying to figure out what everyone elses expectations for 2012 are that makes doing this dance again worth doing. The idea that we'll have a second year quarterback heading into 2013 while trying to find a head coach is horrifying enough. Knowing that Mike Shanahan just may pick that QB doesn't make it any easier to swallow.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by GMScud

There are so many "ifs" in that question/scenario. IF we stay relatively healthy (unlike 2011), IF some of our other draft picks in the 2012 draft (we have plenty) contribute, and IF that rookie QB can come in as a starter and immediately play decent, then we could certainly sniff the 8 or 9 win mark, maybe more.

It's all about the quarterback.

I don't want the if's, I just want an expectation. Like for example, if we're going to draft the right QB next year, are fans expecting us to be in the playoffs next year?

Maybe, maybe not? I just wanted that kind of opinion. 8 or 9 wins seems reasonable enough, but we're so very far from that level right now, I just don't know what kind of improvement we're expecting.

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I have no problem with the drafting they've done. In spite of that, I don't think it makes sense to let them pick a quarterback if 90% of that QB's career will be determined by a different coaching staff. It is so very hard to envision a scenario where Mike Shanahan is both the head coach of the Redskins through 2015 and a successful one.

Under normal circumstances, I don't think it's a good idea to bail on a coach after two years, but why let a lame duck coach draft a quarterback? If it wasn't before, it's now clear that Mike Shanahan isn't going to build a great team here. I'm just trying to figure out what everyone elses expectations for 2012 are that makes doing this dance again worth doing. The idea that we'll have a second year quarterback heading into 2013 while trying to find a head coach is horrifying enough. Knowing that Mike Shanahan just may pick that QB doesn't make it any easier to swallow.

What you're saying makes sense, if we're conceding that no one on the current staff (at least offensively) will be running this team in 2013, 14, or 15. What if the powers that be know Mike may not be here in a few years, but Kyle will be? Not saying you or I agree with that, but that could be the thinking.

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I don't want the if's, I just want an expectation. Like for example, if we're going to draft the right QB next year, are fans expecting us to be in the playoffs next year?

Maybe, maybe not? I just wanted that kind of opinion. 8 or 9 wins seems reasonable enough, but we're so very far from that level right now, I just don't know what kind of improvement we're expecting.

Given the improvement of the defense this year when compared to last year, you'd think they'll get even better next season. Given that, if we draft the right QB next year, I think playoffs are a reasonable expectation. We've seen it enough times now in the NFL- rookie QBs can succeed (even with a lockout for pete's sake).

Injuries are a big IF though. If that rookie QB is playing well and then loses his best RB, starting TE (who is a great run blocker), best WR, and 3/5 of his offensive line, are the playoffs a reasonable expectation? Not as much...